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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

Ten of Swords

Part 1 here

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Threadbans Thread 2

Hqrry113

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Suckit

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

What statistic did I make up? That the PIRA murdered more Catholics than any other bunch of angry arseholes during the troubles?

WESLEY JOHNSTON TABLE

The Provos weren't sectarian of course.

As mentioned above in the previous post, but also..

Who the fcuk is Wesley Johnston?
Those statistics vary greatly from any of the figures I have read in any publication.

JohnnyFlash

Suckit wrote: »

As mentioned above in the previous post, but also..

Who the fcuk is Wesley Johnston?
Those statistics vary greatly from any of the figures I have read in any publication.

https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/sutton/crosstabs.html

Knock yourselves out looking at those figures if you want.

A sitting member of SF in Dáil Éireann is linked to at least 50 of those mindless, senseless, and barbaric atrocities.

a very cool kid

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You guys just put back in the two parties who were in C&S in the last set-up and I remind you of a Brexiteer???

I was right about your naivety expect it doesn't seem to just affect your political thoughts.

Well I didn't put them back in, Marylou's negligence did

Suckit

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/sutton/crosstabs.html

Knock yourselves out looking at those figures if you want.

A sitting member of SF in Dáil Éireann is linked to at least 50 of those mindless, senseless, and barbaric atrocities.

I'm not the one claiming any statistics I am sharing are accurate.
I've read plenty of statistics, including by Prof Liam Kennedy, who also appears on that site, and I haven't read the ones you mentioned.
I have however read statements and quotes that your statistics could have been borne from in the form of 'Chinese whispers'.

Hqrry113

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

What statistic did I make up? That the PIRA murdered more Catholics than any other bunch of angry arseholes during the troubles?

The Provos weren't sectarian of course.

Ahh I see you were separating all the different loyalist/mi5 groups, figures are very misleading as well, many of the Catholics killed are IRA members shot as informers, about a hundred ira members blown up by their own bombs etc.

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

Because the British Security forces and loyalist paramilitaries weren't proven time and time again to be one and the same, rife with collusion and cooperation?

I'm sure you accidentally made that mistake John, lucky you that you've never known living somewhere where the lad taking your license details at a checkpoint wasn't passing your details on to his pals down the pub that night earmarking you for an OBE (one behind the ear) for no other reason than you were Catholic.

There's been some ridiculous and downright fcuking stupid posts in this thread, but that one takes the biscuit.

Take a bow.

I doubt you have lived anywhere like that either.

Take a bow son, for inventing a chip on your shoulder.

smurgen

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/sutton/crosstabs.html

Knock yourselves out looking at those figures if you want.

A sitting member of SF in Dáil Éireann is linked to at least 50 of those mindless, senseless, and barbaric atrocities.

Like you care about victims lol.

cj maxx

imme wrote: »

They've been doing the same for anyone voting for a Member of Westminster Parliament for the last 35 years.

But of course all SF fans will repeat the mantra that everyone knows that the people they elect for SF to Westminster will never take their seats, they will however take the pay and privileges offices and attendant staffing, che-ching!

Can you get full value from an MP that's never going to vote for anything.

What does that matter. The SF candidate stands of a platform of not sitting in Westminster. Not taking a vow of allegiance to the crown . It’s not a secret agenda and if don’t like it, don’t vote for them. Those that do , do so fully aware or where their vote is going.

McMurphy

blanch152 wrote: »

I doubt you have lived anywhere like that either.

Take a bow son, for inventing a chip on your shoulder.

The uncomfortable truth for you is hundreds of thousands of Catholic men and women have had to endure the potential perils of having their details passed on from security forces to loyalist paramilitaries for decades. That is an undeniable fact - which incidentally I noticed you didn't try and refute, you just went for the low ball personal attack about something you know the square root of fcuk all about, as per.

Whether or not I have lived in the north is none of your business tbh and entirely irrelevant regardless.

JohnnyFlash

smurgen wrote: »

Like you care about victims lol.

Funny enough, I do.

FrancieBrady

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Funny enough, I do.

Funny enough I have never read you once express care for a victim of loyalists and the British Army.

smurgen

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Funny enough I have never read you once express care for a victim of loyalists and the British Army.

In fact he liked a post calling the relatives looking for justice headbangers. Funny that.

McMurphy

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Funny enough, I do.

Funnily enough you tried to segregate the numbers of victims into a religious argument, which by the way if you did care you'd have picked up on the stats of your scorecard that there was over 1000 "Catholics" killed by the combined forces of the various loyalist paramilitaries + state security forces.

