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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

Ten of Swords

Part 1 here

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Threadbans Thread 2

Hqrry113

Carry on...

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FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Francie, I am criticising them for things that are well within their power or that should be well within their power.

You are making excuses that don't stand up.

I have argued for a long time that the sectarian parties are derelict in their refusal to govern in areas such as education, health, social welfare (sorry, they voluntarily gave that away, creating the situation they are now in), where they have a load of scope. They have more powers than Scotland, but are making a bigger mess.

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/northern-ireland-assembly#:~:text=The%20Northern%20Ireland%20Assembly%20is,meets%20at%20Parliament%20Buildings%2C%20Belfast.

"The Northern Ireland Assembly is the devolved legislature for Northern Ireland. It has the power to make laws in a wide range of areas, including housing, employment, education, health, agriculture and the environment. It meets at Parliament Buildings, Belfast."

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

The state has failed.

Nobotty

Jesus, you guys...get a room

I'd say Arlene is privately very embarrassed that the UK is failing the north on C19 and that they'd be better off in a UI

FrancieBrady

Nobotty wrote: »

Jesus, you guys...get a room
I

The constant constant denial that NI is run by and 'executive' with a five way coalition answerable to Westminster (who whether blanch likes it or not, has always, like any government had the prime 'the buck stops there responsibility) is what gets in the way of mature debate about these issues.

the constant faux outrage about the 'shinners' is no help either. The shinners have their share of the responsibility like everybody else.

There are a host of reasons why NI is a mess and a failure at almost everything it tries to accomplish.

JohnnyFlash

I see Eoin O’Broin is looking for a referendum to make a right to a home part of a constitution. It would be humorous if it wasn’t so stupid.

You could end up with a situation where a judge would rule that health, education, social welfare and defence budgets would have to be cut just so we could build houses for people. Everyone would be entitled to a house. Everyone.

Extremely dangerous and unworkable populism.

FrancieBrady

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I see Eoin O’Broin is looking for a referendum to make a right to a home part of a constitution. It would be humorous if it wasn’t so stupid.

You could end up with a situation where a judge would rule that health, education, social welfare and defence budgets would have to be cut just so we could build houses for people. Everyone would be entitled to a house. Everyone.

Extremely dangerous and unworkable populism.

It's ok Johnny, FG will probably steal the idea and legitimise it for you guys.

Truthvader

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I see Eoin O’Broin is looking for a referendum to make a right to a home part of a constitution. It would be humorous if it wasn’t so stupid.

You could end up with a situation where a judge would rule that health, education, social welfare and defence budgets would have to be cut just so we could build houses for people. Everyone would be entitled to a house. Everyone.

Extremely dangerous and unworkable populism.

Poor Eoin, he is just not up to it

JohnnyFlash

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's ok Johnny, FG will probably steal the idea and legitimise it for you guys.

1) We recognise the legitimacy of the constitution. SF don’t.

2) We’d have the chutzpah to know stupid stuff like this would be deeply unconstitutional and utterly unworkable. As I said, idiotic and cynical populism in the mold of Brexit. Lowest common denominator stuff.

3) Just because Pearse gets angry about something in the Dáil doesn’t mean that something is now a SF issue. That sort of political naivety might appeal to halfwits on Twitter. It’s not how a country works.

blanch152

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

1) We recognise the legitimacy of the constitution. SF don’t.

2) We’d have the chutzpah to know stupid stuff like this would be deeply unconstitutional and utterly unworkable. As I said, idiotic and cynical populism in the mold of Brexit. Lowest common denominator stuff.

3) Just because Pearse gets angry about something in the Dáil doesn’t mean that something is now a SF issue. That sort of political naivety might appeal to halfwits on Twitter. It’s not how a country works.

It would be ironic if Sinn Fein passed such an amendment, and in a subsequent Supreme Court case, it found that provision of accommodation as in Direct Provision Centres met the constitutional requirement and that the government was entitled to deduct the full cost of same from any social welfare payment. It would be quite a shock to life-long social welfare.

blanch152

https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2020/1008/1170227-executive-covid-measures/

It seems that I am not the only one concerned about the ineptitude of the SF/DUP government in the North.

Martin has gone over their heads to London so concerned is he about their incompetence.

"There were 828 new cases yesterday, which based on population size, is the equivalent of more than 2,000 in the Republic."

