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Irish Property Market 2020 Part 2

Graham

Continued from here:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058041687

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Sarn

Iceman29 wrote: »

... so yes, the PPR is showing a major drop in house prices.....but maybe you should keep your head in the sand and just keep spouting nonsense in here

I agree that some houses have sold below asking, however, I disagree that the PPR is showing a major drop in house prices, based on that limited sample. We won’t know for sure for a few months. Obviously, the anecdotal reports will feed into it in time.

Cyrus

Iceman29 wrote: »

Not you again........
if you cared to actually read the list instead of just going ahead with your own agenda you would notice that two on that list actually went for more than asking.......The sold prices are from the PPR,if you were actually paying attention to the thread....... so yes, the PPR is showing a major drop in house prices.....but maybe you should keep your head in the sand and just keep spouting nonsense in here

eugh

its not showing a drop in house prices

its showing that some houses sold for less than asking,

you have been corrected on this by several posters several times.

GreeBo

Iceman29 wrote: »

so yes, the PPR is showing a major drop in house prices.....

Correction.
THe PPR is showing (some) houses selling for below asking, who gets to decide if asking was above or below market value?

awec

Iceman29 wrote: »

Not you again........
if you cared to actually read the list instead of just going ahead with your own agenda you would notice that two on that list actually went for more than asking.......The sold prices are from the PPR,if you were actually paying attention to the thread....... so yes, the PPR is showing a major drop in house prices.....but maybe you should keep your head in the sand and just keep spouting nonsense in here

The data doesn't suggest this.

You are comparing asking price to selling price. It's been said lots of times on here that asking is unreliable data. You need to wait until the report is released that compares selling prices to selling prices. A 4 bed house might have an asking price of 500k, and sell for 480k, but that same sort of house may have sold for 470k last year. It sold for under asking, but prices still rose.

I also don't think I'd classify single-digit percentage drops as "major" (which is what the majority of your "random" sample is), but that's fairly unimportant.

ElBastardo1

ElBastardo1 wrote: »

I inquired about a house that had an asking of 395k in South Dublin. Previous house on the road was sold 366k back in Feb. Rang today to find the latest offer was 440k. i was surprised as the house is in need of a lot of work.

awec wrote: »

The data doesn't suggest this.

You are comparing asking price to selling price. It's been said lots of times on here that asking is unreliable data. You need to wait until the report is released that compares selling prices to selling prices. A 4 bed house might have an asking price of 500k, and sell for 480k, but that same sort of house may have sold for 470k last year. It sold for under asking, but prices still rose.

I also don't think I'd classify single-digit percentage drops as "major" (which is what the majority of your "random" sample is), but that's fairly unimportant.

The House I reference would actually be the highest sale price on the road on the PPR in the last 10 years. It's kind of pissed me off as it's gone beyond my max and also sets the bar for any house that may come up on the road.

Cyrus

C3 BER..... im struggling to imagine how that could be possible, and the spiel, jaysus

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/53-hainault-road-foxrock-dublin-18-d18-f7k8/4443851

The potential of this home cannot be underestimated, for many discerning purchasers a home like this bursting with possibilities not only sells a dream but a lifestyle whereby the possibilities to interpret the current layout to suit their own needs is endless.

I.E. needs to be knocked and rebuilt.

Shelga

Cyrus wrote: »

C3 BER..... im struggling to imagine how that could be possible, and the spiel, jaysus

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/53-hainault-road-foxrock-dublin-18-d18-f7k8/4443851

The potential of this home cannot be underestimated, for many discerning purchasers a home like this bursting with possibilities not only sells a dream but a lifestyle whereby the possibilities to interpret the current layout to suit their own needs is endless.

I.E. needs to be knocked and rebuilt.

Haha! I thought you were joking with that description, but no, it actually says that in the ad. That's given me a good laugh.

Reminds me of the ridiculous language they use in Daily Mail articles- "the curvy beauty took to the beach to flaunt her svelte pins"- meaning, a woman went outside :pac:

awec

C3 my arse.

The_Brood

Iceman29 wrote: »

yeah

what is the function on https://www.propertypriceregister.ie/ that allows you to compare the asking price? I only see what houses actually sold for.

