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Dun Laoghaire Traffic & Commuting Chat

Fratton Fred

To avoid derailing other SCD threads, I thought I'd add a Dun Laoghaire thread.

My main query, is does anyone know what is going on outside the train station? It looks like they are putting a crossing in twenty metres from the crossroads. Surely not?

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vrusinov

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Is it really less safe?

In fairness, it still is. Even with the new cycleway - there is clearly more work needs to be done, particularly at south end of it. I'm casual cyclist and used to commute by cycle every day, but I was quite confused about how that intersection is supposed to work and did not felt safe as drivers seemed to be equally disoriented.

Hope the fix it soon enough and make it part of the proper network, so it would be safe enough for kids to cycle between any two points.

Cyrus

ted1 wrote: »

Good thing they are building segregated cycling paths.

Between my house and the Loreto in dalkey ? I doubt it

Cyrus

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why shouldn't they block the remaining single traffic lane? Why is it acceptable to block cyclists and frequently pedestrians but completely unacceptable to block motor vehicles?

Is it really less safe?

Than walking ? Yes I think so. I won’t fall over walking but I can be knocked off a bike and with my two year old on it it’s not something I want to risk .

And re the first point cyclists and pedestrians can get around the truck , cars can’t it’s the lesser of two evils

ted1

Aegir wrote: »

All those schools on Seapoint Avenue must be very grateful

Scoil Lorcan is very grateful, so are other schools who have kits travelling along that stretch

ted1

Larbre34 wrote: »

I'd say the residents are incandescent.

I saw some cycling zealot on twitter posting a photo of a furniture delivery van parked on the cycleway unloading into one of those homes and attempting to name and shame them. The fact the truck could either pull up there or block the remaining single traffic lane completely, clearly escaped their reasoning.

If I lived there I'd already be in Court over it.

They could have parked legally and used a pallet or hand truck to wheel the stuff to the property.

Segregated lanes are there to stop this.
https://twitter.com/rohal_/status/1291763711015882753?s=20

Cyclist are zealots because it’s a matter of life and death as opposed to a slight inconvenience.

br8

Seapoint Avenue is part of the N31; a national primary route that connects Dun Laoghaire Harbour to the M50.
The REASON the cycle lane is TEMPORARY is because DLRCC don't have the powers to make a national primary route one-way unless it is signed off by TII (as TII are responsible for national primary routes).

I personally can't see the cycle way being made permanent for two reasons;

1) TII would be effectively down grading Dun Laoghaire Harbour forever and would have to come up with a plan that would justify that decision, i.e., that the harbour would never gain be permitted to be used by ferries, cruise liners or any large event such as International yacht races that would generate increased traffic flow
2) Post pandemic or even when the schools go back; there will be (and already is) increased traffic flow through Monkstown Village, which is a village on a regional road that is also an Architectural Conservation Area with traffic calming.

I think it will become evident with time that DLRCC took the Covid Pandemic as an opportunity to create the coastal cycleway via the back door. Evidence suggests that this temporary cycleway will have been money thrown away.

If TII and DLRCC had come up with a joined plan rather than this 'back door temporary' / 'chance your arm manoeuvre',
there may have been a forward thinking plan involving the N31 and Dun Laoghaire harbour, Dublin Bus routes and cycle paths that could have been to the benefit of the whole town, i.e., recreation, business, commuters, tourism, etc.
As it stands, making the N31 one-way was not a fully thought out plan for the benefit of the whole community.

ted1

Nice rant, but you are presenting opinions as facts.
The harbour won’t be used for ferries because they are restricted to the number if freight. And it’ll never be viable.
Also what has a cruise liner go to do with a national road ?
The council and government don’t want motor vehicles. International yachting events will be with international yachts arriving by sea and visitors will be encouraged to arrive by Rail, or public transport. Alternatively they take the M50 to cherrywood, wyatville road and so on

loyatemu

br8 wrote: »

Seapoint Avenue is part of the N31; a national primary route that connects Dun Laoghaire Harbour to the M50.

DL harbour has virtually no commercial traffic now the ferries are gone. It's probably only a matter of time before the N31 is downgraded - it's of no national importance anymore.

Mav11

Mav11 wrote: »

Is there not a plan to create a Sutton to Sandycove promenade and cycle way? The Booterstown to Sandycove portion would have a big influence on the surrounding roads and villages.

Looks like there is:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/cars-to-give-way-for-sandymount-cycle-path-1.4324957

If they could now do something with the Merrion gate to Booterstown section it would create a fabulous coastal strip asset.

Cyrus

ted1 wrote: »

Cyclist are zealots because it’s a matter of life and death as opposed to a slight inconvenience.

Hence people not being wild about cycling kids to school, unless you have a segregated lane from your front door to the school

[Deleted User]

Mav11 wrote: »

Looks like there is:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/cars-to-give-way-for-sandymount-cycle-path-1.4324957

If they could now do something with the Merrion gate to Booterstown section it would create a fabulous coastal strip asset.

