Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Pen Rua wrote: »

FWIW, Cllr Des Cahill will be lobbying Eamon Ryan for immediate funding & installation of lighting for The Marina.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Temporary-lights-to-be-requested-for-the-Marina-4171fa4b-4503-40db-8053-c1ea6627285c-ds?fbclid=IwAR13i0qhXeGQ2Rr7IgfGrtnIp3djCN1rJRBy8pdXCkFocWi2y_ekRVAr5ss

I'm nearly certain I read a similar article on FB this morning suggesting Cllr Cahill will also lobby for lighting in Fitzgerald's Park & other parks/amenities in the city.

Great that the campaign for lighting only kicks up a gear after the clocks have already gone back.

Cork Lass wrote: »

I actually think you are trolling now, just provoking people for fun or maybe you’re just bored. I’ll continue to blame the reckless idiots as they are the problem and the spreaders of this disease. Not one of my family has had COVID or even been a close contact (because we are complying) so we must be doing something right.

And I continue to blame the house party set too. That’s why I called them reckless idiots. But they are not solely to blame, and the scientific data supports that. Most responsible people have broken the rules to a greater or lesser extent at some point.

In Dunnes yesterday, I saw maybe 8-10 people of all ages not wearing their masks properly. Every single one of them is contributing to the problem. A well known sports club close to me had underage training on Saturday and a lot of kids got lifts with friends from other households. Again, all those parents are contributing to the problem

As I say, it is too easy to blame only the truly reckless for the problem and ignore the contribution from the rest of us. Very, very few of us are entirely compliant and every non-compliance, no matter how minor, carries risk. I’m genuinely sorry if that offends people but that is my sincere belief. I’ve been on boards a long time and this is the first time I’ve been accused of trolling.

the beer revolu

Yesterday, I was in a bit of a world of my own and went into Lidl without a mask on and walked around the shop for about 5 minutes with no mask before I woke up and realised.
No one said a word to me. A security guard held me at the top of the stairs and waved me on when the numbers allowed. Why didn't he point out that I had no mask on? I wish security staff in shops would challenge people for not wearing masks.
This "breathing difficulties" is mostly complete bullshlt. I know people with asthma and emphysema who wear masks no problem. No one likes wearing a mask - get over yourselves and wear a mask!!

PreCocious

Pen Rua wrote: »

FWIW, Cllr Des Cahill will be lobbying Eamon Ryan for immediate funding & installation of lighting for The Marina.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Temporary-lights-to-be-requested-for-the-Marina-4171fa4b-4503-40db-8053-c1ea6627285c-ds?fbclid=IwAR13i0qhXeGQ2Rr7IgfGrtnIp3djCN1rJRBy8pdXCkFocWi2y_ekRVAr5ss

I'm nearly certain I read a similar article on FB this morning suggesting Cllr Cahill will also lobby for lighting in Fitzgerald's Park & other parks/amenities in the city.

The good councillor would be better off lobbying his buddies in the GAA who received planning permission for Pairc ui Chaoimh with one of the conditions being that they pay towards illuminating the Marina.

Like many of the conditions attached to the development it was ignored and the local taxpayer will end up footing the bill.

Pen Rua

Pen Rua wrote: »

The Banks of the River Lee Walk (at the top of North Mall, before going up the hill to Sunday's Well) closes at 6pm in October and (I think) closes at 5pm from November.

There's no place near us (Sunday's Well) to take a pleasant walk in the evenings now. During Lockdown 1, we would walk the Banks of the River Lee Walk, then up to the Mardyke Areana, Lee Fields and back.

Now, the only have decent route is to go around by the Pres school and back round via Sunday's Well Road. During the height of winter (dark), I'm not keen on walking along Sunday's Well Road...

Is there anyone to contact about potentially extending opening hours during Lockdown 2?

FWIW, Cllr Des Cahill will be lobbying Eamon Ryan for immediate funding & installation of lighting for The Marina.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Temporary-lights-to-be-requested-for-the-Marina-4171fa4b-4503-40db-8053-c1ea6627285c-ds?fbclid=IwAR13i0qhXeGQ2Rr7IgfGrtnIp3djCN1rJRBy8pdXCkFocWi2y_ekRVAr5ss

I'm nearly certain I read a similar article on FB this morning suggesting Cllr Cahill will also lobby for lighting in Fitzgerald's Park & other parks/amenities in the city.

Cork Lass

cantalach wrote: »

It’s very convenient to blame the reckless idiots who go to house parties. It’s not so convenient to blame our family member who just gets a bit sloppy sometimes and forgets.

