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Sinn Fein Omerta

Pintman Paddy Losty

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/sinn-f%C3%A9in-witness-consulted-party-over-aaron-brady-case-before-speaking-to-garda%C3%AD-1.4332502

Very strange case here. A witness in a murder trial of a member of AGS refused to speak to police without first checking with the powers that be in Sinn Fein.

That's not normal behaviour for a political party. That's how criminal organisations like the Mafia operate.

Anyone else think this is disgraceful carry on?

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maccored

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I hope you got permission from the Ard Comhairle before posting here?

I would hate to see members dragging the parties' good name and reputation through the dirt, not fair on upstanding members who haven't a rashers what they're really voting for?

Ducky air law etc etc , up the republic and all that yeh?

Just to clarify - you are telling me I needed permission to post something?

Thats what you are saying, yes?

I can categorically tell you yer talking bollocks. Or else you think you are hilarious (that didnt work either Im afraid)

[Deleted User]

Bowie wrote: »

I've no idea what the situation is with any party. We don't know he was made to. I would suggest you are free to do so should you wish.
You can call your Granny or pal too I'd imagine. It's not something I would do. Likely I'd contact friend or family myself. It's unlikely people wouldn't talk to anybody.
If SF are found to have obstructed justice those responsible should be held to account.
Here we have another case of the finer details of a case being leaked. I don't recall any stories about who a witness did or did not contact before speaking with the police. Accused folk, yes. This reads like the Times trying to link SF to the murder, even though the chap was a witness against. It's of little consequence. This kind of spin is tired and dried up. The lads will get a few hours of japes before we get back to the troubles etc.

that shrug of the shoulders and vague "I dunno" doesnt really work when you just stated;

Bowie wrote: »

You'll find many senior or long time political party affiliates will touch base with HQ before possibly involving the party name in something or even looking for legal advice.

So either you know or you dont and your original comment is suggesting you know.

[Deleted User]

RandomViewer wrote: »

Does the Garda leaking this give Brady grounds for appeal?

no. He can only appeal under certain circumstances. The case if over, people can speak about it

RandomViewer

Does the Garda leaking this give Brady grounds for appeal?

[Deleted User]

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So you have assumed it was 'permission' and not 'reassurance'.

Excellent.

because thats what it was. You can claim 'reasurrance' if you mean 'Reassurance that the party and its hidden friends wouldnt kneecap him as a result'. If thats what you mean then yeah, reassurance

FrancieBrady

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I know.... it is so unfair, I wish the cops would play by the rules more, bastards aren't they?

Cop out answer as usual...excuse the pun and all that.

TomTomTim

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It was the Gardai who leaked this info in the middle of an ongoing case when they are actively looking for witnesses to come forward. Why? To try to shame SF.

Weren't you pretending to not be a SF supporter for years on here?

IAMAMORON

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It was the Gardai who leaked this info in the middle of an ongoing case when they are actively looking for witnesses to come forward. Why? To try to shame SF.

I know.... it is so unfair, I wish the cops would play by the rules more, bastards aren't they?

FrancieBrady

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Throw as much mud as you like. I have no dislike of any ethnic minorities.

You are the person spoofing about the mafia, the IRA and schoolkids in the same sentence. Anything to clear the party " name ".

Shows what an undemocratic shambles Sinn Féin really are when they have to resort to shaming everything else to counteract their own litany of unending mire. Their members cannot even have an honest conversation or discussion.

You must get tired, do they not give you a holiday at all?

It was the Gardai who leaked this info in the middle of an ongoing case when they are actively looking for witnesses to come forward. Why? To try to shame SF.

Pkiernan

If the IRA-SF were in power, would they appoint a Minister for Truth?

James Brown

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Throw as much mud as you like. I have no dislike of any ethnic minorities.

You are the person spoofing about the mafia, the IRA and schoolkids in the same sentence. Anything to clear the party " name ".

Shows what an undemocratic shambles Sinn Féin really are when they have to resort to shaming everything else to counteract their own litany of unending mire. Their members cannot even have an honest conversation or discussion.

You must get tired, do they not give you a holiday at all?

You didn't comprehend my easy to read comment even upon quoting it.

Now you're off on a rant

IAMAMORON

Bowie wrote: »

I don't see how your dislike of ethnic minorities plays into this.

Can you not read chief or are you just making up ****e?

Throw as much mud as you like. I have no dislike of any ethnic minorities.

You are the person spoofing about the mafia, the IRA and schoolkids in the same sentence. Anything to clear the party " name ".

