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ESB eCars

liamog

Details from the dail on the eCars €10,000,000 expansion programme.

The key elements include six high speed charging hubs on motorways capable of charging eight vehicles simultaneously; 16 high speed charging hubs capable of charging four vehicles simultaneously; additional high power chargers at 34 current 50 kW locations; upgrading over 50 22 kW chargers to 50 kW, and replacing up to 264 locations with 528 charge points at the pre-existing pilot grade of 22 kW to next generation high reliability models.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-01-24/10/?fbclid=IwAR1eGLQjNFuywCoaB__FJADns7gNOD09DaR9XLueHAKZ8vljfd-kL-_LpDs

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obi604

does anyone have any graphs to show usage of the public chargers?

im guessing on the 10th August, the 7 and 22kw ones just took a massive plummet

AndyBoBandy

Tesco Artane Castle is installed about a week now, so should be coming online soon enough.

That will plug a fairly big gap in the Artane/Beaumont area.....

Black_Knight

Nuphor wrote: »

2x SCPs in New Ross seem to have disappeared from eCars.

I see them. Off south street, and Barrack lane.

Nuphor

2x SCPs in New Ross seem to have disappeared from eCars.

zg3409

Black_Knight wrote: »

Looking at my stats, and ESBs map, where are these 1100 public charge points they claim?

They do count one pedestal with 2 connectors as 2 charge points. ESB listed Nissan garages with chargers and hotels where they fitted 3.7kW charge points on their website.

There was talk of interoperability between esb and easygo fobs and cards but nothing works yet. Easygo app lists esb and Ionity sites.

The esb chargers at hotels are typically 3.7kW Max, type 2 socket, very old, with many not working for years. They have no billing capability and are not monitored.

Some hotel sites have added non esb units or replaced the esb one. As said plugshare app often has real user status on these sites. I would like to see total stats for public chargers including easygo vs number of petrol stations

Parking in Bray is free while actively charging with parking warden issuing tickets. Once charging stops you may get a parking ticket. Parking fees for other spots are quite low with day rates on seafront north end car park. There may not be much of a saving compared to paying a couple of euro to park.

Wicklow town has different parking rules. They really need a sign per charger with parking rules

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

Lost 2 slow chargers. Only 580 reported now vs 582 yesterday. Must try figure out way to narrow down what one has disappeared.

Could be losing more than 2 on some days as the currently being installed Tesco ones come online...

Have the number of AC chargers increased over the last few weeks as Tesco ones came online? I know of Rush, and wasn't there one installed in Blanchardstown as well?

Black_Knight

Main Street, Bailieborough, Cavan marked for replacement.

Lost 2 slow chargers. Only 580 reported now vs 582 yesterday. Must try figure out way to narrow down what one has disappeared.

EDIT: Had a quick look but can't spot them. I'll try a better search later, and double check the code.

Black_Knight

Latest dashboard I keep regular eyes on:

Stats up the top go green if they increase, red if they decrease. Thresholds are manual, but only added it today so I'll see what I can do about that.

Black_Knight

liamog wrote: »

*Driivz - The platform eCars use categorises them that way.
Have you figured out the difference between SLOW and SEMI-SLOW sites?

SLOW looks to just be the non ESB branded ones. Like those in Q-park, or in hotels. The purple markers on the map. Nothing to say they're all actually slower than the semi-slow. I seen the odd 11kW "SLOW" charge point.
SEMI-SLOW is the ESB supplied 7kW-22kW units.

innrain wrote: »

I know you've told me before how you do it but it's over my level. When they had that kml file it was much simpler and I made a script to build a db with the status of each charger.
So for the layman like me on the desktop browser if you zoom out the map is grouping the charges. Filter and easy count

CCS 84 ecars (86 with 3rd party)
CHAdeMO 96 ecars (108 with 3rdparty)
Type 2 482 ecars (598 with 3rd party)
AC43 75 ecars (77 with 3rd party)

You can't really add them up as they are in different combinations.

That KML file was a disaster. Wild west decoding that thing!

I'll explain basically what i'm doing:
When you browse that map, and open a single charge point, a call is made to their backend to get information (name, address, speed, availability etc.) on that charge point. Charge points are conveniently numbered sequentially so i'm just looping from 0 to X so I loop over every charge point (hopefully, it's not an exact science, as i'm just hoping that every charge point ID falls within the range i'm searching). Every call returns data, or not. For the ones which do, I store that data, and I do an extra call for its peak time usage (but I'm seeing less and less value in that). I also increment a counter for each speed of the charge point it finds. I store all this data in a time series database (holds snapshots of the data over time, so I can see how things have changed over time) and build graphs or metrics etc for whatever I find.