Bertie Ahern poses for photos on Dun Laoghaire sea front when this was first announced.

DLRCoCo talked and talked and talked about it for years, their only contribution seemingly to paint a white line down the centre of the footpath in Blackrock Park.

Now it is needed, they have overreacted with zero thought as to how it would affect the locals. We now have the majority of traffic diverted to Eden Road/Tivoli Road/ Monkstown village which has become even worse than previously, due to the extra people parking there because they can no longer park around the forty foot area.

Thankfully, it’s been a pretty crap summer so far, but this weekend should show whether or not the full carnage is as bad as a lot of locals think it will be.

I’ve still no idea why they decided to resurface the road and pavements in Glasthule by the way, they have made no changes.

This all looks to me like another case of “have money, must spend it”

strandroad

Mav11 wrote: »

Looks like there is:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/cars-to-give-way-for-sandymount-cycle-path-1.4324957

If they could now do something with the Merrion gate to Booterstown section it would create a fabulous coastal strip asset.

And a safe commute route to Ballsbridge and Dublin 4.

Larbre34

br8 wrote: »

Seapoint Avenue is part of the N31; a national primary route that connects Dun Laoghaire Harbour to the M50.
The REASON the cycle lane is TEMPORARY is because DLRCC don't have the powers to make a national primary route one-way unless it is signed off by TII (as TII are responsible for national primary routes).

I personally can't see the cycle way being made permanent for two reasons;

1) TII would be effectively down grading Dun Laoghaire Harbour forever and would have to come up with a plan that would justify that decision, i.e., that the harbour would never gain be permitted to be used by ferries, cruise liners or any large event such as International yacht races that would generate increased traffic flow
2) Post pandemic or even when the schools go back; there will be (and already is) increased traffic flow through Monkstown Village, which is a village on a regional road that is also an Architectural Conservation Area with traffic calming.

I think it will become evident with time that DLRCC took the Covid Pandemic as an opportunity to create the coastal cycleway via the back door. Evidence suggests that this temporary cycleway will have been money thrown away.

If TII and DLRCC had come up with a joined plan rather than this 'back door temporary' / 'chance your arm manoeuvre',
there may have been a forward thinking plan involving the N31 and Dun Laoghaire harbour, Dublin Bus routes and cycle paths that could have been to the benefit of the whole town, i.e., recreation, business, commuters, tourism, etc.
As it stands, making the N31 one-way was not a fully thought out plan for the benefit of the whole community.

Absolutely. Its either a profligate assignment of dwindling resources or its a good railroading in progress. We shall see which in time.

Larbre34

Dreadful traffic on the Dalkey and Glasthule approaches to Dun Laoghaire today. Really unacceptable.

Signore Fancy Pants

Larbre34 wrote: »

Dreadful traffic on the Dalkey and Glasthule approaches to Dun Laoghaire today. Really unacceptable.

A few of my neighbours here have decided to look elsewhere for their regular trips to DL because of the cycle lane change and associated headaches.

These are in their 50-80's who dont cycle. Also a few younger families who dont have bikes.

Just arent willing to deal with heavier traffic, particularly for the markets.

Less money being spent in DL from those people. Hopefully the cyclists bring in more money that what a 99 ice cream is worth.

Cyrus

Larbre34 wrote: »

Dreadful traffic on the Dalkey and Glasthule approaches to Dun Laoghaire today. Really unacceptable.

Yep we used to be able to get to the pier in 5 minutes or so it’s more like 25-30 now so we go elsewhere

Blut2

Cyrus wrote: »

Yep we used to be able to get to the pier in 5 minutes or so it’s more like 25-30 now so we go elsewhere

If you were able to drive to the pier in 5 minutes then its well within walking distance.

strandroad

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

These are in their 50-80's who dont cycle. Also a few younger families who dont have bikes.

Just arent willing to deal with heavier traffic, particularly for the markets.

Less money being spent in DL from those people. Hopefully the cyclists bring in more money that what a 99 ice cream is worth.

The markets are thronged every week so seem to be fine?

Cyrus

Blut2 wrote: »

If you were able to drive to the pier in 5 minutes then its well within walking distance.

Yes but not with 2 small kids in tow. We drive down so they can walk the pier , goto the market , get something to eat and go home , adding a 3k walk each way isn’t really on.

Signore Fancy Pants

strandroad wrote: »

The markets are thronged every week so seem to be fine?

Im sure they are. These folk are now avoiding dL as a whole.

Blut2

Cyrus wrote: »

Yes but not with 2 small kids in tow. We drive down so they can walk the pier , goto the market , get something to eat and go home , adding a 3k walk each way isn’t really on.