Shows what an undemocratic shambles Sinn Féin really are when they have to resort to shaming everything else to counteract their own litany of unending mire. Their members cannot even have an honest conversation or discussion.

You must get tired, do they not give you a holiday at all?

James Brown

FrancieBrady wrote: »

SF's angle is that a Detective Inspector went to Adams for help.

If true that is pretty seismic really. The Adams did help and reassured the witness and he testified and gave the Gardai the break in the case.

It's odd, if true, that the witness contacted SF at all, never mind why.
The 'disgraceful' element, as the OP put it, for me is that this made a top story and that once again the Garda are leaking stories with a political angle.
As you say the story could have been given a positive spin for SF however the matter of it being leaked remains.

seamus

John Hutton wrote: »

If I was privy to information that could jail one member of a large murderous gang I would seek advice from people I trust in the large murderous gang before giving a statement to the Gardai.

FYP

I trust my Dad, but I don't think he'd be much help if I was trying to decide whether testifying against a gang member is a good idea. I'd search out someone who knew the gang well enough to clear it with them.

Just like this witness did.

smurgen

Bambi wrote: »

I seem to remember taking flak for posting something about never voluntarily becoming involved with AGS because they are dangerous

Well, here is a classic example why, fella does the right thing, gives vital evidence that convicts a cop killer and still gets f****d over by a garda just because it suited his book to f**k him over.

Nail on the head. Let's not forget the head of the gardai Drew Harris said that Mary Lou was the head of the IRA army council with no evidence at the height of the election and was not questioned about this to a great extent. This was repeated by Leo at the time and not one shred of evidence produced. He should have been forced to resign for interference in the election. He clearly is so biased against SF that he would work with Government parties to undermine our democratic elections.

https://www.thejournal.ie/harris-ira-sinn-fein-comments-5023259-Feb2020/

FrancieBrady

SF's angle is that a Detective Inspector went to Adams for help apparently.

If true that is pretty seismic really. That Adams did help and reassured the witness and he testified and gave the Gardai the break in the case, is really a step forward.

A Garda releasing this info is a step back though and a betrayal of trust.

That would be my read of it, if that is the way it happened.

RandomViewer

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Of course, I distinctly remember Noonan being knee deep in Kidnapping, extortion, kneecapping and murdering civilians during his career as a free state TD. :rolleyes:

Look up Bridget Mc Cole his behaviour was directly responsible for her premature death , should have been thrown out of the Dail back then, oh and ask Garda Williams was Baldy a person of interest in the mid 90s, Youve heard the same rumours as everyone else.

James Brown

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Condones an Italian criminal organisation with a reputation for Kidnapping, Extortion and Capital Murder. Responsible for the murder of thousands of Italian citizens. Compares it to the IRA.

Then compares it with telling tales to the school principle?

The party "name"..... I will go into hysterical convulsions soon enough, I reckon that ship has sailed, keep it up though, ducky air law etc.

I don't see how your dislike of ethnic minorities plays into this.

Can you not read chief or are you just making up ****e?

IAMAMORON

RandomViewer wrote: »

Michael Noonan was minister for justice in the 1980s, can't get much lower than that.

Of course, I distinctly remember Noonan being knee deep in Kidnapping, extortion, kneecapping and murdering civilians during his career as a free state TD. :rolleyes:

RandomViewer

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

How could these lowlifes ever be allowed hold the justice portfolio in government?

Michael Noonan was minister for justice in the 1980s, can't get much lower than that.

FrancieBrady

Hubertj wrote: »

to clarify, there was a terrorist campaign, not a war/ conflict.

Secondly, i think the story is much ado about nothing. The guy did the right thing giving evidence. However, if i was stupid enough to be a member of SF, i would likely talk to the party about it before going to AGS. That is understandable given the history and SF IRA links to crime etc.

The Gardai leaking info for political purposes though...understandable given their history?

The alrming thing about this is the feigned outrage/surprise that some don't trust the Gardai or PSNI yet.

Will this help in building trust? I doubt it.

Hubertj

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No it isn't right.
Lots of things about a post conflict/war society are not right.

The fact is that large parts of communities that went through the conflict/war still do not trust the gardai.
Many in what is considered normal society do not trust the Gardai and frankly, this further evidence of leaking info for political purposes is very concerning to me. How many times does it need to happen until people ask questions?

to clarify, there was a terrorist campaign, not a war/ conflict.