I actually think you are trolling now, just provoking people for fun or maybe you’re just bored. I’ll continue to blame the reckless idiots as they are the problem and the spreaders of this disease. Not one of my family has had COVID or even been a close contact (because we are complying) so we must be doing something right.

cantalach wrote: »

Odd that you have such low expectations of people when, within the last page or so, you have thanked posts by people claiming that the vast majority of people have complied with the rules. Is boredom and lockdown fatigue really going to turn all those impeccable saints into rebellious devils?

I think up till now the vast majority of people have complied and done their bit. I don’t think that’s the case any longer.
I think a lot of the people who followed the restrictions to the letter last time round are making exceptions for themselves this time around, and more will do so if this lockdown continues into 2021 as expected.

I can’t see anyone ‘staying at home’ and avoiding their friends and family over the Christmas season after the sh*tshow 2020 has been, whether the government permits it or not.
I stand by my theory that if they keep restaurants and bars closed indefinitely people will just meet up privately at home, they won’t forego seeing their friends/family for an undetermined length of time again.

SusieBlue wrote: »

Close the pubs/restaurants and they’ll just have dinner/coffee at each other’s houses instead, which is far riskier and a less controlled environment.
If lockdown round 2 has shown us anything so far it’s that people won’t forego spending time with family and friends indefinitely.
There will be far more people having little dinner parties and coffee mornings if they don’t allow indoor dining, it won’t stop people, it will just make them sneakier and more creative. Transmission will still occur, it will just be in private homes rather than businesses.

Odd that you have such low expectations of people when, within the last page or so, you have thanked posts by people claiming that the vast majority of people have complied with the rules. Is boredom and lockdown fatigue really going to turn all those impeccable saints into rebellious devils?

Cork Lass wrote: »

You’re being way too harsh here. The majority of people complied, if not 100% then close enough for it not to matter.

Your response perfectly underscores my point. You think it doesn’t matter when the data and the expert interpretation of that data shows us that it does matter. It all matters to a greater or lesser extent. It’s very convenient to blame the reckless idiots who go to house parties. It’s not so convenient to blame our family member who just gets a bit sloppy sometimes and forgets.

Ludo

This thread was interesting as it was Cork related. Now unfortunately, it may as well be in the main covid forum as it has just degenerated into a general discussion on the merits, or lack thereof, of government measures. Let's get back to Cork related issues please.

I'm not arguing what the right thing to do is, just saying they account for a concerning amount of cases.

TheChizler wrote: »

Bars and restaurants accounted for 27% of cases at their height IIRC, must see if I can find the stat. Think about it, you go for dinner with your friends, you're put sitting next to each other for 90 minutes no mask. Pretty much guaranteed transmission if one person has it.

Close the pubs/restaurants and they’ll just have dinner/coffee at each other’s houses instead, which is far riskier and a less controlled environment.
If lockdown round 2 has shown us anything so far it’s that people won’t forego spending time with family and friends indefinitely.
There will be far more people having little dinner parties and coffee mornings if they don’t allow indoor dining, it won’t stop people, it will just make them sneakier and more creative. Transmission will still occur, it will just be in private homes rather than businesses.

The only difference is with the pubs/restaurants closed or operating at a reduced capacity, there’s thousands of more people unemployed and out of work.

Bars and restaurants accounted for 27% of cases at their height IIRC, must see if I can find the stat. Think about it, you go for dinner with your friends, you're put sitting next to each other for 90 minutes no mask. Pretty much guaranteed transmission if one person has it.

Edit: not quite the same but found this. Not sure if they all occurred in restaurants or were subsequent infections elsewhere. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/covid-19-seventy-cases-in-cork-traced-to-local-pubs-and-restaurants-in-recent-weeks-1.4366678

I really don’t think that’s fair though, when there has been hardly any clusters or outbreaks leading back to indoor bars and restaurants.
They aren’t the problem and never were the problem, not that it would stop the government from blaming them (I get the point that you’re making though).

I find it very frustrating that the industries/settings with the most outbreaks were meat factories, nursing homes, and direct provision centres, none of which was the fault or responsibility of the general public, and yet the government made little to no effort to get them under control at all.
Instead they threw everything but the kitchen sink at industries such as the pub trade, restaurants, shops, gyms and hairdressers, who were made scapegoats for the mismanagement and ineptitude of the government.

