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ESB eCars

liamog

Details from the dail on the eCars €10,000,000 expansion programme.

The key elements include six high speed charging hubs on motorways capable of charging eight vehicles simultaneously; 16 high speed charging hubs capable of charging four vehicles simultaneously; additional high power chargers at 34 current 50 kW locations; upgrading over 50 22 kW chargers to 50 kW, and replacing up to 264 locations with 528 charge points at the pre-existing pilot grade of 22 kW to next generation high reliability models.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-01-24/10/?fbclid=IwAR1eGLQjNFuywCoaB__FJADns7gNOD09DaR9XLueHAKZ8vljfd-kL-_LpDs

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slave1

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

It seems they do...

So anything from 3-8 cars charging simultaneously is a hub in eCars mind. And we already have over 50 of them apparently.

Just wondering what current eCars sites can charge 8 cars at once*? (I'm guessing this is 4 Twin AC22's in a carpark or something (airport maybe?))

*or are they just counting Ionity & Superchargers in their numbers??

Most I have observed is 6 at the Athlone Triple Head Fast charger which is next to two twin 22 charge points

slave1

ei9go wrote: »

I think there is no business model installing these hubs and that only for eCars they just wouldn't exist at all...

Tesla and Ionity disagree

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

Great they put in 2 for redundancy, but what's ESBs plan with these? Are these the start of a hub, or are they just installing a 150 + 50 at each charge point now? I mean is 150 + 50 the new norm for them? Does that mean Kilcullen, portlaoise and Galway plaza are not going to be hubs, and thus won't be filled out with more units? Or do ESB count 2 units as a hub and thus can get the headlines they desperately need?

It seems they do...

Progress to date

Over 50 x 3-8 vehicle charging hubs

A number of charging hubs have already been deployed and can be found - between junction 2 and 3, Kilcullen, Co Kildare (M9), - Galway Plaza, Junction 6, Kiltullagh, Co Galway (M6) and - Portlaoise Plaza, junction 17, Portlaoise (M7/8). The charging configuration at these locations are 1x50kW and 1x150kW and capable of charging up to 3 vehicles simultaneously.

So anything from 3-8 cars charging simultaneously is a hub in eCars mind. And we already have over 50 of them apparently.

Just wondering what current eCars sites can charge 8 cars at once*? (I'm guessing this is 4 Twin AC22's in a carpark or something (airport maybe?))

*or are they just counting Ionity & Superchargers in their numbers??

MJohnston

markpb wrote: »

It's entirely possible that other people have needs (or cars) that aren't the same as yours.

Pre-covid in my old ICE car, I used to drive from Dublin to various places around Ireland for one-day meetings for work.

I think a big question that's arisen recently, and will continue to get louder, is whether we really want to be enabling that kind of work style.

markpb

ei9go wrote: »

New cars now have such big batteries that they mostly can avoid public charging altogether. My eCars bill hasn't exceeded 5 euro per month and I have done over 10,000 kms since getting the ZE50 on the 1st May.

Recently drove from Bangor Northern Ireland ( 360 km to home). Left fully charged, 40 mins in Decathlon and then home with 20% remaining.

It's entirely possible that other people have needs (or cars) that aren't the same as yours.

Pre-covid in my old ICE car, I used to drive from Dublin to various places around Ireland for one-day meetings for work. Generally there's no destination charging at those places nor 22kW charging nearby (within walking distance). If the weather is poor or it's cold, I wouldn't always have enough range to get there and back on a single charge in my EV.

If you're going to Decathlon that has charging, that's great but it doesn't mean it's suitable for everyone. What would you have done if the charge points at Decathlon were full or not working?

zg3409

cruisey1987 wrote: »

You're correct, but no one will ever enforce that unfortunately

Separated parking areas is probably the best way to go, you either use a charge card or an intercom to open a barrier, and the operator can tell the ICE vehicles to park somewhere else

Japan had individual parking spot folding pole that were activated by the app. Such a thing would work great in multistorey car parks. A lifting barrier can be quite reliable and they are easily bypassed in case of fault by removing plastic horizontal stick or using bypass key and moving into open position. Ionity cashel really needs this. Better planning for parking spaces, putting then out of the way on the exit road at motorway services. Some motorway services have separate staff parking areas, so easily put in, in design phase. They could at least start with a no parking tow away in operation sign with a contact number for towing company. This is easily done in private car parks, with a deal with nearby toe truck. Just make sure they disconnect the 150kW cable from that full leaf first...

