gormdubhgorm wrote: » I don't. Even if I did you seem to think that Irish and Gaelic are interchangeable and unchanging. They're not. The Irish people are an ethnic group which overwhelmingly descends from Gaelic people, but which also assimilated English, Scots, Normans, Vikings etc. Those non-Gaelic peoples were always a tiny, tiny minority in Ireland though. To place things in their proper context, 1 in 5 of Ireland's population was born abroad - that is unheard of. You seem to believe the Irish are unchanging in your view Ireland is still based on the tribes which made up the misnomer - Celts! You are the one who had gone on about Irish as a people from the 5c and 6c. There has been 1000 years of intermarriage between the Normans, Anglo-Irish, Saxons and so on! You are parroting a Republican myth that was manufactured around the late 19th/ early 20th century! I find it hilarious you believe it! You are definitely having me on.
I don't. Even if I did you seem to think that Irish and Gaelic are interchangeable and unchanging. They're not. The Irish people are an ethnic group which overwhelmingly descends from Gaelic people, but which also assimilated English, Scots, Normans, Vikings etc. Those non-Gaelic peoples were always a tiny, tiny minority in Ireland though. To place things in their proper context, 1 in 5 of Ireland's population was born abroad - that is unheard of.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » I give up you are off the wall and have invented your own sense of reality with one contradiction after another. I doubt you are a floating voter you clearly have a hidden agenda in relation to the issue of multiculturalism. If you are young now I think you will not like the next 30 years. Because change is inevitable as Ireland matures as nation and moves away from old myths.
Deleted User wrote: » And... my last post to you. You reap what you sow. Your attitude and posting style on the thread has been pathetic and I see no point dealing with your ignorance. I'll leave it to others. But bear in mind, that it was you that was unable to form a coherent and logical argument... and also you that focused on working class people as being racist towards migrants. Your virtue signalling efforts need some serious work.
Kivaro wrote: » And there we have it ..... Over 20% of the population in Ireland were born outside of the country, but yet we are still in need of a ................ "revamp".
Yellow_Fern wrote: » No. Learn your history. The idea of the Celts is a 18th cen phenomenon. The Saxons did not arrive here in any great numbers. Vikings probably not either.
Gervais08 wrote: » Whet is your problem??? Why are you accusing folk of not seeing darker skinned Irish people as “really Irish” which is absolute bollocks. I’m white and because the mother couldn’t travel to have me here and we had to stay in the UK because of family circumstances I don’t have an Irish accent. Are you the arbiter of who people can think are Irish ?? Cos there are people who hear me talk and say I’m not - will you defend me as vehemently???
Sand wrote: » I mean the European ethnic group commonly described as Irish, who primarily descend from the same people who lived on the island of Ireland in the 5th-6th century and even before. Those Irish people. Would you be okay with that ethnic group becoming a minority in their own homeland? So long as they were displaced by better, more productive and cost effective workers?
gormdubhgorm wrote: » That is what the poster said though - 'Sand' it was daft stuff. At least you are making a coherent point. America, Australia, etc were being conquered and the indigenous populations were being wiped out. I have no dislike of mass immigration to Ireland because in my view Ireland has a very lukewarm (at best/confused at worst) sense of Irishness.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Of course there is a cohort who lump all immigrants together whether they are illegal or not. They get put in the same box. As for people accepting and integrating into Irish culture - argument. I always find it amusing. As the vast majority in Ireland converse in English as thier first language and are enveloped in English/British pass times/popular culture anyway! What's Irish culture these days? Religion? = No Language? = No
gormdubhgorm wrote: » I specifically mean a creation of a myth of an 'Irish race' to suit a Republican narrative. You only have to look at P.H.Pearce's comments at the time.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » This thread is proof of it many off the wall people with an off the wall mentality. Once they die off Ireland will settle down for the better. Might be the odd working class riot, but it will give an opportunity for a rebuild.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Did anyone here vote the National Party by any chance? Be honest!