Secondly, i think the story is much ado about nothing. The guy did the right thing giving evidence. However, if i was stupid enough to be a member of SF, i would likely talk to the party about it before going to AGS. That is understandable given the history and SF IRA links to crime etc.

IAMAMORON

Bowie wrote: »

The Mafia never tell their members to talk to the police. Also he was a witness against Brady.
You'll find many senior or long time political party affiliates will touch base with HQ before possibly involving the party name in something or even looking for legal advice.
I certainly don't find it disgraceful.
Even well to do students go to the school principle before the police.

The Times reporting like its a thing is merely another hatchet job.

Condones an Italian criminal organisation with a reputation for Kidnapping, Extortion and Capital Murder. Responsible for the murder of thousands of Italian citizens. Compares it to the IRA.

Then compares it with telling tales to the school principle?

The party "name"..... I will go into hysterical convulsions soon enough, I reckon that ship has sailed, keep it up though, ducky air law etc.

[Deleted User]

"nothing to see here"

lol ye are gas lads.

the next little thing worth having a dig at from the parties that actually run the country will be worth twenty threads from the usual accounts, but this is not worth a mention.

be funny if it wasnt actually deeply serious

James Brown

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

No sorry, a ff member does not need to contact head office to get permission to make a statement to police. Absolutely not.

Of they are a suspect they may seek legal advise. If it's a party issue, they will take to senior people but a witness in a murder? No.

I'll defend sf here though, they appear to have made active effort to facilitate the investigation team.

I've no idea what the situation is with any party. We don't know he was made to. I would suggest you are free to do so should you wish.
You can call your Granny or pal too I'd imagine. It's not something I would do. Likely I'd contact friend or family myself. It's unlikely people wouldn't talk to anybody.
If SF are found to have obstructed justice those responsible should be held to account.
Here we have another case of the finer details of a case being leaked. I don't recall any stories about who a witness did or did not contact before speaking with the police. Accused folk, yes. This reads like the Times trying to link SF to the murder, even though the chap was a witness against. It's of little consequence. This kind of spin is tired and dried up. The lads will get a few hours of japes before we get back to the troubles etc.

Dyr

I seem to remember taking flak for posting something about never voluntarily becoming involved with AGS because they are dangerous

Well, here is a classic example why, fella does the right thing, gives vital evidence that convicts a cop killer and still gets f****d over by a garda just because it suited his book to f**k him over.

FrancieBrady

Ush1 wrote: »

I wouldn't go to a politician about a crime I witnessed so I can't answer that.

Do you think it's right that people are effectively vetting information through politicians(who you said aren't trustworthy anyway) than to AGS?

No it isn't right.
Lots of things about a post conflict/war society are not right.

The fact is that large parts of communities that went through the conflict/war still do not trust the gardai.
Many in what is considered normal society do not trust the Gardai and frankly, this further evidence of leaking info for political purposes is very concerning to me. How many times does it need to happen until people ask questions?

Ush1

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Ideally yes.
But the simple fact of an abnormal society (and it is still in some quarters) that the Gardai and PSNI are not trusted.

Would YOU be happy if a Garda did this to you for what can only be political purposes.
If somebody broke the law here in how this was handled the appropriate action was the Gardai to take them to court. Not leak info about an ongoing case to the media.

I wouldn't go to a politician about a crime I witnessed so I can't answer that.

Do you think it's right that people are effectively vetting information through politicians(who you said aren't trustworthy anyway) than to AGS?

FrancieBrady

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

No sorry, a ff member does not need to contact head office to get permission to make a statement to police. Absolutely not.

Of they are a suspect they may seek legal advise. If it's a party issue, they will take to senior people but a witness in a murder? No.

I'll defend sf here though, they appear to have made active effort to facilitate the investigation team.

So you have assumed it was 'permission' and not 'reassurance'.

Excellent.

[Deleted User]

Bowie wrote: »

The Mafia never tell their members to talk to the police. Also he was a witness against Brady.
You'll find many senior or long time political party affiliates will touch base with HQ before possibly involving the party name in something or even looking for legal advice.
I certainly don't find it disgraceful.
Even well to do students go to the school principle before the police.

The Times reporting like its a thing is merely another hatchet job.

No sorry, a ff member does not need to contact head office to get permission to make a statement to police. Absolutely not.

Of they are a suspect they may seek legal advise. If it's a party issue, they will take to senior people but a witness in a murder? No.

I'll defend sf here though, they appear to have made active effort to facilitate the investigation team.