JohnnyFlash

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Funny enough I have never read you once express care for a victim of loyalists and the British Army.

Ya, I did. All the time. Page up. All a shower of sociopaths. I despise what the BA did in Norn Iron.

What repulses me as an Irish Republican is having a party who describe themselves as Republicans denigrating the memory of all the people who died under their name.

Bobby Storey was involved in the torture and shooting of a 15 year old child with the mental age of an 8 year old. A Catholic btw, as if that ever mattered.

You lot don't even know what Republicanism means.

Hume did. Currie did. Mallon did.

FrancieBrady

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Ya, I did. All the time. Page up. All a shower of sociopaths. I despise what the BA did in Norn Iron.

What repulses me as an Irish Republican is having a party who describe themselves as Republicans denigrating the memory of all the people who died under their name.

Bobby Storey was involved in the torture and shooting of a 15 year old child with the mental age of an 8 year old. A Catholic btw, as if that ever mattered.

You lot don't even know what Republicanism means.

Hume did. Currie did. Mallon did.

There is only one cohort here who use a select list of victims routinely. I can do the list but that would make me as crass.

Suckit

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Ya, I did. All the time. Page up. All a shower of sociopaths. I despise what the BA did in Norn Iron.

What repulses me as an Irish Republican is having a party who describe themselves as Republicans denigrating the memory of all the people who died under their name.

Bobby Storey was involved in the torture and shooting of a 15 year old child with the mental age of an 8 year old. A Catholic btw, as if that ever mattered.

You lot don't even know what Republicanism means.

Hume did. Currie did. Mallon did.

You are very good at getting statistics from one side.
Catholicism/Protestantism was a simple way to distinguish many, while areas and borders did most of the rest. Neither was in fact the correct way to go about any of it, and many did not stick to those 'rules'. But don't try and make out that their was only one side at it. The British were torturing people well into the 80's backed by their government, the IRA had no such backing.
No mention of the teenagers that were taken from their home and tortured until some went missing and others ended up with the mental age of a 4 year old. (Some still fighting to become a statistic).
I am not mentioning them out of anger, but merely pointing out, that like any spat, argument, battle, war - there was always more than one side involved, all with different agendas, and many with the added intentions of catering for their appearance on a global platform.
The very sentence about what repulses you as a Republican is almost ironic in itself.

maccored

blanch152 wrote: »

I doubt you have lived anywhere like that either.

Take a bow son, for inventing a chip on your shoulder.

are you denying these kinds of things took place?

dundalkfc10

Don't let them women near them documents

Where is Blanch and lads??
Think thhy have took the night off

A disgrace . They will try tell us That Govts is good but this shows that they don't care, and whatever support they had from public will be gone now

As I said a while back, Sinn féin didn't have to do a thing and now they can just sit back and laugh at the Mafia tryna keep it together

Truthvader

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There is only one cohort here who use a select list of victims routinely. I can do the list but that would make me as crass.

There is only one cohort here routinely justifying and promoting anyone involved in 30 years of depravity

FrancieBrady

Truthvader wrote: »

There is only one cohort here routinely justifying and promoting anyone involved in 30 years of depravity

Very few from what I can see. Most people think it was all wrong and never want it to happen again.

But the cohort who have the select list (and it is a tiny select list in the context of what happened) of victims which they trumpet at every turn only want retribution...one sided retribution, as they are also silent when it comes to even handed retribution.

Nobotty

I don't think we should be talking about victms at all,a quarter century after the ceasefire
Its irrelevant

grayzer75

Nobotty wrote: »

I don't think we should be talking about victms at all,a quarter century after the ceasefire
Its irrelevant

I think some sort of truth commission for the families of victims would help but it will only work if all sides participate i.e. republicans, loyalists, British security services, British state and Irish state.

McMurphy

Nobotty wrote: »

I don't think we should be talking about victms at all,a quarter century after the ceasefire
Its irrelevant

There was a thread here quite recently discussing the Glenanne gang, and covering the collusion that took place between the British state, it's security forces and loyalist paramilitaries and their murder of over 130 innocent Catholics.

The documentary the thread was about showed reconstructions of various murders on Catholics which had members of the RUC still in uniform, drive the killers away to safety in police cars.

You will find very few of the same posters in this thread, who are - castigating the provos for "murdering Catholics" in that thread doing likewise because (I guess) there's no political hay to be made from that as it isn't covering their favourite sport "shinner bashing".

