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Off Topic Thread 5.0

[Deleted User]

Thread continued from here https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057835955&page=250

The usual rules apply. Non-rugby talk here. Consider this a social place, but like a pub, things like religion and politics can be divisive, so don't say things here you wouldn't say to someone's face in the pub. Sober

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kuang1

I take it you enjoyed "the social dilemma" then Venjur?

Sorry everyone for banging on about this documentary yet again, but a must see for everybody with a social media account or smartphone imo.

Explains some, maybe most, of why what you just posted is true.

[Deleted User]

At times you feel you don't want to let clear lies and dishonest arguments stand.

But the people making them never seem willing or able to take anything away that contradicts the world view they've been fed and have swallowed whole so increasingly it's not worth the bother.

It's frustrating but also quite sad and despairingly widespread. The misinformation is winning and the prejudices of those peddling it seem so insatiable that no amount of contradiction and hypocrisy in their position deters them - even when clearly pointed out.

Internet is becoming a lost battleground to grown up, informed conversation.

sydthebeat

im not going to bother anymore richie

thanks anyway

Richie_Rich89

sydthebeat wrote: »

ah here.....

so you agree Obama didnt create IS..... the libyan popular uprising actually destabilized the region ....

and you believe the syrian civil war is propaganda

hummmm.

no point in debating with someone who flip flops and dismisses fact.

I believe the absolutely overwhelming majority of what's put out by mainstream media like Sky and BBC about the Syrian conflict is propaganda, yes.

A good example would be Sky News cutting off a high-ranking British army officer who questions the chemical attack narrative:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtPhe7YsGmU

Squidgy Black

sydthebeat wrote: »

this is way

just in case you were wondering

Ah I know Syd but he just goes out of the way to cause trouble for the sake of it.

[Deleted User]

swiwi_ wrote: »

This from the NFL guy...

sydthebeat

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Can't believe people still respond to Richie's posts.

straight from the Donald Trump play book and should be called out for the untruth it is.

this is why

just in case you were wondering

Squidgy Black

Can't believe people still respond to Richie's posts.

thomond2006

swiwi_ wrote: »

This from the NFL guy...

Whoosh.

sydthebeat

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

What were Islamic State before they moved into the vacuum in Iraq and expanded massively? Nothing. That's what. No-one had ever heard of them.

Of course, the Americans should never have been in Iraq in the first place. You can lay that at the feet of Bush. He should be up at the Hague on crimes against humanity charges. Along with Blair.

Gaddafi's overthrowing in Libya is the biggest advertisement possible for dictators not committing to nuclear disarmament.

The "civil war" angle in Syria is largely western propaganda. There were elements at the start along those lines but it quickly descended into western-backed Islamic extremists versus government forces. The terrorists were being backed from outside to try to achieve the end goal of putting a US puppet in as leader like has happened in Egypt. They wanted to be able to build that gas pipeline through Syria and remove Russia's only deepwater Mediterranean port. Frankly, I'm not sure you can believe the claims of chemical attacks after all the weapons of mass destruction stuff used as a pretext for the Iraq War.

ah here.....

so you agree Obama didnt create IS..... the libyan popular uprising actually destabilized the region ....

and you believe the syrian civil war is propaganda

hummmm.

no point in debating with someone who flip flops and dismisses fact.

Richie_Rich89

sydthebeat wrote: »

wow thats some level of revisionism there.

Islamic State emerged out of Al Queda (it was a splinter group) in response to the US invasion of Iraq in 2003... 8 years before Obama.
ISIS as a grouping within Al Queda has existed since 1999.

Obama has always admitted that the failure to plan for the aftermath of gaddafi's death was his biggest mistake, however its not as if Libya was a bastion of peaceful enterprise before obama had any influence. lets not forget that Gaddafi was killed by his own countrymen, not an american mission strike.

whats happening in Syria is civil war... born from the Arab spring of 2011....which would have happened regardless of any intervention from the US or the UN. In fact the stick widely used to beat Obama with in regards to syria is the LACK of intervention and influence in the region. Remember Assad fired chemical weapons on his own people and Obama reneged on his previous promise to match fire with fire.