TLDR: I iterate over every charge point ESB returns on that map (assuming they display every charge point) and count each time a particular speed of charge point is found.

innrain

Black_Knight wrote: »

Added some more stats. Currently 113 Fast charge points, and 582 slow charge points. With an additional 119 3rd party charge points on the Ecars map. I'm tracking this daily now, so it'll be interesting to see how it changes over time. Pity I missed the recent glut of DC upgrades and HPCP installs.

Any idea what the criteria for those 3rd party charge points showing up on the ecars map is? EasyGo for example are not shown. Kinda annoying the randomness of what charge points are shown based on what app you're using.

I know you've told me before how you do it but it's over my level. When they had that kml file it was much simpler and I made a script to build a db with the status of each charger.
So for the layman like me on the desktop browser if you zoom out the map is grouping the charges. Filter and easy count

CCS 84 ecars (86 with 3rd party)
CHAdeMO 96 ecars (108 with 3rdparty)
Type 2 482 ecars (598 with 3rd party)
AC43 75 ecars (77 with 3rd party)

You can't really add them up as they are in different combinations.

liamog

Black_Knight wrote: »

Ecars categorizes them as FAST, SEMI-SLOW and SLOW, I just pull everything on the ecars map site. FAST includes the new 150kW ones

*Driivz - The platform eCars use categorises them that way.
Have you figured out the difference between SLOW and SEMI-SLOW sites?

innrain

Black_Knight wrote: »

Added some more stats. Currently 113 Fast charge points, and 582 slow charge points. With an additional 119 3rd party charge points on the Ecars map. I'm tracking this daily now, so it'll be interesting to see how it changes over time. Pity I missed the recent glut of DC upgrades and HPCP installs.

Any idea what the criteria for those 3rd party charge points showing up on the ecars map is? EasyGo for example are not shown. Kinda annoying the randomness of what charge points are shown based on what app you're using.

In the early days ESB ran a program similar to Tesla destination chargers. So most of the 3rd party chargers on their map are 3.7 kW old style esb chargers which probably don't exist or don't work. You can't rely on them without checking on plugshare.
https://www.siliconrepublic.com/earth-science/100-irish-green-hotels-to-get-e-car-charge-points

Black_Knight

McGiver wrote: »

Goingelectric.de shows 92 (CCS), so I wonder where's the rest. Did you include Superchargers CCS?

Ecars categorizes them as FAST, SEMI-SLOW and SLOW, I just pull everything on the ecars map site. FAST includes the new 150kW ones

McGiver

Black_Knight wrote:

Added some more stats. Currently 113 Fast charge points, and 582 slow charge points. With an additional 119 3rd party charge points on the Ecars map. I'm tracking this daily now, so it'll be interesting to see how it changes over time. Pity I missed the recent glut of DC upgrades and HPCP installs.

Goingelectric.de shows 92 (CCS), so I wonder where's the rest. Did you include Superchargers CCS?

AndyBoBandy

Kramer wrote: »

Is it free to park in Bray if plugged in? I usually pay for parking there but if it's free, I'll bring my PHEV in future.
If the chargers are near the promenade, even better :pac:.

PlugShare says parking is free, so I’ll take that as gospel.

Even though you’ve to pay to charge now, it could still work out cheaper to pay for charging if parking comes free....

Kramer

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

was in Bray today........Yes, I was primarily looking for the parking space

Is it free to park in Bray if plugged in? I usually pay for parking there but if it's free, I'll bring my PHEV in future.
If the chargers are near the promenade, even better :pac:.

Black_Knight

Black_Knight wrote: »

Looking at my stats, and ESBs map, where are these 1100 public charge points they claim?
Rough estimates on the map suggest 550 odd ESB managed locations, granted some will have multiple units per site, and my own stats I scrape from the site say the total count of charge points on the ecars site (purple/3rd party ones included) is 814. Do they count each connector as a "charge point"?

https://esb.ie/ecars/our-network

Added some more stats. Currently 113 Fast charge points, and 582 slow charge points. With an additional 119 3rd party charge points on the Ecars map. I'm tracking this daily now, so it'll be interesting to see how it changes over time. Pity I missed the recent glut of DC upgrades and HPCP installs.

Any idea what the criteria for those 3rd party charge points showing up on the ecars map is? EasyGo for example are not shown. Kinda annoying the randomness of what charge points are shown based on what app you're using.

kanuseeme

Irishjg wrote: »

Lol yeah ... god forbid they might have to use any of the 8 gallons of Dino juice sitting in the fuel tank. ��

8 gallons is too much, it would go bad in the tank, I only put about 5 gallons in, you know for long trips or when 3 cars are queuing at one charger, charger is not working,iced,no time to charge or somebody is simply using them.:D:D:D:D

Irishjg

liamog wrote: »

The low electric range means they need to charge more often.