And how many people in the area have 2 small kids? The vast vast majority don't, and are perfectly capable of a 20min stroll.

And besides, you can still drive to within 1km of the pier and park extremely easily if you really have to. Walking the final few minutes won't kill the kids. Its this lazy need to drive right up to something thats a huge problem in our society today.

DL is also still absolutely packed every weekend these days, so the road restrictions obviously aren't that much of an issue for most people.

[Deleted User]

Larbre34 wrote: »

Dreadful traffic on the Dalkey and Glasthule approaches to Dun Laoghaire today. Really unacceptable.

https%3A%2F%2Fblogs-images.forbes.com%2Fcarltonreid%2Ffiles%2F2018%2F12%2Fnotstuckintraffic-1200x917.jpg

If only there was some alternative mode that many people could use to travel to Dun Laoghaire?

strandroad

Blut2 wrote: »

And besides, you can still drive to within 1km of the pier and park extremely easily if you really have to. Walking the final few minutes won't kill the kids. Its this lazy need to drive right up to something thats a huge problem in our society today.

It's so strange how some people just won't walk, or have their kids walk. I live close to a secondary school; it's down a side road, a 4 minutes walk from a main road nearby. Every morning I would see parents driving right up to the school gates just to drop their teenagers off and turn around to go back to the main road. Why not to drop the kids there instead and have them walk this last few minutes? Next to no kids walking this last part at all. Not easy to drive down the side road either, it's not meant for such volume of traffic so cars get stuck, likely getting late for work etc. Some people just like doing it to themselves, and teaching this door to door mentality to their children too.

Cyrus

Blut2 wrote: »

And how many people in the area have 2 small kids? The vast vast majority don't, and are perfectly capable of a 20min stroll.

And besides, you can still drive to within 1km of the pier and park extremely easily if you really have to. Walking the final few minutes won't kill the kids. Its this lazy need to drive right up to something thats a huge problem in our society today.

DL is also still absolutely packed every weekend these days, so the road restrictions obviously aren't that much of an issue for most people.

Yes I could do that and do sometimes but parking around Glasthule and Sandycove is a nightmare now aswell and not worth the hassle. So i disagree with our assertion that one could park extremely easily . Greystones is nearly less hassle.

Dún Laoghaire needs more people in it not less and they need to figure out a way of moving people up the town not just down at the pier and market , this won’t help in that regard.

I don’t need a lecture from anyone about walking or being lazy I’d wager I walk and run more in a week than most people, but at the stage my kids are at where one of them needs to be home at a certain time in the day for a nap the change doesn’t suit me personally . You are for it , good for you, I don’t think it’s added anything but hassle personally .

Cyrus

strandroad wrote: »

It's so strange how some people just won't walk, or have their kids walk. I live close to a secondary school; it's down a side road, a 4 minutes walk from a main road nearby. Every morning I would see parents driving right up to the school gates just to drop their teenagers off and turn around to go back to the main road. Why not to drop the kids there instead and have them walk this last few minutes? Next to no kids walking this last part at all. Not easy to drive down the side road either, it's not meant for such volume of traffic so cars get stuck, likely getting late for work etc. Some people just like doing it to themselves, and teaching this door to door mentality to their children too.

Rightly or wrongly nowadays people are very reluctant to leave their kids out of their sight , it’s sad but it’s the way the world is now .

Gareth Keenan

from the Currency today

please provide a link, don't copy & paste

Larbre34

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

If only there was some alternative mode that many people could use to travel to Dun Laoghaire?

Tell it to the crippled businesses in DL, and any similar town frankly.

Not everyone cycles, not everyone can cycle, especially not with very young and very old family. Public transport is restricted, its likely to become more restricted if this week's pattern continues.

ted1

Larbre34 wrote: »

Dreadful traffic on the Dalkey and Glasthule approaches to Dun Laoghaire today. Really unacceptable.

If you were in a car you are the reason for traffic..

They changed the lights sequence which is causing delays as only 3 or 3 cars get through and if a driver is distracted by a phone or blocking a junction no car will get through

ted1

Larbre34 wrote: »

Tell it to the crippled businesses in DL, and any similar town frankly.

Not everyone cycles, not everyone can cycle, especially not with very young and very old family. Public transport is restricted, its likely to become more restricted if this week's pattern continues.

Because DL was so vibrant before Covid.....

[Deleted User]

Larbre34 wrote: »

Tell it to the crippled businesses in DL, and any similar town frankly.

Not everyone cycles, not everyone can cycle, especially not with very young and very old family. Public transport is restricted, its likely to become more restricted if this week's pattern continues.

Cycle lanes don't cripple businesses - quite the opposite.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/11/16/cyclists-spend-40-more-in-londons-shops-than-motorists/

And yes, not everyone cycles and not everyone can cycle.

Just as not everyone drives and not everyone can drive - but that's not often heard when new road developments are being put in place.