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Electrical Heating

Neilw

Hi all,

Are there any energy efficient electric heaters available?

I’ve seen all sorts of wall mounted radiator type heaters but I don’t want to buy something that ends up either costing a fortune or gives out poor heat.

I’m heating a 5m x 8m room, it’s an insulated mezzanine floor in a workshop.

Thanks.

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ercork

autumnalcore wrote: »

You can get diy install spit heat pumps where the lines are push fit and pre evacuated. Loads of chinese ****e out there but Sanyo units come up fairly regularly for about €700 delivered on a pallet from UK on ebay.

That's true. Just bear in mind that you have to get the thing commissioned by somebody certified in handling the gas that is contained in the heat pump. Usually this means somebody who works in refrigeration - a regular plumber or handyman would not be certified to do this.

ercork

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

WBS = wood burning stove.

Burning wood (or any solid fuel) creates nasty airborne particles which are bad for the health of the people in the room and also the people in the wider neighbourhood. I'd avoid if at all possible. That said, a stove is miles better than an open fire.

John.G

phormium wrote: »

I'd agree with above, oil filled plug in radiator is very efficient for an electric heater and gives good heat, I have one in my kitchen all winter when the central heating is not on during the day, only pulled it out of it's storage spot few days ago as the days have got colder.

When I'm working at the table and it's really cold I slide it in under the table, once my legs are warm I'm fine

I have one for years but only use it very occasionally in a attic bedroom if some guests are staying, I took a few readings off the rad a good few years ago and came across them very recently.

The rad has air sensing thermostatic control but also cuts out/in on the oil temperature (safety) stat if set to its highest setting continuously on its 2000w setting.

Temp stat turned to max. (3 settings)
Rated Output: 800W. Measured Output: 800W. Rad surface temp: 72C
Rated Output: 1200W. Measured Output: 1200W Rad surface temp: 96c
Rated output:: 2000W. Measured Output: 1500W. Rad surface temp: 110C

[Deleted User]

I've a burning anything vendetta. Baby steps, one has to be realistic at the same time. I'm trounching small engines atm.
That includes people burning things on my behalf. eg. "recyclers" specifically waste incineration steam turbine electric generators and a whole host of dirty Irish power derived import.

Edit..I suppose hydrogen is alright...and other things that don't reduce life/air quality.

bazman

I’ve a 55m2 area and I’m looking for recommendations on an effective electric heating system. I’ve read about infrared panels, infrared underfloor, storage, panel radiators etc. All the info sources appear to have an element of bias. The area will be well insulated.

Would anyone have recommendations?

Tuco88

I'm a bit backwards on this. I have two solid fuel stoves in the house, one with a back boiler. Ive access to woodland, personally I couldn't ever see the stove going, I can't explain the connection to a fire. I am all for greener the better, Next car will hopefully be electric in a few years yet tho.

Id like to get solar panels soon and looking forward to it tbh.

I am not sure whats the best green/efficient heating option of a 1950s built house atm. Its still Oil/Gas atm still I think. If a fella was to go for one what would you recommend?

alan4cult

What do you mean effective, as in cheap?
Have you a night rate meter?
Any electric heating is going to be expensive so storage is going to win if you can use the night rate.

[Deleted User]

Me? No clue....I'm as green as you are on the subject! :pac:

Heat exchangers. Passive input and insulation would be my bias.

Tuco88 wrote: »

I can't explain the connection to a fire.

Me neither it's a massive bloomin' hole in the building that weighs 5 ton. I doubt ours will ever return a quarter of what it loses.

Kaybaykwah

ercork wrote: »

If the insulation and airtightness are brought to a good level then a heat pump would be a really good option.

Air to water are the most common for heating and hot water but are fairly expensive to install. It's also quite a big job, requiring the installation of pipes, rads, underfloor heating, etc.

Air to air are much cheaper and easier to install and could be a good option depending on the internal layout of the house. They don't do hot water but if, as the previous post says, the immersion heater is used during off peak times, this is a decent option for hot water.

