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Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

ancapailldorcha

This thread is a continuation of the megathreads for discussing the presidency of Donald Trump and any matters which relate to this.

Please keep discussion civil and constructive and bear the charter in mind before posting.

Update 23/9/20:

Threadbanned users:

Outlaw Pete
everlast75
mcmoustache
lawrencesummers
RIGOLO

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pixelburp

The latest John Oliver exposé reminds that among all the other fires going on, Donald Trump is still pulling the US out of the WHO; and as ever Oliver does God's work reminding & detailing of the consequences - not just for America but the rest of the world. Interesting to learn that the reason the US even pays as much as it does is precisely its own fault; dating back to a decision by Reagan to cap / stymy funding, requiring voluntary donations instead.

Hard not to share Oliver's outlook when it comes to Trump's ability to analyse any given scenario: that like the Paris Accord, the Iran Deal (and I'd add his decision to shutter the Pandemic department in 2018), he sees somthing that involves "... shared sacrafice, trade offs and complexities, and decides to blow it up because he either doesn't understand, doesn't care - or both"

The US is still on course to exit the WHO in June '21 so presumably one of the first actions taken by Biden if he wins will be to tear up the withdrawal decision.

[Deleted User]

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Sure Trump is still tweeting about how the wall will "soon be finished" and claiming Mexico will pay for it :pac:

I reckon Mexico would be delighted to pay for the wall now. Anything to seperate it from its basketcase neighbour up north.

Water John

Trump now calls Fauci an idiot. Dr Atlas says no to masks. This admin needs to end.

Leroy42

Water John wrote: »

Trump now calls Fauci an idiot. Dr Atlas says no to masks. This admin needs to end.

On a side note, I feel sorry for Fauci. Clearly, he took the view that he was better inside the tent than outside but I fear his decision to remain tight-lipped about Trump's behind the scenes views have led to the situation being as bad as it is and perhaps, of course we will never truly know, had he come out strongly to sound the alarm, maybe bringing his colleagues with hi, he may have saved many lives.

IMO, he will look back at this period and regret taking the wrong option, of attempting to stay above the fray when actually it needed a strong character to get into the fight.

And what did it get him? COVID is looking like it will be getting even worse than before, Trump has savaged him and all other health professionals, the country is divided over the future direction of how to handle it. What did he decision to keep quiet actually achieve?

StringerBell

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I reckon Mexico would be delighted to pay for the wall now. Anything to seperate it from its basketcase neighbour up north.

Promises made
Promises kept

Water John

Disagree, he would have been spat out by Trump. Birx and Fauci tried as best they could in the circumstances. That takes a special courage when flouncing off to the high moral ground would have been easier.

Leroy42

But at least then Trump could not have hidden behind the curtain that he had the support of Fauci. Of course he would have been spat out, but the man is highly regarded with years of experience, he must be able to get out medical professionals on his side. Given the numbers were fast increasing, he had the facts.

It would have meant the end of his job, 100%, but what is the point of his job if he just going to stand by and watch the virus, the thing he has spect his whole life preparing for, running wild across the country.

Water John

The US would have had some idiot like Dr. Atlas advising Trump since last April. It's not about ego or being right, just how many more would have died?

Leroy42

Water John wrote: »

The US would have had some idiot like Dr. Atlas advising Trump since last April. It's not about ego or being right, just how many more would have died?

I don't know, maybe more, maybe less. The US has done pretty awful though. That 10 worst performing countries.

IMO, and that iscall it is, Trump was afforded too much respect. Yes he was POTUS , but Fauci stood by and let Trump continue to muddy the waters, continue to cast doubt over the need for effective measures to halt the spread.

Its not at his feet, I don't blame him, I just feel that he will look back on this with regret that he should have done more.

Tell me how

Leroy42 wrote: »

I don't know, maybe more, maybe less. The US has done pretty awful though. That 10 worst performing countries.

IMO, and that iscall it is, Trump was afforded too much respect. Yes he was POTUS , but Fauci stood by and let Trump continue to muddy the waters, continue to cast doubt over the need for effective measures to halt the spread.

Its not at his feet, I don't blame him, I just feel that he will look back on this with regret that he should have done more.

