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Shannon Airport Thread [Mod Warning in First Post]

Clareman

This thread is to discuss all things Shannon Airport related.

Warning, any back biting, regional nonsense, trolling, baiting or back seat modding will lead to bans.

It's also important to remember than that this thread is in a regional forum, not the Aviation forum, if you want to get into details on Aviation, go to that forum. Finally, this is the Clare forum, there will be a bias towards Clare in here, so expect folk to want to defend their county .

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Masala

Anyone see any detail behind the €10m allocated today in the Budget to Shannon and Cork Airports?..

How is it being divvyed up??? Strange that only 2 airports singled out for this support...... the rest of the Regionals are in just as bad a state with aviation crippled with the Government yo-yo stance on travel.

Avoation1091

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

There's nothing funny about Covid 19 (especially if you work in the aviation sector).

And I don't think the Irish government gets to decide when the worldwide pandemic ends, funnily enough.

Lads by all means tell yourselves it's just a case of digging in for the winter before all goes back to normal if it helps you sleep at night. But there's a tough road ahead for the travel industry and it's going to get a hell of a lot worse before it gets any better. Burying your heads in the sand won't help in the long run.

I defo didnt mean that to come across that COVID is funny. Its defo not. I feel really bad the Aviation sector. The Govts green list has been a joke and there are no words to describe how bad they have treated the sector. Totally understand from a health service point of view but there are safe ways to resume travel.

I just disagreed with ur comment. I think the Summer 2021 schedule will see the start of recovery. The airlines cant go through next Summer the way they did this summer. I do believe people will get moving next year and recovery will start. Aer Lingus seem to be confident that there schedule for next Summer will operate.

They couldnt allow recovery to start in 2022. Collapse comes to mind.....and SNN,ORK would be in even more trouble.

Cosmo Kramer

Avoation1091 wrote: »

LOL. Comedian is right,

I would defo think recovery would start earlier than 2022. The Government cant be that mad. MM said travel restrictions until June 2021. I think hopefully at the end of March 2021 recovery can start.

There's nothing funny about Covid 19 (especially if you work in the aviation sector).

And I don't think the Irish government gets to decide when the worldwide pandemic ends, funnily enough.

Lads by all means tell yourselves it's just a case of digging in for the winter before all goes back to normal if it helps you sleep at night. But there's a tough road ahead for the travel industry and it's going to get a hell of a lot worse before it gets any better. Burying your heads in the sand won't help in the long run.

johnjoeR

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

No preference either way, my view is simply that the millions that will need to be pumped into the regional airports will be better invested when a viable market for the airports to operate in returns in future.

Summer 2020 has been awful, but the coming winter is going to be an absolute disaster for the industry. The worst of it is that the odds are that summer 2021 will be no better. The recovery may not start until 2022 at the earliest. How can the government continue to fund barely operational airports for that length of time given the amount of debt they themselves are incurring to keep the country on its feet right now?

It's an awful time - but aviation is a volatile industry to work in and horrible decisions are going to need to be taken sooner or later. Shannon (or any of the other regional airports) cannot just have a free pass via the magic money tree to carry on as though nothing has changed. It's Shannon that needs to get real I'm afraid.

The government will be helping Knock Airport through this too you know. And they not even owned by the state.

Avoation1091

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

No preference either way, my view is simply that the millions that will need to be pumped into the regional airports will be better invested when a viable market for the airports to operate in returns in future.

Summer 2020 has been awful, but the coming winter is going to be an absolute disaster for the industry. The worst of it is that the odds are that summer 2021 will be no better. The recovery may not start until 2022 at the earliest. How can the government continue to fund barely operational airports for that length of time given the amount of debt they themselves are incurring to keep the country on its feet right now?

It's an awful time - but aviation is a volatile industry to work in and horrible decisions are going to need to be taken sooner or later. Shannon (or any of the other regional airports) cannot just have a free pass via the magic money tree to carry on as though nothing has changed. It's Shannon that needs to get real I'm afraid.

LOL. Comedian is right,

I would defo think recovery would start earlier than 2022. The Government cant be that mad. MM said travel restrictions until June 2021. I think hopefully at the end of March 2021 recovery can start.