Agreed. I live in Canada, and my house has been rehabbed in parts for insulation and in particular, airtightness. It was built around 1910. Our heating is in 3 phases with heat pump for cold, then electric boiler for colder and heating oil for coldest weather. I do however plan to nix the oil furnace and huge reservoir to rid myself of the carbon based and gain space in the basement. Hydro power is relatively cheap where we live. We have only been here since december 2018 and I have found that the heat pump has been a really valuable element in energy savings. It also provides air conditioning in our hot summers. The oil and electric boiler heats water rads in colder temps.

I would encourage looking at heat pumps because they are increasing efficiency at colder temps.

bazman

Thanks for replying. I mean between the various options out there is there one someone would recommend after installing. As examples, underfloor vs panels? Infrared vs convection vs storage? Are there any specific products that people would recommend?

I don’t currently have night saver electricity.

ercork

Tuco88 wrote: »

I'm a bit backwards on this. I have two solid fuel stoves in the house, one with a back boiler. Ive access to woodland, personally I couldn't ever see the stove going, I can't explain the connection to a fire. I am all for greener the better, Next car will hopefully be electric in a few years yet tho.

Id like to get solar panels soon and looking forward to it tbh.

I am not sure whats the best green/efficient heating option of a 1950s built house atm. Its still Oil/Gas atm still I think. If a fella was to go for one what would you recommend?

It's hard to say. It would vary from house to house I would imagine. If the wood supply is sustainable then it is very good from a climate change point of view but not so good from an air quality/health point of view as mentioned above. Gas, on the other hand, produces carbon dioxide which impacts climate but is very good from an air quality standpoint.

The best thing to do as a first step is to reduce the amount of heat that you need by improving the insulation and airtightness of your property. This can involve expensive jobs like new windows, external cladding, etc. But a lot can be done with very cheap fixes too - making sure the window and door seals are in good condition to reduce draughtiness, sealing holes under the skirting boards that allow cold air in, etc. Not very glamourous fixes but they do help!

JimToken

Which are the best insulated models now to store the heat for later,?

I don't think there's any other real benefit to the newer models

2011

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

That includes people burning things on my behalf. eg. "recyclers" specifically waste incineration steam turbine electric generators and a whole host of dirty Irish power derived import.

Out of interest, what is the alternative you would prefer for waste that can not be recycled?

[Deleted User]

Less waste. Biodegradable packing. Ooh wait...covid....more plastics...humans :rolleyes:

Muahahaha

Tuco88 wrote: »

I'm a bit backwards on this. I have two solid fuel stoves in the house, one with a back boiler. Ive access to woodland, personally I couldn't ever see the stove going, I can't explain the connection to a fire. I am all for greener the better, Next car will hopefully be electric in a few years yet tho.

My main heating is electric (A2A heat pump) but I get you on the connection to the fire, Id light the wood burning stove about twice a week at the weekends and sometimes I spend more time staring at the logs burning than I do at the tv. Theres something about staring at fire that is almost hypnotising.

JackieChang

What's everybody's opinion on these aluminium radiators? Do you think they'd be as expensive to run as a regular electric convector?

https://www.credaheating.co.uk/product/car-aluminium-radiator

Apartment is pretty well insulated I think. BER is B something, can't remember exactly. B2 or B3. I'm renting.

Just need to ask the landlord to replace an ancient piece of crap in the living room and wanted to do a bit of research first.

We have a night rate. However don't think these aluminium heaters can take advantage of that as they don't store heat.

JimToken

JackieChang wrote: »

What's everybody's opinion on these aluminium radiators? Do you think they'd be as expensive to run as a regular electric convector?

https://www.credaheating.co.uk/product/car-aluminium-radiator

Apartment is pretty well insulated I think. BER is B something, can't remember exactly. B2 or B3. I'm renting.

Just need to ask the landlord to replace an ancient piece of crap in the living room and wanted to do a bit of research first.

We have a night rate. However don't think these aluminium heaters can take advantage of that as they don't store heat.

Notice the wording in the link:

Efficient energy usage

Not energy efficient usage

JackieChang

JimToken wrote: »

Notice the wording in the link:

Efficient energy usage

Not energy efficient usage

I need help to solve this riddle

So it's not a good choice?