Obama made many mistakes in his presidency and was in no way a "peaceful"president... but some of that revisionism (the last line especially) is straight from the Donald Trump play book and should be called out for the untruth it is.

What were Islamic State before they moved into the vacuum in Iraq and expanded massively? Nothing. That's what. No-one had ever heard of them.

Of course, the Americans should never have been in Iraq in the first place. You can lay that at the feet of Bush. He should be up at the Hague on crimes against humanity charges. Along with Blair.

Gaddafi's overthrowing in Libya is the biggest advertisement possible for dictators not committing to nuclear disarmament.

The "civil war" angle in Syria is largely western propaganda. There were elements at the start along those lines but it quickly descended into western-backed Islamic extremists versus government forces. The terrorists were being backed from outside to try to achieve the end goal of putting a US puppet in as leader like has happened in Egypt. They wanted to be able to build that gas pipeline through Syria and remove Russia's only deepwater Mediterranean port. Frankly, I'm not sure you can believe the claims of chemical attacks after all the weapons of mass destruction stuff used as a pretext for the Iraq War.

swiwi_

thomond2006 wrote: »

Anyone for putting Trump talk on a separate off topic thread?

This from the NFL guy...

Neil3030

Before this place gets swallowed whole by the Qanon contingent, I would like to wish everyone a very happy Fat Bear Tuesday!

The final matchup pits the two biggest boys in Katmai against each other - 747 vs Chunk. Chunk went on an absolute rampage and steamrolled (possibly literally) last year's champ, Holly, in addition to the very popular Grazer (more on her some other time).

Ejm7dN2XYAA1e-l?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

Ejm7dN2XYAA1e-l?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

These two boys have history. It's not all about the salmon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2XPPB_-7_E

While Chunk had a solid innings, 747 has lost at least two finals, and I feel this really should be the year of the people's champ, aka Bear Force One.

But you can vote for your favourite here: https://t.co/NvXCYNigTJ?amp=1

winner declared at 7pm ADT.

BTW - whoever updates the Katmai Twitter feed is my spirit animal:

KatmaiNPS wrote:

Today’s the day we will crown 2020’s Fat Bear Week Champion. Where 747’s sedulous quest for salmon secured him a stout stomach, 32 Chunk’s playful pursuit of protein provided him a prodigious paunch. Who will win in the battle of the bellies?

sydthebeat

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

Obama created the refugee crisis by destabilising Libya and sponsoring terrorists in Syria to try to topple al-Assad.

He also effectively created IS by pulling out of Iraq too fast.

wow thats some level of revisionism there.

Islamic State emerged out of Al Queda (it was a splinter group) in response to the US invasion of Iraq in 2003... 8 years before Obama.
ISIS as a grouping within Al Queda has existed since 1999.

Obama has always admitted that the failure to plan for the aftermath of gaddafi's death was his biggest mistake, however its not as if Libya was a bastion of peaceful enterprise before obama had any influence. lets not forget that Gaddafi was killed by his own countrymen, not an american mission strike.

whats happening in Syria is civil war... born from the Arab spring of 2011....which would have happened regardless of any intervention from the US or the UN. In fact the stick widely used to beat Obama with in regards to syria is the LACK of intervention and influence in the region. Remember Assad fired chemical weapons on his own people and Obama reneged on his previous promise to match fire with fire.

Obama made many mistakes in his presidency and was in no way a "peaceful"president... but some of that revisionism (the last line especially) is straight from the Donald Trump play book and should be called out for the untruth it is.

Squidgy Black

Star Wars Squadron is decent anyways lads would recommend as Venjur mentioned earlier.

Thought it was relevant since it's all Rebels vs Imperial talk here now.....

mfceiling

Where's Neil and those fúcking bears?

Richie_Rich89

sydthebeat wrote: »

with respect, when you look at the numbers provided in that blog post... and see 2017 with a total of 4 strikes worldwide ... you have to ask yourself can that actually be honest?

then consider who the president is at that time, and ask yourself can this be honest?

then consider how trump has enacted legislation to keep drone strikes secret.....

Obama created the refugee crisis by destabilising Libya and sponsoring terrorists in Syria to try to topple al-Assad.