Lol yeah ... god forbid they might have to use any of the 8 gallons of Dino juice sitting in the fuel tank. &#55357;&#56841;

Black_Knight

Looking at my stats, and ESBs map, where are these 1100 public charge points they claim?
Rough estimates on the map suggest 550 odd ESB managed locations, granted some will have multiple units per site, and my own stats I scrape from the site say the total count of charge points on the ecars site (purple/3rd party ones included) is 814. Do they count each connector as a "charge point"?

https://esb.ie/ecars/our-network

liamog

Irishjg wrote: »

PHEVs seem to be magnetised to AC charging point car spaces.

The low electric range means they need to charge more often.

Irishjg

PHEVs seem to be magnetised to AC charging point car spaces.

AndyBoBandy

was in Bray today and said I’d use one of the AC 22’s as 3 of the 4 on the strand were showing as available.....

1st twin unit did indeed have 1 slot available, however the van in the pic meant you’d be lucky to get a Leaf or Zoe in....

On to the next twin unit as both showing as available in the app....
Merc PHEV and an electric van plugged in but not charging.....

Yes, I was primarily looking for the parking space, but I was willing to pay the €0.26 per kW it would have cost me to charge, so lost revenue for eCars...

the_amazing_raisin

Goldmark wrote: »

Interesting that they are using storage solution on site. It may be just to accommodate the solar being produced. What are the technical issues with using battery storage on site to reduce the electricity connection costs. It seems an obvious solution for sites with limited connection outputs but still I have not come across it being used as a solution?

Technical problems, not many. The batteries are already DC so you don't even need to convert to AC first

Financial problems, lots, it's a pretty big expense to build a battery storage unit on top of existing costs of the chargers and infrastructure

I remember Fully Charged did an episode in Dundee where they had done something similar. The battery unit there was used to store solar but also used to supply the peak demand from the chargers to reduce the electricity costs.

My (limited) understanding is that business electricity costs are based on rate of electricity usage and not just fixed cost per kWh like what you and I have. If you try to pull 300kW from the grid then your rate per kWh goes up than if you're using 100kW

Having said that, batteries are making their way into fast chargers. Tesla have used them on some of their superchargers, but I've no idea how widespread they are.

VW also demoed a DC charger a while back with a built in battery. The battery had enough to supply a couple of cars and would recharged from a limited grid connection (or even no connection)

https://insideevs.com/news/394881/volkswagen-mobile-charging-stations-wolfsburg/

So basically, it's going to happen. Just waiting for a good supply of second life batteries to become available

MJohnston

Goldmark wrote: »

What are the technical issues with using battery storage on site to reduce the electricity connection costs.

I don't know about any technical issues, but major practical problems are that battery storage is an extra expense, and it takes up a lot of space.

KCross

Goldmark wrote: »

Interesting that they are using storage solution on site. It may be just to accommodate the solar being produced. What are the technical issues with using battery storage on site to reduce the electricity connection costs. It seems an obvious solution for sites with limited connection outputs but still I have not come across it being used as a solution?

I think Tesla do it in some of their Supercharger locations.

Goldmark

https://www.newmobility.global/smart-infrastructure/freewire-deploys-ultrafast-ev-charging-convenience-stores-california/

Then the next article I see. There is always someone innovating.

Goldmark

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Meanwhile in countries that actually care about their charging network:

https://www.electrive.com/2020/08/11/scotland-opens-largest-ev-charging-park-yet/

Seriously considering moving to Scotland now, if only I could understand the language

Interesting that they are using storage solution on site. It may be just to accommodate the solar being produced. What are the technical issues with using battery storage on site to reduce the electricity connection costs. It seems an obvious solution for sites with limited connection outputs but still I have not come across it being used as a solution?

Black_Knight

liamog wrote: »

Clifden is taking ages, maybe he's in an electric van and can't make it that far :P

From what i've experienced they're just local contracted engineers. Got chatting the engineer in Cork back when the unit wouldn't let go of my cable. He disclosed his inner monolog of whether he'd update that unit or not that weekend to me. Sure enough, he did. Said he had a few in the van, he might upgrade the unit in skib too. Insightful, but I just wanted my cable released.

TLDR: Engineer seemed to make up his own mind as to when he'd update a charge point. I'm sure ESB gives them a list though.

liamog

Black_Knight wrote: »

Only Clifden and McDonalds in Portadown marked to be replaced at the moment.

Clifden is taking ages, maybe he's in an electric van and can't make it that far :P