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Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

[Deleted User]

Continued from here
https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057953711/251
All Ireland Senior XV related talk here.

MOD: Bear in mind this thread is starting during the World Cup window and the zero tolerance policy is in force. Trolling will be rewarded with an instant ban. For the duration of the tournament any mention of Zebo in this thread will not be permitted, it is just dragging current Ireland squad talk off topic.

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UAEguy2020

Interested Observer wrote: »

Think the team is fine. I don't really think our tight 5 is great but he's probably picked the best available, we just don't have the personnel there with the injuries, Healy getting on etc. Didn't expect Connors to start at all and Keenan has had some rise. I think Aki is the right call, he's been really good this season. Dunno what POM has to do to get dropped but apparently less than doing nothing in game bar getting sent off, and hopefully JGP gets some meaningful gametime.

The tight 5 is picked to do what Farrell wants it to do, to bring energy around the park. We aren’t best designed to bludgeon teams so it’s better to try beat teams in other ways.

OneLungDavy

wittycynic wrote: »

Keenan doesn't show any indication of being a try scorer, so wing is an odd place to put him.

In my opinion he either starts at fullback or he doesn't start.

And even then I'd have Daly, and maybe even Henshaw, ahead of him at full back for this game, both of whom offer more of a scoring threat.

Why are people pushing for Henshaw at FB again?

sydthebeat

wittycynic wrote: »

Keenan doesn't show any indication of being a try scorer, so wing is an odd place to put him.

In my opinion he either starts at fullback or he doesn't start.

And even then I'd have Daly, and maybe even Henshaw, ahead of him at full back for this game, both of whom offer more of a scoring threat.

On your behalf I'm throwing a tenner on Keenan to score a try on Saturday....

sydthebeat

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

The tight 5 is picked to do what Farrell wants it to do, to bring energy around the park. We aren’t best designed to bludgeon teams so it’s better to try beat teams in other ways.

With the new jackler interpretations the days of holding possession to bludgeon teams are over..... Even tiny wingers and scrum halves are now a jackle threat.

Teams need to be able to play away from contact now to disjoint a defensive line. Offloading out of the tackle and quick hands before contact for continuity is the name of the game, and Ireland have a long way to catch up.

Burkie1203

Dog Botherer wrote: »

but he is our only back row who can only jump. what could go wrong?

Ask RG Snyman

rayd3

Isn’t this what ye have the Leinster thread for? Whinging about O’Mahony.

UAEguy2020

sydthebeat wrote: »

With the new jackler interpretations the days of holding possession to bludgeon teams are over..... Even tiny wingers and scrum halves are now a jackle threat.

Teams need to be able to play away from contact now to disjoint a defensive line. Offloading out of the tackle and quick hands before contact for continuity is the name of the game, and Ireland have a long way to catch up.

Thats exactly it. Ireland definetly have forwards that can offload, Ryan,Beirne,Doris,Connors. Herring,Stander im not so sure, Ryan not so much and Healy is abit up in the air in that regard. The issue has been Schmidt basically bringing in an offload ban similar to how Jones brought in a kicking ban for the Japanese early on in his tenure.

The ban appears to have been lifted under Farrell and it does appear bringing in players who are good around the park was just as important as players who specialise in their position, might take awhile for it to become natural to the players though.

molloyjh

rayd3 wrote: »

Isn’t this what ye have the Leinster thread for? Whinging about O’Mahony.

POMs form has been poor. Its a valid conversation, whether you like it or not. Theres no need to bring provincial BS into this. If you have any valid points to raise then go for it. Otherwise all you're doing is whinging about whinging. What's the point in that?

molloyjh

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

Thats exactly it. Ireland definetly have forwards that can offload, Ryan,Beirne,Doris,Connors. Herring,Stander im not so sure, Ryan not so much and Healy is abit up in the air in that regard. The issue has been Schmidt basically bringing in an offload ban similar to how Jones brought in a kicking ban for the Japanese early on in his tenure.

The ban appears to have been lifted under Farrell and it does appear bringing in players who are good around the park was just as important as players who specialise in their position, might take awhile for it to become natural to the players though.

What ban? There was never a ban on offloads. Where do people get this rubbish.

[Deleted User]

molloyjh wrote: »

POMs form has been poor. Its a valid conversation, whether you like it or not. Theres no need to bring provincial BS into this. If you have any valid points to raise then go for it. Otherwise all you're doing is whinging about whinging. What's the point in that?

It's a bunch of people arguing against nobody to be fair not much point in the pom echo chamber again most people agree

rayd3

molloyjh wrote: »

POMs form has been poor. Its a valid conversation, whether you like it or not. Theres no need to bring provincial BS into this. If you have any valid points to raise then go for it. Otherwise all you're doing is whinging about whinging. What's the point in that?

Ah, the Valid Points police. Good to hear from you

It’s not provincial BS, it’s a valid point, whether you like it or not.

[Deleted User]

UAEguy2020 wrote: »

The tight 5 is picked to do what Farrell wants it to do, to bring energy around the park. We aren’t best designed to bludgeon teams so it’s better to try beat teams in other ways.

It can bring all the energy it wants it still isn't very good.

[Deleted User]

rayd3 wrote: »

Ah, the Valid Points police. Good to hear from you

It’s not provincial BS, it’s a valid point, whether you like it or not.

Not sure you know what "provincial BS" means

sydthebeat

rayd3 wrote: »

Ah, the Valid Points police. Good to hear from you

It’s not provincial BS, it’s a valid point, whether you like it or not.