Spaces close to building are great and all, but not when they will be blocked. Spaces far away at end of one way system solve the problem mostly like at Coynes Cross motorway services.

ei9go

I think there is no business model installing these hubs and that only for eCars they just wouldn't exist at all.

New cars now have such big batteries that they mostly can avoid public charging altogether. My eCars bill hasn't exceeded 5 euro per month and I have done over 10,000 kms since getting the ZE50 on the 1st May.

Recently drove from Bangor Northern Ireland ( 360 km to home). Left fully charged, 40 mins in Decathlon and then home with 20% remaining.

The M9 is only 120 km long. There is no revenue case putting in more FCP's and there is no point putting in lots of chargers for legacy 20 kW cars.

Having said that one at Circle K at the N80 junction is probably the optimum place for an FCP.

liamog

At least it looks like for this "hub" that they've installed the chargers far enough apart for 4 cars to charge at the same time.

[Deleted User]

Black_Knight wrote: »

Great they put in 2 for redundancy, but what's ESBs plan with these? Are these the start of a hub, or are they just installing a 150 + 50 at each charge point now? I mean is 150 + 50 the new norm for them? Does that mean Kilcullen, portlaoise and Galway plaza are not going to be hubs, and thus won't be filled out with more units? Or do ESB count 2 units as a hub and thus can get the headlines they desperately need?

I can't see hubs from the ESB for years, typical semi state company dragging their heals.

They shouldn't, in my opinion, be installing any 50 kw charge points at Motorway service stations, it's a joke.

No plans for any other company as far as I'm aware to install new chargers either so looks like we're at the mercy of the ESB what a huge mistake allowing them to take control of the Network.

[Deleted User]

And still ignoring the M9 after Kilcullen. Joke.....

Black_Knight

Weird surface layout. Maybe it's the perspective of the camera, but it looks like they're really shallow parking spaces. Nice and awkward to, putting them in the corner so some folks will have to reverse all the ways into that "cul de sac" to use the high power unit. The EV parking spots have been pronounced forward to compensate for the space the units take up, but that just makes the road section narrower. A section which cars will be maneuvering in to get positioned correctly to charge.

Black_Knight

zg3409 wrote: »

I won't put this in the new charger threed as the site is not open yet, but in kells there is a new "motorway" service station and 1 x 150kW and 1 x 50kW has been installed. They are still installing paving and restaurant with 100 parking spaces is not yet open but might open during October so nearly there. Add that to the 44kW also already in kells, means kells has 3 44kW+ chargers all really code by each other, plus a few backup AC chargers. Photos and location on plugshare spp. Service station is called "Park Ri". Its very close to main Dublin Donegal south Enniskillen route so looks like good mid point for such trips.

At the other end of this route in Donegal south Laghy is planned to have a 150kW so hopefully this will be a great option on this route I regularly travel.

Great they put in 2 for redundancy, but what's ESBs plan with these? Are these the start of a hub, or are they just installing a 150 + 50 at each charge point now? I mean is 150 + 50 the new norm for them? Does that mean Kilcullen, portlaoise and Galway plaza are not going to be hubs, and thus won't be filled out with more units? Or do ESB count 2 units as a hub and thus can get the headlines they desperately need?

zg3409

I won't put this in the new charger threed as the site is not open yet, but in kells there is a new "motorway" service station and 1 x 150kW and 1 x 50kW has been installed. They are still installing paving and restaurant with 100 parking spaces is not yet open but might open during October so nearly there. Add that to the 44kW also already in kells, means kells has 3 44kW+ chargers all really code by each other, plus a few backup AC chargers. Photos and location on plugshare spp. Service station is called "Park Ri". Its very close to main Dublin Donegal south Enniskillen route so looks like good mid point for such trips.

At the other end of this route in Donegal south Laghy is planned to have a 150kW so hopefully this will be a great option on this route I regularly travel.

kanuseeme

cruisey1987 wrote: »

You're correct, but no one will ever enforce that unfortunately

Separated parking areas is probably the best way to go, you either use a charge card or an intercom to open a barrier, and the operator can tell the ICE vehicles to park somewhere else

Nah that's going to be an extra expense and another thing that can break down, clamp or towing only options.

Most people see an empty space and go for it, then when they see the charger they are already committed to it and will say "only a few minutes" others will not give a crap.

Anyway there is always a few who will plug in just for the handiness of the parking spot

:D:D

the_amazing_raisin

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

As soon as reported ICE’d, immediate tow away/lifted, and a fee of €150 to release the car...