Cordell wrote: » The French drink more than the Irish, and they have multiculturalism, plenty of it. So I guess it's just another problem multiculturalism failed to solve.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Multiculturalism will bring about the following in Ireland in my view. A reenergising of working-class Ireland (which is why many of this cohort are the most fearful of it).
Bambi wrote: » Are you going to get your calipers out to measure the working classes skulls on an ongoing basis to measure the improvements? Fierce bang of Tan of your posts these days tbh
Deleted User wrote: » Darfur-born Abdullahi El-Tom is director of training and strategic planning for the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), one of the main rebel factions that have been fighting the Sudanese government and their militias since 2003[/I]." "Militant groups JeM, Hizbul recruited children in Kashmir during clashes with security forces: UN report The United Nations report noted “grave violations” and said at least three incidents of recruitment and use of children by terrorist groups were reported in Jammu and Kashmir during clashes with the security forces." Awesome. Exactly the kind of migrant we want in this country.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » So, in summary overall. More multiculturalism will have positives outweighing the negatives. And Ireland will benefit in time. Give it another 20 years. It is inevitable really.
_Kaiser_ wrote: » You are correct in that if left unchecked, Ireland's flirtation with the "multiculturalism experiment" will have the country unrecognisable in 20 years. But few will call it a benefit or a success, no more than they do in the UK. France or other places where this short-sighted idiocy has been foisted upon the natives.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » You cannot stop Multiculturalism. Too late
gormdubhgorm wrote: » It may cause a few teething problems here and there. But the pros will outweigh the cons. The myth of an Irish race was used by the British to supress the Irish nation at times. But it was turned on its head in the Gaelic revival and the myth was made a source of pride. However, in the past 20 plus years Ireland has had to get used to other cultures and races coming here by choice to find a better way of life. Normally many Irish people left Ireland if they were able to before this and made lives for themselves in other countries. In the 19th century many of these Irish had no English. Yet today, Irish people who have relatives of those scattered around the world don’t want to let the foreigners into Ireland (who are looking for a better life) without a hint of irony or awareness. Despite many Irish people speaking predominately English and following English pop culture. Many of these hypocrites view themselves as the 'true Irish'. Which gives rise to racism and so on.https://www.irishtimes.com/news/doing-an-about-face-on-race-1.1304604 Emergence of other languages and giving them a stronger foothold in Ireland will be a positive. Which will help fill the void left by a hundred years of neglect of the Irish language. And Ireland’s sole dependence on English. It is only approximately 70,000 hardy souls who speak thier native Irish tongue regularly as thier first language. In the last 100 years or so this is not the fault of the British. But of the Irish people themseleves through a mixture of indifference, laziness, and embarrassment. It was Pearse and the IRB who politicised the Irish language and forced Douglas Hyde out of Conradh na Gaeilge. As Hyde wanted to keep CnaG apolitical. This was a travesty in my view as a language should not be politicised. A language should be used as intended for communication. Some might even find a new appreciation of Irish when they see what many more non- Irish nationals have with their own language. Ironically in my experience it is the Non-Irish nationals who have less baggage towards the Irish language and are more open to learning it and using it. It really puts the Irish natives to shame.Multiculturalism will solve another Irish issue a void left by the Catholic Church. Other cultures can bring thier religions with them. Hastening change. It was only as recently as 1972 that Bunreacht na hÉireann had enshrined the” special position of the Catholic Church.” A 41.1.2 The State recognises the special position of the Holy Catholic Apostolic and Roman Church as the guardian of the Faith professed by the great majority of the citizens. It was only in 2018 that baptism was removed as a prerequisite for entry to Irish Catholic schools!https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/baptism-barrier-to-be-removed-from-primary-schools-next-year-1.3649317 Another thing that will probably change with more multiculturalism is Ireland’s attitude to drink and the Irish pub culture. I always liken it to Ireland’s blind spot as American has their blind spot with guns. I understand the social aspect but is it necessary to drink at every social occasion? And have a social acceptance of drinking to excess? Some blame those Brits for it!https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23662096/ So, in summary overall. More multiculturalism will have positives outweighing the negatives. And Ireland will benefit in time. Give it another 20 years. It is inevitable really.