JamesBond2010

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

No preference either way, my view is simply that the millions that will need to be pumped into the regional airports will be better invested when a viable market for the airports to operate in returns in future.

Summer 2020 has been awful, but the coming winter is going to be an absolute disaster for the industry. The worst of it is that the odds are that summer 2021 will be no better. The recovery may not start until 2022 at the earliest. How can the government continue to fund barely operational airports for that length of time given the amount of debt they themselves are incurring to keep the country on its feet right now?

It's an awful time - but aviation is a volatile industry to work in and horrible decisions are going to need to be taken sooner or later. Shannon (or any of the other regional airports) cannot just have a free pass via the magic money tree to carry on as though nothing has changed. It's Shannon that needs to get real I'm afraid.

Def a comedian :pac::pac::pac:

Cosmo Kramer

No preference either way, my view is simply that the millions that will need to be pumped into the regional airports will be better invested when a viable market for the airports to operate in returns in future.

Summer 2020 has been awful, but the coming winter is going to be an absolute disaster for the industry. The worst of it is that the odds are that summer 2021 will be no better. The recovery may not start until 2022 at the earliest. How can the government continue to fund barely operational airports for that length of time given the amount of debt they themselves are incurring to keep the country on its feet right now?

It's an awful time - but aviation is a volatile industry to work in and horrible decisions are going to need to be taken sooner or later. Shannon (or any of the other regional airports) cannot just have a free pass via the magic money tree to carry on as though nothing has changed. It's Shannon that needs to get real I'm afraid.

johnjoeR

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Whatever limited cargo ops and troop stopover work is continuing at the airport can be transferred over to Dublin as a short to medium term measure, plenty of room for that there right now alongside their reduced passenger ops. Once everything starts to go back to normal in a year or two there will be a need for intense support from Government to get the regionals back to where they were, it'll probably take five years to be honest. But right now the reality is that, at a time when we need to invest in hospitals, nurses, vaccines and tests, we cannot have an unviable airport going cap in hand to the government (yet again) while staff are sitting about dealing with one passenger flight in a whole day.

Every airport in the world is losing money right now. All due respects to Knock but it doesn't have a cluster of airside companies like lufthansa tecknik, Eirtech and several others that rely on an open airport to maintain thousands of jobs. Nor does it have any other business bar terminal traffic.
Shannon needs to hold onto all its business just like any other.
Get real!

notharrypotter

Ah Cosmo,

No suggestion that the jobs be moved to Scotland's this time?

Your lack of love for Shannon Airport is still showing.

Cosmo Kramer

notharrypotter wrote: »

Cosmo you are a genius.

I think we should start by closing Knock first, what do you think?

Not sure what you're getting at, or maybe think you are getting at, but IWAK was already closed for part of the year during the first lockdown. I think it is highly likely that it will close again in the coming weeks. It's simply not justifiable to keep it open at this point in time in my opinion, if it is to survive in the longer term.

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

:pac::pac::pac::pac: when did u start doing comedy ?? Are u going to pay for the peoples mortgages and bills are u?

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

And do exactly what with the staff?

Sorry lads, but it's time for Shannon to live in the real world, just like any other business. Shannon group are losing over a million a week, staff will be entitled to their redundancy payments just like any other business, or indeed any other airport as has already happened for many staff at Knock. I'm sure the staff that were let go there have "mortgages and bills to pay" too. Or do you believe a Shannon job somehow deserves more protection than a job at Knock?

Whatever limited cargo ops and troop stopover work is continuing at the airport can be transferred over to Dublin as a short to medium term measure, plenty of room for that there right now alongside their reduced passenger ops. Once everything starts to go back to normal in a year or two there will be a need for intense support from Government to get the regionals back to where they were, it'll probably take five years to be honest. But right now the reality is that, at a time when we need to invest in hospitals, nurses, vaccines and tests, we cannot have an unviable airport going cap in hand to the government (yet again) while staff are sitting about dealing with one passenger flight in a whole day.

RocketRaccoon

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Just the one flight on the boards at Shannon right now - due in shortly after 10am and that's it for the day in terms of passenger services it seems.

Is there an argument for just shutting the regional airports for the winter at this stage, at least in terms of commercial passenger operations - whatever few passengers are on that one flight could easily have accommodated on a Dublin flight I'm sure?