Hubertj

Cyrus wrote: »

C3 BER..... im struggling to imagine how that could be possible, and the spiel, jaysus

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/53-hainault-road-foxrock-dublin-18-d18-f7k8/4443851

The potential of this home cannot be underestimated, for many discerning purchasers a home like this bursting with possibilities not only sells a dream but a lifestyle whereby the possibilities to interpret the current layout to suit their own needs is endless.

I.E. needs to be knocked and rebuilt.

how much would it cost to build a house that size? it sounds like a lot of money for what is pretty much a site?

awec

The_Brood wrote: »

what is the function on https://www.propertypriceregister.ie/ that allows you to compare the asking price? I only see what houses actually sold for.

It doesn't, but you can easily Google the addresses.

Cyrus

Hubertj wrote: »

how much would it cost to build a house that size? it sounds like a lot of money for what is pretty much a site?

to build a 3000 SQ foot house, 600k for a decent one id say, easily.

Assetbacked

GreeBo wrote: »

Define what you mean by "state intervention" here?

Is there ever an objective barometer for things like property?
You are basically arguing that there cant be expensive things because average people cant afford them...I dont see the logic myself tbh.

I dont understand how you think that rent doesnt align with the salaries of the renters? What are you basing this on?
Unless you think an average worker should be expecting to live in 2 of the most prestigious parts of the capital city?

By state intervention I mean policies which have starved supply (but helped reduce competition for the institutional landlords) and cause thousands of individual landlords to leave the market each of the last few years as a result of;

not building social housing;
preventing the market setting rents by providing for RPZs (which only hurts existing rentals and not new builds from the institutionals);
getting rid of bedsits (but at the same time allowing co-living);
having local councils competing in the private rental market via rental assistance schemes; and
making it incredibly drawn out and difficult to evict someone even for non-payment of rent.

All of these reasons combined with a net immigration far outweighing the supply increase of rentals is the sole reason for rents being at the levels they are at.

And your other point;

Unless you think an average worker should be expecting to live in 2 of the most prestigious parts of the capital city?

I'm not talking about the average worker, let's even take 60k as a salary, the price of renting a room is 34% of your after tax salary - I wouldn't consider 60k as a good salary in Dublin consequently. But the main point I had on this was the discrepancy between being able to buy your own 1 bed apartment in the docklands for the same price you rent a room in a shared apartment in the area.

RANIA

Agree, in Galway same situation. Eg we saw a 3 bed house on market asking 470k sale agreed at 700k after a bidding war!

PropQueries

According to CNBC today: Google "are extending our global voluntary work from home option through June 30, 2021 for roles that don’t need to be in the office... The change will affect nearly all of Google’s 200,000 employees, including contractors and full-time workers".

I'm assuming this also applies to the staff working in the Dublin office?

awec

RANIA wrote: »

Agree, in Galway same situation. Eg we saw a 3 bed house on market asking 470k sale agreed at 700k after a bidding war!

There has been a mistake somewhere here.

BEdS_83

RANIA wrote: »

Agree, in Galway same situation. Eg we saw a 3 bed house on market asking 470k sale agreed at 700k after a bidding war!

wow that is crazy

Eric Cartman

Iceman29 wrote: »

Just took a random list of houses and compared them to the asking in the last month.........It seems to be really conflicting with a few people in here......

18 THE BEECHES Donaghmede ASKING 369 SOLD 380 DIFF 11
4 BROC HALL ORIGINAL ASKING 325 NEW ASKING 295 SOLD 267 DIFF-28
1 CYPRESS PARK ASKING 595 SOLD 570 -25
214 KILDARE RD ASKING 299 SOLD 272 -27
22 BRENNANSTOWN AVENUE ASKING 699 SOLD 650 -49
26 TALLOW HALL ASKING 225 SOLD 240 15
99 HOWTH RD ASKING 450 SOLD 432 -18
ASHFORD COTTAGE ORIGINAL ASKING 1000000 ASKING 975 SOLD 950 -25
37 HOWTH LODGE ORIGINAL ASKING 625 ASKING 595 550 -45
44 ST HELEN'S ROAD ASKING 925 SOLD 850 -75

not really , houses above 400k up , above 400k down. Its just buffering off the top end of the affordability curve for most. Once you go beyond 4-500k most people can't afford those houses so you'll be waiting for somebody to trade up, really high income buyers etc..

fago

RANIA wrote: »

Agree, in Galway same situation. Eg we saw a 3 bed house on market asking 470k sale agreed at 700k after a bidding war!