Sloan Hundreds Village wrote: » Perhaps consult yourself with the Poland, who for example will be approx 0.2% muslim by 2050, from 0.1% now (compare to Sweden, then no longer 'Sweden' as we know it at 20-30%)... The V4 group will have all their customs, values and cultural heritage largely in place. Ireland will likely by 4.6% muslim in 2050, not much, but still enough to affect or impede upon some daily experiences and forced changes of traditions.
TomTomTim wrote: » All your reasons seem to be motivated by a hatred of the CC and alcohol culture. You seem to think these reasons alone are enough to essentially wipe out the native Irish. Do you not see how ridiculous that is? The CC is all but dead, the secularists have won, so you're beating a dead horse in that regard. While our relationship with drink is hardly positive, I don't think it's so bad that the Irish deserve to be punished over it like you desire. As has been mentioned already, you're go beyond the madness of the average, as you essentially want cultural genocide due to some trivial issues you have with the Irish. Like most narcissists, you want everything your own way, and your willing to do immoral things just to get your way.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Would not bother me in the slightest.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Ireland is no longer really a Catholic nation. Abortion, divorce and regular mass attendance rates demonstrate this.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » If religion is your basis for Irish cultural values - it is on very shaky ground.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Would not bother me in the slightest. Ireland is no longer really a Catholic nation. Abortion, divorce and regular mass attendance rates demonstrate this. If religion is your basis for Irish cultural values - it is on very shaky ground.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » By "wiping out the native Irish" you essentially mean white? Yet you call me the narcissist? I searched the following in a google search after your post:"cultural genocide" "white race" immoral It returned the following:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racismhttps://www.researchgate.net/publication/249060035_'Breed_out_the_colour'_or_the_importance_of_being_whitehttps://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/241087406.pdf In my opinion if you were really worried about cultural genocide you would be not conversing in English as your mother tounge.
Sloan Hundreds Village wrote: » As you're likely not even Irish, or only on paper.
Culture isn't religion.
If you really wanted to consider something, where is the Christian movement now growing at its strongest? Yes, that's right ...IRAN (far east also), many have woken up to their old backwards ideolology, state oppression, and are now turning in droves to the Jesus man. A middle East 'revival' is now well underway, Islam will collapse in time thanks to it's own fault: the welcomeing of globalisation. There will likely be a major war soon that will kickstart this trend, and wipe out most of the M'East area.
Yellow_Fern wrote: » Speaking out of both sides of your mouth.
Yellow_Fern wrote: » If you look at data on what percent of people are willing to fight for their country, you will see ireland is off the charts compared to many of our European neighbours (mainly we are exceeded by the Scandinavian and Nordic countries and the Poles).https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/dikz9r/percentage_of_people_willing_to_fight_for_their/ I would argue this shows there is a very strong sense of Irishness, even if some deny it. In contrast in places like Germany national identity is perceived as toxic and far fewer are willing to fight for their country. I presume you believe then that Mexican culture is really just Spanish culture? Are Canadians just English? Most Nigerian media is printed in English so is Nigerian culture mainly English culture? In India, English is absolutely everywhere. Imagine telling everyone that there is no such thing as the local community and then later moaning that no one accepts you. Humility goes a long way.
gormdubhgorm wrote: » Irishness is basically a lost culture now and has copied and held on to many of Britain's despite nearly a century of freedom. No doubt you know people who hate the Irish language and say 'we' for British football teams. Yet are terrified of multiculturalism? Irish people saying they will fight for Ireland is a typical Irish persons over compensation to show how 'Irish' they are. Despite many barely speaking a word of Irish and being enveloped in British culture. Makes me laugh.