Unbelievably shocking, and still we have Sinn Fein mouthpieces in the South complaining about our government. They have no shame.

maccored

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2020/1008/1170227-executive-covid-measures/

It seems that I am not the only one concerned about the ineptitude of the SF/DUP government in the North.

Martin has gone over their heads to London so concerned is he about their incompetence.

"There were 828 new cases yesterday, which based on population size, is the equivalent of more than 2,000 in the Republic."

Unbelievably shocking, and still we have Sinn Fein mouthpieces in the South complaining about our government. They have no shame.

plus your beloved sdlp, dup, alliance and uup. youre a fan of those four but not sf - no brain required to see your reaction

Suckit

No doubt Leo the never-ready will wait and see what the public thinks.. :rolleyes:

aido79

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2020/1008/1170227-executive-covid-measures/

It seems that I am not the only one concerned about the ineptitude of the SF/DUP government in the North.

Martin has gone over their heads to London so concerned is he about their incompetence.

"There were 828 new cases yesterday, which based on population size, is the equivalent of more than 2,000 in the Republic."

Unbelievably shocking, and still we have Sinn Fein mouthpieces in the South complaining about our government. They have no shame.

The expression "I want to speak to the doctor not the disease" comes to mind...

Bishop of hope

Here we have a situation in the north ré covid, and what's the answer from SF/DUP?
We will raise fines for non compliance!
So basically the party that represents ordinary joe is promising to take their money if they don't comply.
There's more than a hint of hypocrisy in that decision.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-54455718

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2020/1008/1170227-executive-covid-measures/

It seems that I am not the only one concerned about the ineptitude of the SF/DUP government in the North.

Martin has gone over their heads to London so concerned is he about their incompetence.

"There were 828 new cases yesterday, which based on population size, is the equivalent of more than 2,000 in the Republic."

Unbelievably shocking, and still we have Sinn Fein mouthpieces in the South complaining about our government. They have no shame.

I think you'd call supporting the SF position as MoN called for the same.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think you'd call supporting the SF position as MoN called for the same.

But she went ahead with fines!

Nobotty

Nothing wrong with fines
I'd rise them
Only thing for eejits
I'm restricting my movements at the moment because some bollix awaiting a result did not restrict theirs causing me to be a close contact of a close contact
I will need to test if that close contact is positive
Very annoying
People need to cop on big time

JohnnyFlash

Derry/Strabane now reporting the highest case rates in Europe. Not good.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

But she went ahead with fines!

And?

BTW The executive went ahead with fines.

Try and get this straight...if she was a PM of a single party government then it would be ok to breathlessly claim but 'she went ahead with fines'.

The lack of knowledge here is ridiculous.

Suckit

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Derry/Strabane now reporting the highest case rates in Europe. Not good.

Not really surprising as Lifford-Stranorlar had the highest rates in Europe a week ago and for the previous two weeks.

It was something like 610 per 100,000 last week.

Yurt2

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I see Eoin O’Broin is looking for a referendum to make a right to a home part of a constitution. It would be humorous if it wasn’t so stupid.

You could end up with a situation where a judge would rule that health, education, social welfare and defence budgets would have to be cut just so we could build houses for people. Everyone would be entitled to a house. Everyone.

Extremely dangerous and unworkable populism.

JohnnySpiceFlashBrain the not angry man will be completely unaware that the Netherlands and Sweden (among other countries) already have such a provision in their constitution and is reflected in their laws.

FlashBrain will now have something to say how the Dutch and Swedish are stupid people and that FG are much more cleverer with the bestest and most good housing policy in the world.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And?

BTW The executive went ahead with fines.

Try and get this straight...if she was a PM of a single party government then it would be ok to breathlessly claim but 'she went ahead with fines'.

The lack of knowledge here is ridiculous.

And you blaming Leo and FG for everything the government here does, would you get up the yard with that level of hypocrisy.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

And you blaming Leo and FG for everything the government here does, would you get up the yard with that level of hypocrisy.

I don't actually. It's very much a coalition and I treat it as such. Note, my Government Of Chaos remarks on other threads.

I dislike Leo because he thinks he is the leader of a single party government, the chaos he wreaked this week being a prime case of it.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I

I think the British would have faced down the sectarian bigoted Unionists first before they would have sparked an international incident by attacking Ireland.

You truly live in an Orwellian world where you employ doublespeak to try and spin your fantasies.

