ShaneC1600 wrote: » They have identified nothing and no thought or purpose has gone into identifying reasons to have a greenway go through the towns and villages that the actual railway passes through. They have clearly not identified any reason other than there is a disused railway there, that in itself is not a reason to build a greenway.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » If the report confirms that rail services north of Athenry are not viable, then there being a disused railway becomes a good reason to build a greenway as there is really no other viable use.
ShaneC1600 wrote: » Not necessarily, if the report proposes that rail is not viable for whatever reason only then is it a good reason to carry out a feasibility study into a greenway.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » Thats probably how it has happened. Seeing as the Department has the report on the WRC, and they have recently given money for a feasibility study into a greenway, its not hard to fill in the blank that is the conclusions of the WRC report.
ShaneC1600 wrote: » Not necessarily, if the report proposes that rail is not viable for whatever reason only then is it a good reason to carry out a feasibility study into a greenway. I still think the towns along the route need to up their offering for tourists. Tuam for instance is a sin At the minute and the sooner the council advance with the rehabilitation of the town the better because at the minute there is nothing to attract someone passing on a bike to stop in or overnight. There is nothing stopping the development of the town in creating an attractive stop over right now, this could only be a good thing for the future greenway and/or/without a railway.
River Suir wrote: » ...if there isn't already an active campaign to have it reinstated as a railway....
westtip wrote: » After 40 years of line closure is that not a reason to build a greenway? It clearly is not going to be re-opened as a railway. That is the conclusion they came to in Waterford. If you want reasons suggest you study the economic argument for greenways there are numerous case studies, but hey we know all this don't we. It's all getting a bit he said she said he said she said.......Please spell out the economic argument for the railway and please spare us the phrase balanced regional development.
end of the road wrote: » the line has not been closed for 40 years, only the bit to sligo has, the rest had heavy freight trains up until the late 90s early 2000s.
Deleted User wrote: » Last normal passenger services ran 1976
TCDStudent1 wrote: » What do you think Tuam is lacking at the moment?
ShaneC1600 wrote: » Quite possible to be fair but until the report is released we don't know whats what. For all we know the report may not have fulfilled the brief and its back to square 1!
eastwest wrote: » Once the sugar factory finally closed in 1987, that was the end of the railway. Understandably enough, many people still hanker after a time when a heavily subsidised rail service rattled through Tuam, but you can't build government policy on nostalgia. As we will soon find out. They can't keep the latest report locked in a filing cabinet for ever.
westtip wrote: » So the line was open in the boom years and there was no market then for passenger services?
ShaneC1600 wrote: » An open train station ��
TCDStudent1 wrote: » Fair enough. However, I am genuinely curious about what you think Tuam can do to improve itself as a town (based on your earlier post).
ezstreet5 wrote: » Tuam needs what all other East Galway (and dare I say all rural) towns need? For the town centre: Owner occupiers with a bit of creativity. And if you want to let out your town-centre property, a bit of egalitarianism to demand nothing beyond a fair rent. Frequently, these crusty towns have a famine-era mindset that, "I own a building, I'm entitled to a living rent paid by the work of others." Those days are long gone, and sadly a bit of attrition is needed. Most of these folk are clutching at the staws of a greenway that may change their fortunes. It will not. What will change these communities is natural growth, and young families with workers that need to commute to jobs that can support a household. And dare I say that commuter rail service supports this more than an after-hours bicycle trail?
Pete_Cavan wrote: » I fully agree with the first part of your post but then it descends into the standard rhetoric we see in this thread. It presents a wonderful scenario but only a train service can provide that. In reality, rail services to Tuam will not run this decade, it is not factored into public spending plans and even if it did somehow jump hundreds of place up the priority list, it would take the rest of the decade in design, planning and construction before a train would run - best case scenario.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » If the goal is to provide sustainable commutes to jobs that can support a household, buses are the only answer and could be in place in months. A frequent bus service could be provided tomorrow connecting passengers to trains at Athenry, giving people their desired train link into Galway. Buses could be far more frequent than trains on the single track line to/from Tuam giving a better service.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » Ironically, the mindset here is not that different to the famine-era mindset described in the post above; "I'm entitled to a train service paid by the work of others." It has nothing to do with sustainability or community building or anything like that. If sustainability, community improvement, etc. were the goal, bus services would be implemented immediately, even as an interim measure.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » The railway crew here have no interest in buses though and actively oppose it because the success of such services at little cost would damage the case for spending €70m on rail and then subsidising it every year. We want sustainability but we will wait 10 or 20 years or more to get it.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » Nobody is claiming that the greenway will be an economic miracle for Tuam. It can however be delivered relatively quickly for little cost, can improve quality of life for people in the area and yes they do attract people from further afield which benefits the local economy. It would do far more good than waiting for a train that never arrives. Hopefully the report gets published soon so we can see the real cost and impact of a train service, followed quickly by the greenway feasibility so everyone can stop clutching at the straws.