If I was the owner of a business that has been forced to close because of the restrictions I would be absolutely furious right now.
They invested thousands of euro they didn’t have to reopen safely and they’ve barely been given a chance to financially recover before being closed again.
Meanwhile the disgraceful mismanagement of nursing homes gets conveniently swept under the carpet while we’re all told ‘we aren’t where we need to be yet’ and ‘we’re all in this together’.
It’s just getting old now, being honest.
We clearly aren’t in this together. Some are suffering and sacrificing a lot more than others, and have a lot more to lose the longer these rolling lockdowns continue. There has to be a balance of interests and people are finally starting to realise that.

I don't think indoor bars and restaurants have a future in a stable living with covid scenario, unless major steps are taken to seat people from different households far enough apart.

To be fair I think if any clusters had come out of College Road during the summer we would have heard about it, the media were only dying for such a story to come about.

So while I do think that the upsurge in cases is from people mingling and mixing more with friends and family and different households (which no amount of closing shops/restaurants/hairdressers will help), I don’t think it’s necessarily because of parties.

I posted on another thread earlier that the difference between this weekend and the first weekend of the March lockdown was worlds apart.
I saw groups of all ages out everywhere, out walking together, standing outside coffee shops, and sitting on the bollards on Patrick St eating with friends/family.
There is no way all those groups of people are from the one household because during the first lockdown town was all but deserted and when I saw people out walking they were pretty much always alone.

The truth of the matter is that attitudes have changed, and while people are willing to give up a lot, they aren’t willing to do total isolation this time around.
And no amount of level 5 is going to change that. If the public buy in isn’t there (which it isn’t), we’re only wasting our time with this.
They need to change tactics, and fast, because the frustration and tension is only growing by the day.

If the government won’t acknowledge that now, they’ll have no choice in a few weeks time when this whole thing explodes when people realise they aren’t getting a semi normal Christmas they were all but promised for all their sacrifices.
The whole point of this fruitless exercise was to ‘save’ Christmas and when the public realise that at best we’ll be back to level 3.5 restrictions, there will be ructions.

Augeo wrote: »

It's the house parties & stuff like that is the problem.... Level 3 was working even with all those pr1cks.

Were there any stats to say what proportion of cases were due to house parties? I heard that something like 30% happened in household settings but that could just be people living together spreading to each other. House parties, while obviously a really bad idea, might just be a bogieman.

Cork Lass

cantalach wrote: »

They didn't, and you know they didn't.

Did 99% of people never make even one unnecessary trip to the shops?

Did 99% of people always wash their hands on retuning home?

Did 99% of people never visit somebody in their garden and end up in the house?

Did 99% of people never choose to remain in a group of people that was uncomfortably close together?

If you're going to use words like "exactly" then you have to be exact. Nobody with hand on heart could claim 99% of the population adhered perfectly.

You’re being way too harsh here. The majority of people complied, if not 100% then close enough for it not to matter. The problem is those who blatantly do not comply any of the time. House parties were a major contributor and these were driven by the closure of pubs and restaurants. No one pulled up for it either. Our government is as weak as p1sswater when it comes to tackling these issues.

[Deleted User]

cantalach wrote: »

They didn't, and you know they didn't.

Did 99% of people never make even one unnecessary trip to the shops?

Did 99% of people always wash their hands on retuning home?

Did 99% of people never visit somebody in their garden and end up in the house?

Did 99% of people never choose to remain in a group of people that was uncomfortably close together?

If you're going to use words like "exactly" then you have to be exact. Nobody with hand on heart could claim 99% of the population adhered perfectly.

It's the house parties & stuff like that is the problem.... Level 3 was working even with all those pr1cks.

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I usually don't wade into these arguments and stay out of it, but most of the modelling that is used I THINK uses 2 standard deviations.

It assumes 95% of people do (or don't) do such a thing 95% of the time.

Standard deviations tell you about the variance in a measurement, you might be thinking of confidence intervals where its common to say you have a 95% confidence that the true value lies within a range of measurements? But neither necessarily mean that 95% of people do a thing.

Chris_5339762

I usually don't wade into these arguments and stay out of it, but most of the modelling that is used I THINK uses 2 standard deviations.

It assumes 95% of people do (or don't) do such a thing 95% of the time.

CorkRed93 wrote: »

Staggering post. 99% of people did exactly what was asked of them [...]

They didn't, and you know they didn't.

Did 99% of people never make even one unnecessary trip to the shops?

Did 99% of people always wash their hands on retuning home?

Did 99% of people never visit somebody in their garden and end up in the house?

Did 99% of people never choose to remain in a group of people that was uncomfortably close together?

If you're going to use words like "exactly" then you have to be exact. Nobody with hand on heart could claim 99% of the population adhered perfectly.