Saw yesterday that Fauci, a former avid runner and still very fit 79 year old who still walks for fitness, has had a security team appointed to him because of threats made against him by people who said he undermined Trump.

That's where the US is in 2020.

listermint

##Mod Snip##

Don't link dump.

Thanks

aloyisious

The Commission on Presidential Debates has decided to mute microphones to allow each candidate the opportunity for uninterrupted remarks during this week’s final forum. The mute button will be featured at the start of each 15-minute segment during opening comments, according to the commission. After that time, both mics will be turned on without a mute option to enable debater.

If this is found acceptable to both debaters, it should help the moderator escape any rebukes from either debater. I looked for confirmation of the reported decision outside the usual media I'd go to and got the above paragraph from the New York Post, which should go towards making news of the decision acceptable to anyone from a fixed point of view. The Trump Campaign manager gave a guarded response to the commission decision.

https://nypost.com/2020/10/19/commission-will-mute-mics-during-final-debate-between-trump-biden/

VinLieger

aloyisious wrote: »

The Commission on Presidential Debates has decided to mute microphones to allow each candidate the opportunity for uninterrupted remarks during this week’s final forum. The mute button will be featured at the start of each 15-minute segment during opening comments, according to the commission. After that time, both mics will be turned on without a mute option to enable debater.

If this is found acceptable to both debaters, it should help the moderator escape any rebukes from either debater. I looked for confirmation of the reported decision outside the usual media I'd go to and got the above paragraph from the New York Post, which should go towards making news of the decision acceptable to anyone from a fixed point of view. The Trump Campaign manager gave a guarded response to the commission decision.

https://nypost.com/2020/10/19/commission-will-mute-mics-during-final-debate-between-trump-biden/

A guarded response?

“President Trump is committed to debating Joe Biden regardless of last-minute rule changes from the biased commission in their latest attempt to provide advantage to their favored candidate,”

Hes hyping up a libelous conspiracy theory

seamus

aloyisious wrote: »

Distraction from his failures is the only game in town for him now so free publicity is worth its weight in gold to him. The GOP itself doesn't mean squat to him now.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the campaign is now taking a "scorched earth" approach and running on the assumption that the election is now lost. Like you say, maybe the goal now is to rewrite the narrative, distract from the utter failure of his presidency, the failure of his campaign and emerge from it as a man unfairly treated and undermined at every level by an incompetent organisation.

After all, this is what he would do after leaving a failed business behind him - "I made all the right calls, but I couldn't find any good people to work with, everyone around me was an idiot".

This is why he's attacking Fauci - "My pandemic response was perfect, but my CMO was incompetent, that's why it failed".

Water John

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Well either Trump doesn't show up now to that debate or he shouts louder (which might be hard with his recent Covid infection) and appear to be a complete nutcase yet again.

Last time he dropped like a rock in polls, this time it hopefully be game over for him.

What really shows up his lack of self awareness is that, Trump thought he did very well in the debate. I took about 48 hours for it to sink in that he hadn't.

abff

“President Trump is committed to debating Joe Biden regardless of last-minute rule changes from the biased commission in their latest attempt to provide advantage to their favored candidate,”

I'm baffled as to how a decision that impacts equally on both candidates can be construed as an attempt to provide advantage to one of the candidates. Trump seems to have descended so far down the rabbit hole that it's hard to see how there's any way back.

[Deleted User]

Interrupting suits Trump

abff

Deleted User wrote: »

Interrupting suits Trump

So basically his argument is that it prevents him from breaking the rules and is therefore unfair to him.

looksee

As I understand it, what is happening is that the mic will not be switched on for the opposition for either of the introductory speeches. Its not particularly about muting anyone in mid flow. Whether it is used for that remains to be seen.

Edit - is is not time that both main Trump threads are combined? There is really no separating the topics at this stage.

gizmo

To be clear, the campaign's comments relate to the choice of topics rather than the mic cutting. Bill Stepien's full statement was...