Assuming it's the same property, the planning history is interesting. We didn't view it as I could not see how it could be certified.

RANIA

awec wrote: »

There has been a mistake somewhere here.

It's nice but it's not that nice! 3 bed no ensuite, great location if you don't mind flooding. Anyway it's not the only one on those prices in Galway right now, it's a sellers market for sure, I'm not sure why people are overpaying, maybe working at home is a factor, large garden, fear of lockdown, we, are actively looking and shocked by the competition

RANIA

fago wrote: »

Assuming it's the same property, the planning history is interesting. We didn't view it as I could not see how it could be certified.

I assumed it was! , we viewed it and it's a 3 bed semi with big winduws at the end of the day.

sweetie

Shelga wrote: »

Haha! I thought you were joking with that description, but no, it actually says that in the ad. That's given me a good laugh.

Reminds me of the ridiculous language they use in Daily Mail articles- "the curvy beauty took to the beach to flaunt her svelte pins"- meaning, a woman went outside :pac:

Did ya go to school with a lad who used to draw a house with windows in the extreme corners of the house. Those lads became EAs

Mic 1972

brisan wrote: »

early days into the recession
Prices took 4 years to flatten in 2008
House prices have never held steady anywhere in the world during a recession
Maybe Ireland will buck the trend

Prices started to drop in 2008, are you saying that recession started 4 years earlier?

I remember things started to go downhill in 2007, not earlier than that

Goldenjohn

RANIA wrote: »

I assumed it was! , we viewed it and it's a 3 bed semi with big winduws at the end of the day.

I had heard about it when it was at €670k a couple of weeks ago. I couldn’t fathom how it was at that price. It is mind blowing it was sold for €700,000. Am I missing something completely??

JamesMason

BEdS_83 wrote: »

wow that is crazy

I can hear Enda's words in Davos echo around here now. Sure people just went mad....

BEdS_83

JamesMason wrote: »

I can hear Enda's words in Davos echo around here now. Sure people just went mad....

asking 470k sale agreed at 700k after a bidding war!

that is absolutely mental if you think about it. Sure people would stop around 580ish but getting to 700k

is mental. :eek:

DellyBelly

Assetbacked wrote: »

By state intervention I mean policies which have starved supply (but helped reduce competition for the institutional landlords) and cause thousands of individual landlords to leave the market each of the last few years as a result of;
not building social housing;

preventing the market setting rents by providing for RPZs (which only hurts existing rentals and not new builds from the institutionals);

getting rid of bedsits (but at the same time allowing co-living);

having local councils competing in the private rental market via rental assistance schemes; and

making it incredibly drawn out and difficult to evict someone even for non-payment of rent.

All of these reasons combined with a net immigration far outweighing the supply increase of rentals is the sole reason for rents being at the levels they are at.

And your other point;

I'm not talking about the average worker, let's even take 60k as a salary, the price of renting a room is 34% of your after tax salary - I wouldn't consider 60k as a good salary in Dublin consequently. But the main point I had on this was the discrepancy between being able to buy your own 1 bed apartment in the docklands for the same price you rent a room in a shared apartment in the area.

60k wouldn't be a great salary in Dublin to be honest. I'd say the average salary would be slightly higher than that.. 75k + I'd say

Ursabear

DellyBelly wrote: »

60k wouldn't be a great salary in Dublin to be honest. I'd say the average salary would be slightly higher than that.. 75k + I'd say

I think the averages is closer to 44k.

https://www.extra.ie/2019/11/21/news/irish-news/cso-average-weekly-wage/amp

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/election-2020-fact-check-is-the-average-income-really-47-000-1.4155272

Knex*

DellyBelly wrote: »

60k wouldn't be a great salary in Dublin to be honest. I'd say the average salary would be slightly higher than that.. 75k + I'd say

Lads, you have to make manager level at a consulting firm or one of the big 4 to be even sniffing 75k.

Not sure that it's your average salary, especially not when you're talking about the rental market.

Smouse156

fliball123 wrote: »

yeah but the last recession didnt have a steep upward curve before dropping. We are now 4/5 months into the corona virus and prices seem to be going up

The market as a whole is definitely not going up! Some places have low asking prices that create a lot of interest. Some are way overpriced and haven’t had offers for years. But as a whole it’s going down