There's no gas line in the house, all electric. What other options do I have? Any recommendations?

2011

JackieChang wrote: »

I need help to solve this riddle So it's not a good choice?

There's no gas line in the house, all electric. What other options do I have? Any recommendations?

Heat pumps are the future.
When properly installed they provide a cost effective solution. These use a refrigerant to extract heat from air or water as such they are not “electrical heaters”.

Electrical heaters are best avoided.
The fact that the heaters themselves are highly efficient is a moot point as they cost a fortune to run.

Padre_Pio

JackieChang wrote: »

I need help to solve this riddle So it's not a good choice?

There's no gas line in the house, all electric. What other options do I have? Any recommendations?

The same question has been answered ten times.

They're all pretty much the same energy efficiency. The cheapest two bar heater to the most complex, expensive oil filled heater. Power goes in, heat comes out. There's nowhere else for the power to go (except powering the controller and lights) Electricity is just expensive compared to gas or wood.

This one's gimmick it's smart enough to turn off when it thinks it's not needed. Thus "saving" energy.

Night rate heaters convert cheaper electricity to heat which is stored in a thermal mass, bricks or oil.

Calahonda52

2011 wrote: »

Heat pumps are the future.
When properly installed * they provide a cost effective solution. These use a refrigerant to extract heat from air or water as such they are not “electrical heaters”.

Electrical heaters are best avoided.
The fact that the heaters themselves are highly efficient is a moot point as they cost a fortune to run.

* in an airtight and well insulated house, not just a well insulated house:)

3d4life

+1 for A2A. Did I see that Mr Chang is renting ? If so then probably a non runner.

2011 wrote: »

....
Electrical heaters are best avoided.
The fact that the heaters themselves are highly efficient is a moot point as they cost a fortune to run.

Thats true, but probably slightly less of a fortune than using LPG :eek:

( at least thats what I concluded when I did the maths a couple of years ago )

JackieChang

Calahonda52 wrote: »

* in an airtight house

I thought airtight would be bad for mould? Doesn't there need to be some airflow somewhere? Or does that heat pump thing sort it out?

ercork

JackieChang wrote: »

I thought airtight would be bad for mould? Doesn't there need to be some airflow somewhere? Or does that heat pump thing sort it out?

It's a question of how much airflow. One wall vent in each room should be enough to prevent any mould. Additional "unplanned vents" like leaky windows, gaps between skirting board and floor, etc should be addressed.

Padre_Pio

JackieChang wrote: »

I thought airtight would be bad for mould? Doesn't there need to be some airflow somewhere? Or does that heat pump thing sort it out?

Air is a really good insulator, but only when it can't move. Problem is when air escapes with draughts and all your heat goes with it.
You can have triple glazing, but if it's poorly fitted it's useless.

POBox19

JackieChang wrote: »

What's everybody's opinion on these aluminium radiators? Do you think they'd be as expensive to run as a regular electric convector?

https://www.credaheating.co.uk/product/car-aluminium-radiator

A very fancy oil filled rad. It should be more comfortable than an electric convector heater, but the running cost would probably be the same. I'd say the same about any oil filled rad, even one costing €50.

freshpopcorn

I’m not sure if I’m posting in the correct forum.
We’re on the look out for a electric heater that fairly economical and easy to move around.
Any recommendation?

coylemj

'Economical' doesn't apply in the case of electric heating, its the most expensive way to heat a room. When checking specs. of various units, ignore any claims that refer to efficiency because every watt you pump into an electric heater comes out as heat i.e. every electric heater is 100% efficient.

Easiest to move around would probably be a fan heater. Less easy to move (especially when it's hot!) would be an oil-filled radiator.

Cerco

Many of the oil filled radiators have castors fitted and some with remote controls.

Have a look at the Dimplex range.

JackieChang

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I’m not sure if I’m posting in the correct forum.
We’re on the look out for a electric heater that fairly economical and easy to move around.
Any recommendation?

Liddle's have oil filled rads at the moment. Electric radiators are all as efficient as each other. The only difference is how quickly it heats up the room and how the heat feels.