President Trump is committed to debating Joe Biden regardless of last minute rule changes from the biased commission in their latest attempt to provide advantage to their favored candidate. This was supposed to be the foreign policy debate, so the President still looks forward to forcing Biden to answer the number one relevant question of whether he’s been compromised by the Communist Party of China. Why did Biden allow his son Hunter to sell access to him while he was vice president, and why were there Chinese payment arrangements for Joe himself worked out by Hunter and his sketchy partners? If the media won’t ask Joe Biden these questions, the President will, and there will be no escape for Biden

Which of course illustrates that Trump would rather use the opportunity to discuss the nation's foreign policy direction to instead personally attack Biden and his son.

looksee

How can the Commission be described as biased? It is funded by both parties and they have equal representation?

aloyisious

VinLieger wrote: »

A guarded response?

Hes hyping up a libelous conspiracy theory

Thing is, as I understand it, the commission membership is bipartisan from both parties so any bias should be unidentifiable. Edited, just seen Looksee's post.

Quin_Dub

Water John wrote: »

What really shows up his lack of self awareness is that, Trump thought he did very well in the debate. I took about 48 hours for it to sink in that he hadn't.

It's consistent - He walked away from the Chris Wallace Interview and even the Swann/Axios Interview thinking he had aced them , it wasn't until later that he began to grasp how awfully they had been received.

He is incapable of self-reflection - He truly believes that he is never less than exceptional and if others don't see it that way they are simply "out to get him" or "haters"

It's also why he answers questions like "What would you do differently in you Covid response if you had a chance to start again?" with "Nothing , it was perfect" , he genuinely can't see errors on his part.

dinorebel

abff wrote: »

So basically his argument is that it prevents him from breaking the rules and is therefore unfair to him.

Trump's life story in one sentence.

20Cent

seamus wrote: »

I have a sneaking suspicion that the campaign is now taking a "scorched earth" approach and running on the assumption that the election is now lost. Like you say, maybe the goal now is to rewrite the narrative, distract from the utter failure of his presidency, the failure of his campaign and emerge from it as a man unfairly treated and undermined at every level by an incompetent organisation.

After all, this is what he would do after leaving a failed business behind him - "I made all the right calls, but I couldn't find any good people to work with, everyone around me was an idiot".

This is why he's attacking Fauci - "My pandemic response was perfect, but my CMO was incompetent, that's why it failed".

Was listening to Eammon Dunphy's podcast where he was interviewing Niall Stanage from the Hill newspaper. Stanage suggested that Trump knows he is going to lose badly, once out of office he won't be protected from all the fraud and sex assault cases waiting for him.
His last card is to threaten such chaos after the election by not accepting the result and his supporters threatening violence. He will call this off in exchange for immunity from prosecution. I hope this doesn't happen and Biden wins by such a margin Trumps complaints will not work. If it is close though things could get very bad.

gizmo

looksee wrote: »

How can the Commission be described as biased? It is funded by both parties and they have equal representation?

One assumes because they feel they're being denied a vector of attack on Biden.

The fact that it is the moderator who choses the topics, not the Commission, is a fact which is seemingly unworthy of note.

Christy42

20Cent wrote: »

Was listening to Eammon Dunphy's podcast where he was interviewing Niall Stanage from the Hill newspaper. Stanage suggested that Trump knows he is going to lose badly, once out of office he won't be protected from all the fraud and sex assault cases waiting for him.
His last card is to threaten such chaos after the election by not accepting the result and his supporters threatening violence. He will call this off in exchange for immunity from prosecution. I hope this doesn't happen and Biden wins by such a margin Trumps complaints will not work. If it is close though things could get very bad.

I suspect he will get away with it in the same way Nixon did. If Trump is seriously worried he will have plenty of advance notice to flee the country. He can come up with some excuse to salve his ego and plenty who will put him up.

extra gravy

Tell me how wrote: »

Saw yesterday that Fauci, a former avid runner and still very fit 79 year old who still walks for fitness, has had a security team appointed to him because of threats made against him by people who said he undermined Trump.

That's where the US is in 2020.

https://twitter.com/ewarren/status/1318340002477187083?s=19

Yep, can't even go for a walk by himself now. Disgusting indictment of this vile administration.

duploelabs

Christy42 wrote: »

I suspect he will get away with it in the same way Nixon did. If Trump is seriously worried he will have plenty of advance notice to flee the country. He can come up with some excuse to salve his ego and plenty who will put him up.

Nixon was pardoned, can't see Biden doing that

L1011

duploelabs wrote: »

Nixon was pardoned, can't see Biden doing that

No president can pardon state offences anyway.