ezstreet5 wrote: » Maybe conceptually, but in reality that would be a terrible service. The shuttle busses would either need to use the M17 and then backtrack 6 km to Athenry train station, or otherwise take R347, which is substandard. It would be slow, and cumbersome at both ends, and rail connections could not be guaranteed. I don't see how demanding rail service is relatable to the famine. I was referring to a landlord class believing they are entitled to rent. But again, there is a reason why nobody is seriously proposing a shuttle bus between Tuam and Athenry. .
ezstreet5 wrote: » There may be a few local authority planning applications for agricultural overpasses, but CIE could rebuild the trackbed today if they wanted to as exempted development. I think that's the path that was taken for Phase 1.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » I fully agree with the first part of your post but then it descends into the standard rhetoric we see in this thread. It presents a wonderful scenario but only a train service can provide that. In reality, rail services to Tuam will not run this decade, it is not factored into public spending plans and even if it did somehow jump hundreds of place up the priority list, it would take the rest of the decade in design, planning and construction before a train would run - best case scenario. If the goal is to provide sustainable commutes to jobs that can support a household, buses are the only answer and could be in place in months. A frequent bus service could be provided tomorrow connecting passengers to trains at Athenry, giving people their desired train link into Galway. Buses could be far more frequent than trains on the single track line to/from Tuam giving a better service. Ironically, the mindset here is not that different to the famine-era mindset described in the post above; "I'm entitled to a train service paid by the work of others." It has nothing to do with sustainability or community building or anything like that. If sustainability, community improvement, etc. were the goal, bus services would be implemented immediately, even as an interim measure. The railway crew here have no interest in buses though and actively oppose it because the success of such services at little cost would damage the case for spending €70m on rail and then subsidising it every year. We want sustainability but we will wait 10 or 20 years or more to get it. Nobody is claiming that the greenway will be an economic miracle for Tuam. It can however be delivered relatively quickly for little cost, can improve quality of life for people in the area and yes they do attract people from further afield which benefits the local economy. It would do far more good than waiting for a train that never arrives. Hopefully the report gets published soon so we can see the real cost and impact of a train service, followed quickly by the greenway feasibility so everyone can stop clutching at the straws.
Muckyboots wrote: » There are few ( other than a few diehard rail fanatics) seriously proposing a rail shuttle service from Tuam to Athenry for the connection issues you've correctly highlighted. Landlord classes should be charged full local authority rates on vacant premises- but that's a completely different issue. Frequently closed due to flooding.
end of the road wrote: » we have no interest in buses because we know they are only being used to try and get out of building rail, and as well as that they are likely only going to add to the traffic issues in galway rather then take away from them. not to mention that hardly anyone is going to use a bus to connect to a train at athenry, where as they are likely to use a train from tuam which would go directly to galway.
essentially we know what the actual game is here and we aren't falling for it, even if your bus proposal was successful it does not negate rail.
Muckyboots wrote: » Frequently closed due to flooding.
end of the road wrote: » we have no interest in buses because we know they are only being used to try and get out of building rail, and as well as that they are likely only going to add to the traffic issues in galway rather then take away from them. not to mention that hardly anyone is going to use a bus to connect to a train at athenry, where as they are likely to use a train from tuam which would go directly to galway. essentially we know what the actual game is here and we aren't falling for it, even if your bus proposal was successful it does not negate rail.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » If the Tuam line opened in the morning, trains from Tuam which would not go directly to Galway. There isn't the capacity on the single track, unless you think trains from Tuam should take priority over Dublin - Galway or Galway - Limerick trains. Direct trains from Tuam wont happen until the mainline is double tracked, until then it is a shuttle. A bus using M17 & M6 from Tuam to Athenry would be fast, some bus priority measures in Athenry town would really help though. It obviously wouldn't add to Galway traffic as it doesn't go near the city, the bus passengers still get into the city on a train. The refusal to even consider a bus connection to Athenry really exposes the rail campaign, this has nothing to do with sustainable transport, allowing young families with workers commute to jobs that can support a household or any of that. If that were the case, you'd be calling for the fastest implementable service, particularly as bus does not negate rail, as you said yourself. A bus service has nothing to do with getting out of building rail, no building rail is happening with or without the bus service.
intellectual dosser wrote: » It has been said many times that double tracking Galway to Athenry is necessary with or without WRC Phases 2+. Like so many posters on this forum you take a railway from Athenry to Tuam/Claremorrie/Colooney in isolation, yet of course you've felt free to make changes in Athenry to accommodate your bus solution...the mind boggles.
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