The Irish army cross over an international border uninvited and without the consent of the UK, you don't want to call this an invasion, but a 'peacekeeping' mission, something Russia spun to the world in the Ukraine and Crimea recently.

When/If the British retaliated and defended their own borders as per their right under international law, that is them attacking Ireland....

:D:D:D:D

markodaly

blanch152 wrote: »

"Even if the political will had existed within the Irish government, the infantry groups did not have the manpower, transport or equipment to protect the nationalist areas of Belfast. Speaking retrospectively, Lynch admitted that ‘we had no intention of moving in . . . we did not have the men or equipment even if we had the desire’"

You miss the point Blanch, this was not about actually doing something tangible or realistic to help nationalists, this is about Green Willy waving on the internet.
Oh the shame! SHAME I TELL YA!! SHAAAAAME!! :rolleyes:

This is why Violent Irish Republicanism is littered with failures. Too many egos not having a notion or clue of the real world to realpoltik. The PIRA thought a few bombs in Derry and Belfast would make the British leave the north..... how wrong they were.

Here you have fantasists thinking a an Irish Army incursion would have been successful and the British would have just stood by while their cities and territory was occupied, just like magic, as if Jack Lynch was Moses parting the seas, because I will tell you now, there was more a chance that Jack Lynch would have been able to part the Irish sea like Moses rather than the British standing by in the North while another army took over parts of its territory.

The ghost and hubris of Seán Mac Stíofáin living on with these people.

Stovepipe

Yurt! wrote: »

JohnnySpiceFlashBrain the not angry man will be completely unaware that the Netherlands and Sweden (among other countries) already have such a provision in their constitution and is reflected in their laws.

FlashBrain will now have something to say how the Dutch and Swedish are stupid people and that FG are much more cleverer with the bestest and most good housing policy in the world.

That system works because both countries have considerably more State apartments for the renting public than we do. Virtually all of our apartments are private, unlike the Nordic states.When we tried mass apartments, you ended up with O'Devaneys Gardens or Oliver Bond or Ballymun. Anti-social activity was the norm. In Sweden or Norway, you engage in anti-social activities whilst living in State flats, they put you on the street. Don't want to treat public housing with respect? Enjoy the street,unless you are prepared to cop on.

markodaly

blanch152 wrote: »

I see you didn't challenge a single bit of the analysis of the events of 1969. Can we bookmark that post for the next time some fantastical reimagining of the events occurs again?

When actual proper professional analysis is brought forward that blows the fantasists ideas away, they always go after the man.

They usually throw in words like partitionists, or hat-doffing, maybe West-Brit too... as if name-calling changes reality.

markodaly

maccored wrote: »

The irish government DID NOTHING. you are proud of that. Im not. end of story

Do you think they should have invaded the North?

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We are Ireland blanch...looking at themuns is not an answer. Our issues are specific to us.

Oh yea, Ireland is always different.

markodaly

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2020/1008/1170227-executive-covid-measures/

It seems that I am not the only one concerned about the ineptitude of the SF/DUP government in the North.

Martin has gone over their heads to London so concerned is he about their incompetence.

"There were 828 new cases yesterday, which based on population size, is the equivalent of more than 2,000 in the Republic."

Unbelievably shocking, and still we have Sinn Fein mouthpieces in the South complaining about our government. They have no shame.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

You truly live in an Orwellian world where you employ doublespeak to try and spin your fantasies.

The Irish army cross over an international border uninvited and without the consent of the UK, you don't want to call this an invasion, but a 'peacekeeping' mission, something Russia spun to the world in the Ukraine and Crimea recently.

When/If the British retaliated and defended their own borders as per their right under international law, that is them attacking Ireland....

:D:D:D:D

Really, your indignation doesn't wash here Mark.
Wilson and particularly Callaghan were fully aware of Unionist abuse of power but were paralysed by fear of making things worse. They tiptoed around Chichester Clark because they knew he was wont to fly off on one. They were open to anything that solved the international pressure they felt themselves to be under. They considered excluding NI from the UK even. And any solution where they weren't left holding the can.
Callaghan was petrified that his political career would disappear in 'an Irish bog'.
Had we signaled we were going in, they'd have very quickly taken steps to see that didn't happen...and military force against Ireland was not one of them.

They would have acted diplomatically in much the same way as they did when they were faced with bombs going off in the financial and economic heartlands of Britain...i.e. they'd have cut a deal.
You are woefully underinformed of the people involved here, not to mention the context and circumstances.