He also effectively created IS by pulling out of Iraq too fast.

Neil3030

Deleted User wrote: »

There really is very little comparison between Clinton v Trump polling and Biden v Trump.

Clinton bar occasional highs and outliers was regularly within the margin of error and after the reopening of the FBI email investigation the gap narrowed substantially in the last 10 days of the campaigns.

Biden is looking at Lindon B Johnson type numbers at the moment (subject to fraud) and even if he wasn't, his specific polling in key states is insurmountable without a complete sea change in sentiment between now and November (or widespread fraud).

Anything can happen, but it increasingly looks like only fraud and court stacking will save Trump here. Biden is around in politics for decades so it's unlikely there are any remaining skeletons to use against him.

Also, polls have been reweighted since 2016 to account for the omission that led to so many of them getting it wrong - uneducated white voters who don't respond to polls have migrated to Trump, whereas before they were assumed to lean Democrat.

This has now been factored into models. While this doesn't mean Trump will definitely lose, it means that we'll likely not get a surprise on Election Night.

Also worth noting, Nate Silver fully admits they may now be overweighting Trumps chances, and that Biden's lead could be even bigger.

Stheno

GARDAÍ will from tomorrow be putting up 132 checkpoints across the entire country on the main arterial routes, including motorways, to ensure people are complying with Level 3 lockdown guidelines.

"Travelling tomorrow is going to a lot different to travelling today," said Garda Commissioner Drew Harris as he announced the measures at Garda HQ in the Phoenix Park, Dublin.

He warned of traffic jams. "We are putting checkpoints on the motorways, that's going to slow down traffic flow," he said.

While officers have not been given the powers by Government to enforce the guidelines, he suggested they were not needed for now, pointing out that of the hundreds of thousands of stops made during the last lockdown, special powers then afforded to gardaí were used only 342 times.

"Policing is an extension of good citizenship," he said.

Officers at the stops will be focusing on 'the three Es' - engage, educate and encourage.

While the Commissioner admitted that a motorist will be able to continue on, even if stopped and asked to turn back by officers, he said it would be "a foolish choice".

Asked how officers will be dealing with house parties, he pointed out that there are certain protections for citizens.

"There is a constitutional protection of the home," he said, but added gardaí will have a presence in areas where people are not following the guidelines.

"Having gardaí positioned outside your home during a house party will really dampen the mood," he said.

So no powers to enforce restrictions but greater Garda presence from tomorrow

[Deleted User]

kuang1 wrote: »

And just to prove this even more, I've no link, but distinctly remember Hilary @ 1/8 (on paddypower) as I headed to bed on the 8th November 2016.

There really is very little comparison between Clinton v Trump polling and Biden v Trump.

Clinton bar occasional highs and outliers was regularly within the margin of error and after the reopening of the FBI email investigation the gap narrowed substantially in the last 10 days of the campaigns.

Biden is looking at Lindon B Johnson type numbers at the moment (subject to fraud) and even if he wasn't, his specific polling in key states is insurmountable without a complete sea change in sentiment between now and November (or widespread fraud).

Anything can happen, but it increasingly looks like only fraud and court stacking will save Trump here. Biden is around in politics for decades so it's unlikely there are any remaining skeletons to use against him.

kuang1

sydthebeat wrote: »

yep

biden is at 1/2 in the betting, with trump at 13/8

at one stage yesterday Biden was at 4/9 which is the shortest he has been so far.

while betting odds arent polls, they do show where the general assumption is towards victory.

And just to prove this even more, I've no link, but distinctly remember Hilary @ 1/8 (on paddypower) as I headed to bed on the 8th November 2016.

molloyjh

sydthebeat wrote: »

difference being Obama legislated that those numbers be transparent and reported

whereas Trump reversed that because he felt that reporting was too "distracting" and "superfluous"... such a nice guy....

