Superfoods wrote: » Why are you making stuff up?
FrancieBrady wrote: » On the basis that most organisations have had issues pre-awareness days with abuse and predation. I am not aware that the incidence is any higher in the IRA than it is in like size organisations or demographic groups. It's an opinion, I have no data to back it up, if you can enlighten us with data (not breathless 'I know of 40 cases'Regina Doherty allegations/what turned out to be fantasy/lies) work away on that one. Most armies if not all, require a thug element to engage in what they do...that is the reality the world over. They don't have special army police for nothing. The IRA was no different, I fully agree that thugs attached themselves. Good to see you agreeing that there is no way of knowing how much infiltration happened. I live in a border town well known as a republican stronghold, had several bombs during the troubles and notable participants living in it...I would know most people in it and around the area and I can genuinely say that all through the troubles I was never aware of one of these 'overlord' figures, controlling it. I think this is another myth blown out of proportion.
SafeSurfer wrote: » “Before he died”! He didn’t die, he was murdered. Gardaí are conducting a criminal investigation in which the chief suspect is still in custody abroad. Not “preventing” an inquest for the craic. So your theory is that the Sunday World photographer did it, is that it?
RandomViewer wrote: » 23 times?
SafeSurfer wrote: » So the idea of local IRA godfathers such as Slab Murphy being powerful and feared figures in their communities, is, not just blown out of proportion, but like informers and sexual abuse in the republican organisation, “this is another myth blown out of proportion”. So the notion of IRA informers, IRA sexual abuse and local IRA godfathers are not just exaggerated but are a MYTH? A widely held but false belief? Is that your core belief? Your house is close to the border and your experience of not being aware of any powerful local republican figures is certainly at odds with many other people living in similar situations. Confirmation bias may be at play.
FrancieBrady wrote: » What am I 'making up'?
Superfoods wrote: » So far the majority of the information in your posts is suspect. You claim to live beside the border but provide no information you can back up. Everything is vague "Oh i know this or that". You deny all existence of the PIRA and now trying to say they have no "overlords". That is a lie. The PIRA itself was build based on an army. Do you think an army don't have commanders etc? what exactly do you think Gerry was doing when he commanded people to be killed? he was just one of the grunts?
Maybe nobody else on this forum lives along the border area and that's why you are coming up with these stories. I just think your no more living on the border area than you are living on the moon
FrancieBrady wrote: » I was totally aware of 'republican figures', but this 'community living in fear stuf' is a complete and utter nonsense here. In respect of the town I lived in for the best part of 50 years I am not aware of a single 'punishment beating/shooting' or a 'republican figure laying down the law as you say was widespread. It's an easy thing to print and say, much harder to find evidence of it being a widespread phenomena. Punishment beatings happened in certain areas, we all know that, but whole communities living in fear across NI and along the border does not for a minute match the reality, it's a gross distortion of the truth, just as representing the area as 'lawless' is.
Superfoods wrote: » Are you having a laugh? how are you coming up with this stuff? so nobody North or South of border lived in fear?
FrancieBrady wrote: » Where did I say that?
jm08 wrote: » More John Hume I think. Very influential in Irish America. It was he who Clinton consulted initially.
joeguevara wrote: » I think it’s a misunderstanding after you said that living in fear is a ‘complete and utter nonsense’ for people living where you are. I don’t think you meant that it was your intention to suggest that it didn’t happen in other places but I can understand how it was interpreted that way.
FrancieBrady wrote: » People reading tabloid headlines and sensationalism and taking it as gospel is a huge issue. Look at Slab Murphy for instance...Slab may have been feared and been a thug...but 1000's of people in his community were not living in fear as 99.9% of them would have no dealings with him or crossed his path. Yes, some people no doubt lived in fear of him...but this gets blown out of all proportion...the vast majority of people got on with their lives during the conflict.
Superfoods wrote: » Rubbish. Go out for a few beers and look in wrong direction and you had target on your back. The PIRA ran entire communities based on fear. Anyone cross a line and you knew about it. Simple as that. Otherwise people would have gone up against them, so they made sure everyone was in line. I never seen any of that reported in the press, I didn't see a lot of the carry on reported ever in the press. During or since. I am just wondering what your angle is on this? are you saying the PIRA helped sponsor local childcare and play grounds? everyone loved the local representative in the town. Sure he was a lovely lad. Most of these guys where headcases, beating someone meant nothing because it wasn't like the local Garda was going to bother his ass going up against them
Bishop of hope wrote: » Tbf most people along the border didn't know most of the activists along it or close to it. There were loads of activists country wide as well. They didn't go around with uniforms on telling people how to live or act. The fear for most people was just making sure they weren't in the wrong place at the wrong time and get caught up in an actual violent episode. The IRA weren't like the gestapo, ordinary life was carried on without fear mostly. If you wanted to experience fear, seeing the British army crawling in ditches and hedgerows with their guns trained on passing traffic, or the UDR strutting about or their checkpoints, that was rule by fear and intimidation.
Bonniedog wrote: » You are obviously not familiar with his work! Has been Adams groupie for 30 years.
SafeSurfer wrote: » When archives are compiled, such as the Boston Tapes and they reveal Adams role in the IRA you dismiss them as unreliable.
jm08 wrote: » Yet the person who compiled them, Ed Moloney, believes that Gerry Adams should have got the Nobel Peace Prize and not John Hume.
blackwhite wrote: » To be fair - I can’t imagine that anyone who spends every waking moment that have defending both SF and the IRA for anything and everything would ever have needed to fear the local IRA heavies. They’d be treated like royalty by them
blackwhite wrote: » Surprised it took more than a week for the acolytes to resume attacking Humes legacy of peace :rolleyes:
Bonniedog wrote: » The 1916 - 21 revolution failed in securing a 32 county Republic, but it did succeed in securing political independence for the 26 counties. The IRA campaign of 1970 - 1998 achieved none of the IRA's objectives. And at the cost of many lives of people on all sides including the hunger strikers of the 1970s and 1981. Carpet bagging shinners shouting "Up the Ra" after a few pints is embarrassing to be honest; the "Ra" having abjectly surrendered.
jm08 wrote: » In fairness, Niall O'Dowd who wrote that article in Irish Central isn't holding back in his criticism of them. And what adds more weight to what he says is that he is the brother of a Fine Gael TD, so not a closet Shinner. SS - what age are you - are you old enough to remember the 1966 commemorations?
FrancieBrady wrote: » Too many spy film watchers about. A few guys decided to get rich and turned traitor...happens in every army in the world.
markodaly wrote: » Oh, the PIRA are a real 'army' now? Not just a terrorist outfit? Tell me, what army plants bombs in an English market town on a Saturday afternoon and kills 3-year-old toddler and a 12-year-old boy?