They don't care for the victims, be they innocent Catholics, protestants, paramilitaries or members of security forces, they are only interested in point scoring. Simple as that.

FrancieBrady

Nobotty wrote: »

I don't think we should be talking about victms at all,a quarter century after the ceasefire
Its irrelevant

Wrong, completely wrong.

Like the victims of the Mother and Baby Homes, they can never be ignored. The problem is that the two 'governments, given a responsibility in the GFA have completely washed their hands in dealing with legacy and victim issues.

It must come from them, not a single party or player in the conflict/war.

We know why they won't do this, because the fact is one of those governments, in a major way, was a player in the conflict and wants to keep that activity secret. Evidence for that is that every single disclosure has been dragged out of them, kicking and screaming.

mynamejeff

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There is only one cohort here who use a select list of victims routinely. I can do the list but that would make me as crass.

but its such a heroic action by the undefeated army isn't it . it deserves remembering doesn't it

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/apology-from-ira-for-youth-s-murder-welcomed-1.1161994

FrancieBrady

mynamejeff wrote: »

but its such a heroic action by the undefeated army isn't it . it deserves remembering doesn't it

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/apology-from-ira-for-youth-s-murder-welcomed-1.1161994

So you just went to google and found a new victim for the list?

Wow.

Truthvader

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Very few from what I can see. Most people think it was all wrong and never want it to happen again.

But the cohort who have the select list (and it is a tiny select list in the context of what happened) of victims which they trumpet at every turn only want retribution...one sided retribution, as they are also silent when it comes to even handed retribution.

Not true. Sinn Fein made it quite clear at the pretend funeral for the sociopath Bobby Storey that they celebrate and glorify his sad useless life and all the pointless acts of cruelty he was involved with. Plus Sinn Fein remain under the control of the IRA and many of their members and TD's are unrepentant thugs and killers.

No other party is controlled by and peopled by these kinds of people and no other party is celebrating and justifying their wretched part in what you refer to as the "war/conflict". You can complain about it being a "selective list but it is Sinn Fein who are selecting the list.

If the Parachute Regiment or the Shankill Butchers or any other criminal enterprise were seeking votes or controlled by criminals they too would be "selected"

Truthvader

McMurphy wrote: »

There was a thread here quite recently discussing the Glenanne gang, and covering the collusion that took place between the British state, it's security forces and loyalist paramilitaries and their murder of over 130 innocent Catholics.

The documentary the thread was about showed reconstructions of various murders on Catholics which had members of the RUC still in uniform, drive the killers away to safety in police cars.

You will find very few of the same posters in this thread, who are - castigating the provos for "murdering Catholics" in that thread doing likewise because (I guess) there's no political hay to be made from that as it isn't covering their favourite sport "shinner bashing".

They don't care for the victims, be they innocent Catholics, protestants, paramilitaries or members of security forces, they are only interested in point scoring. Simple as that.

The Glenanne gang are not running candidates or glorifying and celebrating their criminality

grayzer75

Truthvader wrote: »

If the Parachute Regiment or the Shankill Butchers or any other criminal enterprise were seeking votes or controlled by criminals they too would be "selected"

Have a wee look at Dee Stitt, Jackie McDonald and the DUP good lad.

FrancieBrady

Truthvader wrote: »

Not true. Sinn Fein made it quite clear at the pretend funeral for the sociopath Bobby Storey that they celebrate and glorify his sad useless life and all the pointless acts of cruelty he was involved with. Plus Sinn Fein remain under the control of the IRA and many of their members and TD's are unrepentant thugs and killers.

No other party is controlled by and peopled by these kinds of people and no other party is celebrating and justifying their wretched part in what you refer to as the "war/conflict". You can complain about it being a "selective list but it is Sinn Fein who are selecting the list.

If the Parachute Regiment or the Shankill Butchers or any other criminal enterprise were seeking votes or controlled by criminals they too would be "selected"

You clearly were not listening to those who eulogised Storey and his contribution to the community after the conflict/war ended. There have been many many players in the conflict/war who have been 'buried' since, up to and including Maggie Thatcher and I have never felt the need to be so hateful about them.
The utter lack of respect for family and those left behind is another feature of this cohort on here.

It wasn't a 'pretend funeral', he was taken to the church and cremated afterwards, like thousands of others. That you didn't know the details of what was to happen is your own fault.

What you are going to have to get over (because it is pointless bile) is that just like FF and FG who rose out of the ashes of a similarly vicious and nasty conflict/war is that SF have as much a democratic mandate as anyone else on this island.