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207

If the Chicago Sun Times is to be believed, Obama didn't offer that up voluntarily. He came under pressure to do it. So the difference there is Obama realised the importance of acquiescing to that pressure where as Trump simply didn't care. Trump is clearly far worse, but Obama isn't exactly role model material here either.

sydthebeat

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Yeah - I suppose we will never get the real figures for either president. While we discuss numbers on a spreadsheet you kinda forget the impact these events had/has. Weddings, Town meetings, family gatherings all 'accidentally' targeted and classed as collateral damage.

difference being Obama legislated that those numbers be transparent and reported

whereas Trump reversed that because he felt that reporting was too "distracting" and "superfluous"... such a nice guy....

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47480207

molloyjh

Utah_Saint wrote: »

Yeah - I suppose we will never get the real figures for either president. While we discuss numbers on a spreadsheet you kinda forget the impact these events had/has. Weddings, Town meetings, family gatherings all 'accidentally' targeted and classed as collateral damage.

And while Obama was certainly no saint in that regard, Trump has effectively removed almost every single control over these strikes and massively increased their usage. There can be no doubt who has had the worst impacts here. And no surprise either.

[Deleted User]

Deleted User wrote: »

:pac:

Sure, but then NBC have him at a 14 point gap, CNBC a 13 point gap and 538 an 11 point gap. I'm not posting an outlier or fake news, CNN is one of the most recognisable news brands in the world and it's poll yesterday seems to have drawn Trumps ire.

Utah_Saint

sydthebeat wrote: »

with respect, when you look at the numbers provided in that blog post... and see 2017 with a total of 4 strikes worldwide ... you have to ask yourself can that actually be honest?

then consider who the president is at that time, and ask yourself can this be honest?

then consider how trump has enacted legislation to keep drone strikes secret.....

Yeah - I suppose we will never get the real figures for either president. While we discuss numbers on a spreadsheet you kinda forget the impact these events had/has. Weddings, Town meetings, family gatherings all 'accidentally' targeted and classed as collateral damage.

sydthebeat

Deleted User wrote: »

Biden has pulled to a 14 point nationwide gap over Trump according to CNN. Trump used his limited speaking appearance yesterday to call polling 'fake news' which surprises no one but also highlights the precariousness of his position.

If he relapses in anyway that 14 point widens. He has gained no sympathy support at all so I suspect those who are voting against him are not for turning.

There probably won't be another debate, Harris is going to give Pence a serious black eye on Thursday and will likely launch a full attack on the Republican platform rather than engaging with Pence as he is such an empty fixture.

It's Biden or fraud at this point and the sooner this all ends the better, the misinformation is even leaking into the off topic thread at this stage.

yep

biden is at 1/2 in the betting, with trump at 13/8

at one stage yesterday Biden was at 4/9 which is the shortest he has been so far.

while betting odds arent polls, they do show where the general assumption is towards victory.

molloyjh

Utah_Saint wrote: »

I googled too...

https://www.cfr.org/blog/obamas-final-drone-strike-data

This blog was written on Trumps first day. I'm confused what exactly it is meant to prove.

Utah_Saint wrote: »

What i don't understand is how a number of different sources produce such a varied number of Strikes?

the details you provided would suggest Trump has a strike rate of 3 per day, every day for two years.

I dont think we know if there really is any significant difference in the figures given they are all measuring different things. The BBC article has a total number of strikes across the globe. The Chicago Sun Times article focuses solely on strikes in Yemen, Somalia & Pakistan. It goes on to mention a surge in strikes in Afghanistan, Iraq & Syria. These are the countries you'd expect to have the majority of the strikes carried out. So the Chicago Sun Times gives a tiny window into the true figures.

Also, as the Chicago Sun Times article mentions, changes in how these things are reported means they have little real clarity on what is happening. This would certainly lead to at least some discrepancies among different outlets.

sydthebeat wrote: »

with respect, when you look at the numbers provided in that blog post... and see 2017 with a total of 4 strikes worldwide ... you have to ask yourself can that actually be honest?

Check the date of the blog post.

[Deleted User]

Utah_Saint wrote: »

...

Your post reads like someone who is getting their information and world view from skewed left wing sources.....

Deleted User wrote: »

Biden has pulled to a 14 point nationwide gap over Trump according to CNN.

...

:pac:

OldRio

Utah_Saint wrote: »

excellent counter argument...

Others are doing a far better job than I.