Awful times for the staff at the various airports, but would the longer term future of the facilities be better served by shutting them to reduce costs at this stage until the aviation industry has a chance to rebuild and go again post Covid?

And do exactly what with the staff?

JamesBond2010

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Just the one flight on the boards at Shannon right now - due in shortly after 10am and that's it for the day in terms of passenger services it seems.

Is there an argument for just shutting the regional airports for the winter at this stage, at least in terms of commercial passenger operations - whatever few passengers are on that one flight could easily have accommodated on a Dublin flight I'm sure?

Awful times for the staff at the various airports, but would the longer term future of the facilities be better served by shutting them to reduce costs at this stage until the aviation industry has a chance to rebuild and go again post Covid?

:pac::pac::pac::pac: when did u start doing comedy ?? Are u going to pay for the peoples mortgages and bills are u?

Brennans Row

Shannon - Commercial Movements (IAA)

|Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sept|Oct|Nov|Dec|Total
2015|1,253|1,026|1,277|1,454|1,725|2,169|2,058|1,728|1,780|1,645|1,283|1,312|18,710
2016|1,222|1,128|1,390|1,488|1,807|2,031|2,032|1,834|1,839|1,698|1,353|1,327|19,149
2017|1,291|1,215|1,429|1,446|1,776|1,975|1,949|1,885|1,778|1,796|1,440|1,316|19,296
2018|1,301|1,200|1,368|1,575|1,829|2,098|2,104|1,949|2,066|1,858|1,385|1,369|20,102
2019|1,246|1,087|1,320|1,444|1,836|1,951|1,976|1,843|1,974|1,738|1,254|1,191|18,833
2020|1,221|1,179|691|261|238|322|850|725|557||||
Change|-2.0%|+8.5%|-47.7%|-81.9%|-87.0%|-83.5%|-67.2%|-60.7%|-71.4%||||

tv221

Not anti Sinn Fein, but I certainly don't like this Gavin twat who regularly stands on the round about with the other highly paid state retired anti war protesters. https://www.sinnfein.ie/contents/58446

In other news. Another push is being made on the CHP plant. Which I guess would allow Shannon and the free zone some Green Cred. Construction of a Gasification and Combined Heat Power Plant for production of electricity and heating. Construction of a Battery Storage Facility (20MW). Construction of a Thermal Energy recovery and storage facility for district heating distribution. Construction of new on site 38kV substation. Creation of a new access road http://www.eplanning.ie/ClareCC/AppFileRefDetails/20705/0

Decision due on another new building. There should be some interesting news due on the letting of those just being finished. http://www.eplanning.ie/ClareCC/AppFileRefDetails/20575/0

An NCT centre allowing employees to get the necessary done during the day when at work. http://www.eplanning.ie/ClareCC/AppFileRefDetails/20700/0

Good to see Shannon Group continuing on with new projects

notharrypotter

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Just the one flight on the boards at Shannon right now - due in shortly after 10am and that's it for the day in terms of passenger services it seems.

Is there an argument for just shutting the regional airports for the winter at this stage, at least in terms of commercial passenger operations - whatever few passengers are on that one flight could easily have accommodated on a Dublin flight I'm sure?

Awful times for the staff at the various airports, but would the longer term future of the facilities be better served by shutting them to reduce costs at this stage until the aviation industry has a chance to rebuild and go again post Covid?

Cosmo you are a genius.

I think we should start by closing Knock first, what do you think?

johnjoeR

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Just the one flight on the boards at Shannon right now - due in shortly after 10am and that's it for the day in terms of passenger services it seems.

Is there an argument for just shutting the regional airports for the winter at this stage, at least in terms of commercial passenger operations - whatever few passengers are on that one flight could easily have accommodated on a Dublin flight I'm sure?

Awful times for the staff at the various airports, but would the longer term future of the facilities be better served by shutting them to reduce costs at this stage until the aviation industry has a chance to rebuild and go again post Covid?

Not sure it would make any difference TBH. Unlike Knock and to a lesser extent Cork, Shannon does not rely completely on terminal traffic. It has relatively vibrant bizjet operation, the troops obviously, a few cargo movement daily and traffic based on airside businesss that rely on the airport for their operation. Staff will still be needed unless they actually close the whole airport completely which is a non runner.