You're correct, but no one will ever enforce that unfortunately

Separated parking areas is probably the best way to go, you either use a charge card or an intercom to open a barrier, and the operator can tell the ICE vehicles to park somewhere else

the_amazing_raisin

Silent Running wrote: »

A noise activated barrier. Anything coming in rattling and clattering and a post comes out of the ground blocking the way. Nice quiet EVs will whisper over it.

Nah, a Prius would be able to get past it

KCross

Silent Running wrote: »

A noise activated barrier. Anything coming in rattling and clattering and a post comes out of the ground blocking the way. Nice quiet EVs will whisper over it.

Kinda like something thats "Silent Running"!

AndyBoBandy

As soon as reported ICE’d, immediate tow away/lifted, and a fee of €150 to release the car...

Silent Running

cruisey1987 wrote: »

I think some sort of orbital railgun is the best solution here

A noise activated barrier. Anything coming in rattling and clattering and a post comes out of the ground blocking the way. Nice quiet EVs will whisper over it.

the_amazing_raisin

slave1 wrote: »

Pulled into the Galway Plaza today on the way home from a few days out and about, was going to go for the 150 if that was available or then the 50, 50 occupied and the 150 ICEd, fek it anyhow, as it turns out I had enough to get home.
Still, no point having these charge points if ICEd, clearer notice needs to be provided to ICE cars to tell them parking there is illegal...

I think some sort of orbital railgun is the best solution here

slave1

Pulled into the Galway Plaza today on the way home from a few days out and about, was going to go for the 150 if that was available or then the 50, 50 occupied and the 150 ICEd, fek it anyhow, as it turns out I had enough to get home.
Still, no point having these charge points if ICEd, clearer notice needs to be provided to ICE cars to tell them parking there is illegal...

AndyBoBandy

Gael23 wrote: »

Where are the 150kw chargers located?

Kilcullen - M9
Galway Plaza - M6
Portlaoise Plaza - M7

Gael23

Where are the 150kw chargers located?

zg3409

zoom_cool wrote: »

I seen the Kells 150Kw is installed in the new Circle K called Park RI probably new service station will be open in October

Is there a charger installed there now and not operational? I added site to plugshare as "coming soon" , but we know esb definition of hub and soon are flexible.

AndyBoBandy

zoom_cool wrote: »

I seen the Kells 150Kw is installed in the new Circle K called Park RI probably new service station will be open in October

Is that a motorway services? or is it within Kells?

edit, I see it now, i's slightly off the end of the motorway!!, not the best place for a Motorway Services!! but still, better than nothing on that route...

https://www.google.ie/maps/place/Park+R%C3%AD+-Destination+Stop+%26+Food+Court/@53.7224556,-6.9075257,5183m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m12!1m6!3m5!1s0x486757bebbb3079b:0xb0830b398b567434!2sALDI!8m2!3d53.7311266!4d-6.8898473!3m4!1s0x48675772fb3d2ca9:0x9283f08d37093820!8m2!3d53.7310693!4d-6.888934

zoom_cool

I seen the Kells 150Kw is installed in the new Circle K called Park RI probably new service station will be open in October

innrain

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

You gotta love whoever proof reads their website!!

While this can be overlooked as typo (not nice but happens), something like

"These hubs can provide up to 100km of driving range in as little as six minutes."
or
"Final sites are based on a range of factors including current charge point usage..."
show if nothing else haste. Hubs don't charge and locations of final sites will be decided based on ...
The ultimate is

"A number of charging hubs have already been deployed"

This number is so high and changing so fast that the author didn't want to be caught in publishing the wrong figure, hence decided it will beneficial for the reader not to know it. (although they are listed in the next paragraph).

Black_Knight

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Thread title needs updating...

eCars expansion 2019-2023

Interesting. It might be nice to put a pin in this thread or get a snapshot from Jan 2020 and see how things progress (or not) year on year.

[Deleted User]

It's a disaster control of the Network was given to the ESB this should be challenged as they have proved they are not capable.

All future hubs should be 150 Kw+ no more 50 Kw.... and should have at least 4 chargers per site.

liamog

It's inline with original announcement on the first page

six high speed charging hubs on motorways capable of charging eight vehicles simultaneously; 16 high speed charging hubs capable of charging four vehicles simultaneously; additional high power chargers at 34 current 50 kW locations;

Probably the first time we've seen the additional hpc's for the 34 described as a hub though, it's disappointing.