Slags 'valid point' post by claiming 'valid point'

The ironing is strong with this one

Richie_Rich89

Healy needs a big couple of weeks after the scrum débâcle in the Saracens match. Are his legs gone? I suppose we'll find out against France.

UAEguy2020

Interested Observer wrote: »

It can bring all the energy it wants it still isn't very good.

Herring is meh but the rest of the tight 5 is pretty strong.

jacothelad

sydthebeat wrote: »

Slags 'valid point' post by claiming 'valid point'

The ironing is strong with this one

Well it'll get the wrinkles out....

TomsOnTheRoof

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Luke Fitz was one of the best wingers we've ever had, didn't score many tries. I'd still start him every time

I'm sorry but Fitzgerald was not one of our best ever wingers. Even discounting the likes of Geoghegan you still have Horgan, Bowe and Earls. There's also an argument to be made for having Zebo, Stockdale and Conway ahead of him. He was a good player and an excellent school's player but the idea that he was a once in a generation talent is wide of the mark.

On the selected squad: It's about as good as we could hope for given the injuries. Delighted for Dillane, really hope he can kick on and get back into the fold. As mentioned elsewhere the front five (especially the front row) looks a bit underpowered. Backrow looks good and there's plenty of firepower outside Sexton. Bench is a small bit underwhelming. On form POM doesn't deserve to be there. However he has plenty of credit in the bank and he's being given the opportunity to show whether he still has anything to offer. That's fair enough. Anyway, here's to a good game and us putting up a cricket score.

rayd3

sydthebeat wrote: »

Slags 'valid point' post by claiming 'valid point'

The ironing is strong with this one

Does the steamer on your iron go whoosh?

swiwi_

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Just had a thought.

The anthems are gonna be weird this weekend.

Presumably they wont have Michael D there.

One of the few positives of Covid. Nothing against Michael D but the presidents meet and greet is tiresome.

[Deleted User]

swiwi_ wrote: »

One of the few positives of Covid. Nothing against Michael D but the presidents meet and greet is tiresome.

Always cracked a smile when Michael D and Toner shook hands.

I've no issue with it, feel it adds to the gravitas and intensity of international standard sport.

Richie_Rich89

What Fitzgerald had was an ability to step up and turn in world class performances at the highest level when the chips were down. That's a rare and valuable quality in a player. I thought it was very noticeable in the home loss to the All Blacks in 2008 that Fitzgerald and David Wallace were several levels above all the other Irish players. And then there was the game-breaking performance in the Argentina qf in 2015. He wasn't without his flaws obviously - poor under the high ball at 15 against France in 2011 and didn't score many tries as a winger - but his ability to step up when it mattered set him apart. He probably wasn't used enough at 12 during his career.

AbusesToilets

TomsOnTheRoof wrote: »

I'm sorry but Fitzgerald was not one of our best ever wingers. Even discounting the likes of Geoghegan you still have Horgan, Bowe and Earls. There's also an argument to be made for having Zebo, Stockdale and Conway ahead of him. He was a good player and an excellent school's player but the idea that he was a once in a generation talent is wide of the mark.

On the selected squad: It's about as good as we could hope for given the injuries. Delighted for Dillane, really hope he can kick on and get back into the fold. As mentioned elsewhere the front five (especially the front row) looks a bit underpowered. Backrow looks good and there's plenty of firepower outside Sexton. Bench is a small bit underwhelming. On form POM doesn't deserve to be there. However he has plenty of credit in the bank and he's being given the opportunity to show whether he still has anything to offer. That's fair enough. Anyway, here's to a good game and us putting up a cricket score.

Respectfully disagree about Fitz. For me, I think he was the most talented back I've seen outside of BOD, perhaps more so in certain areas. The fact his career was so injury interrupted is one of the tragedies of Irish Rugby.

POM must go to the same financiers as Trump, not sure how else he'd get credit.

awec

Luke Fitzgerald was a winger who scored 4 tries in 34 matches for Ireland. It's an abysmal record, I'm not sure I buy the argument that he's among the greats.

[Deleted User]

awec wrote: »

Luke Fitzgerald was a winger who scored 4 tries in 34 matches for Ireland. It's an abysmal record, I'm not sure I buy the argument that he's among the greats.

Lions starter at 21 says it all for me

molloyjh

Luke Fitz never really delivered on his potential. In many ways through injury as much as his own failings. When he was good he was absolutely electric, but can't really be considered one of the greats.

[Deleted User]

sydthebeat wrote: »

On your behalf I'm throwing a tenner on Keenan to score a try on Saturday....

Don't doubt his ability, the lad is very good. Hell, he might even score. But is he the best option in a game where we need massive points; the one who is most likely to get over the line? As I said, I'd have Stockdale on the wing (it's mad to take our most prolific available winger and stick him at fullback in this game), and have Daly or Henshaw at FB. That seems far more likely to generate a high score.

Hope I'm wrong and Keenan runs over three or four.

Hands Like Flippers

errlloyd wrote: »

With respect, that is unfortunately not how this works.

This is a contagious virus, there is no personal responsibility. The consequences of actions are felt on a population level, not a personal one.

I would respectfully suggest that argument cuts the other way as well. If someone is in a vulnerable group then they should shield rather than expect all of society to shut down for them. I know lots of vunerable people who take this view.

swiwi_

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Always cracked a smile when Michael D and Toner shook hands.

I've no issue with it, feel it adds to the gravitas and intensity of international standard sport.

But it delays the start of the match!

lawrencesummers

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Luke Fitz was one of the best whingers we've ever had, didn't score many tries. I'd still start him every time

I corrected that slight, but very relevant error you made in your post.