Cosmo Kramer

Well yes, further redundancies would of course need to follow as part of any closure. They can't be expected to close yet continue to pay the staff as they would normally do. Obviously a skeleton workforce would still be required. In that respect there are significant savings to be had to secure the longer term future of the airport.

Clareman

At the moment the main costs to Shannon is staff costs so closing for a few months won't have any impact on that.

Cosmo Kramer

Just the one flight on the boards at Shannon right now - due in shortly after 10am and that's it for the day in terms of passenger services it seems.

Is there an argument for just shutting the regional airports for the winter at this stage, at least in terms of commercial passenger operations - whatever few passengers are on that one flight could easily have accommodated on a Dublin flight I'm sure?

Awful times for the staff at the various airports, but would the longer term future of the facilities be better served by shutting them to reduce costs at this stage until the aviation industry has a chance to rebuild and go again post Covid?

Tiernster7

No there are going to be 3 regions in Ireland for the EU plab according to government. I'm wondering are Shannon and Cork the same region

JamesBond2010

Tiernster7 wrote: »

Anybody know what Irelands 3 regions for the green list are?

well i can guarantee you that u wont be able to fly from Snn or cork to them anyway.

Tiernster7

Anybody know what Irelands 3 regions for the green list are?

Avoation1091

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

end of oct /start of Novish

Presume just LHR & ACE?

JFK/BOS will prob be at a later date?

JamesBond2010

highlydebased wrote: »

Some Aer Lingus staff returning on a reduced basis. Presume they are planning on resuming a limited service?

Also note the winter leave programme for SNN staff.

https://www.rte.ie/amp/1166159/?__twitter_impression=true

end of oct /start of Novish

Avoation1091

Mc Love wrote: »

What happens the US custom staff at Shannon? Have they gone home now?

The Pre Clearance resumes on the 20th of Sept so some will probably still be here.

highlydebased

Some Aer Lingus staff returning on a reduced basis. Presume they are planning on resuming a limited service?

Also note the winter leave programme for SNN staff.

https://www.rte.ie/amp/1166159/?__twitter_impression=true

Mc Love

What happens the US custom staff at Shannon? Have they gone home now?

Limpy

Its a bad time to be any Airport now. Let alone Shannon. Its a low hanging fruit at the moment. Hopefully the preclearence will stay but if theres no TA flights it wouldn't be feesable.

People are panicking seeing full flight's and assume its going to be a Covid cluster.

Only hope is the government formulate a travel policy that encourages travel to safe regions for mental Health ect. Instead of the current shaming all who travel policy.

There's Only 1 type of traveller they should be shaming.

Brennans Row

Shannon - Commercial Movements (IAA)

|Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sept|Oct|Nov|Dec|Total
2015|1,253|1,026|1,277|1,454|1,725|2,169|2,058|1,728|1,780|1,645|1,283|1,312|18,710
2016|1,222|1,128|1,390|1,488|1,807|2,031|2,032|1,834|1,839|1,698|1,353|1,327|19,149
2017|1,291|1,215|1,429|1,446|1,776|1,975|1,949|1,885|1,778|1,796|1,440|1,316|19,296
2018|1,301|1,200|1,368|1,575|1,829|2,098|2,104|1,949|2,066|1,858|1,385|1,369|20,102
2019|1,246|1,087|1,320|1,444|1,836|1,951|1,976|1,843|1,974|1,738|1,254|1,191|18,833
2020|1,221|1,179|691|261|238|322|850|725|||||
Change|-2.0%|+8.5%|-47.7%|-81.9%|-87.0%|-83.5%|-67.2%|-60.7%|||||

Cookiemunster

Deagol wrote: »

Not surprising really - not that I think the government rules are what's driving this - people are just not going to travel at the moment and RA are just using that as an excuse IMO.

There is no restrictions on travel between Ireland and the UK and there was <30pax on my flight from LHR to Dublin yesterday.

Actually the UK is (ridiculously) not on our green list, so the 14 day self isolation request is in place and there's still government advice against non essential travel. There's also the fact that multiple companies are enforcing the 14 days away from work if you've been abroad.