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Dun Laoghaire Traffic & Commuting Chat

Fratton Fred

To avoid derailing other SCD threads, I thought I'd add a Dun Laoghaire thread.

My main query, is does anyone know what is going on outside the train station? It looks like they are putting a crossing in twenty metres from the crossroads. Surely not?

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Larbre34

Mav11 wrote: »

On a related topic, the N31 was given national road status due to traffic from the ferry port. As that is now gone, should it now be designated a regional (R) road? I'm not sure if it would have any practical implications for the current discussion, but it might help reduce traffic.

Yeah it interested me and in a previous post I expressed surprise that a good chunk of a national route was basically annexed for a cycle route, without the input of TII.

I've prepared countless planning proposals over the years, the scale of which is often dependent on the classification of the road (national, regional, local) which can place various limitations on the type of access.

The N31 is still designated as such, as we know, but with the Council taking over Dun Laoghaire Harbour last year, its hard to know what way that will go. If they hope to achieve large scale marine leisure projects and big events, or even some sort of return to commercial port use, I suspect they'd want to retain the national route status.

Thats a bit off the point, I know, but it will impact on the medium to long term status of cycle facilities on that stretch of road, I feel.

L1011

TII would be delighted to be able to detrunk the N31 as there is a stub of the N11 left that would also be detrunked.

Mav11

L1011 wrote: »

TII would be delighted to be able to detrunk the N31 as there is a stub of the N11 left that would also be detrunked.

If memory serves, Newtown Pk Ave was also part of the national primary route designed to take ferry port traffic along the N31 and up to the N11 and that was "detrunked" at least 25 years ago. N31 well over due re designation at this point!

vrusinov

pm1977x wrote: »

They are taking many, many lanes, see also the Blackrock village one way scheme and the roads mentioned by other locals above, it's a land grab by these cycle fanatics who are now in charge, I agree previous cycling measures were under funded and half arsed but now they've lost the run of themselves. When voting time comes around again this won't be forgotten.

I haven't been to DL since the change was introduced, but how can you say changes in Blackrock is not an improvement?

The village is so much nicer with the changes introduced. I was always surprised by amount of cars in the village before. And I didn't cycle there, I took a car and dropped it off Frascati Shopping Centre.

I think the whole Blackrock village needs to be pedestrianized even further - there is no need for cars there except for deliveries and access for locals, maybe after extending parking at shopping centers and P&R near Dart a bit.

Glencarraig

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

So how long does the diversion take you?

Its not about the time it takes, it's the sheer stupidity of having to do it. It's forcing traffic onto the N11 and also on Brewery Road which has become a disaster given that the lights at the junction with Leopardstown Road will only allow four cars through (legally that is) and this being a feeder road to the M50 makes no sense at all.

PS I will always call it The Industrial Estate despite the efforts of the Sandyford Business District group.

Larbre34

Glencarraig wrote: »

Its not about the time it takes, it's the sheer stupidity of having to do it. It's forcing traffic onto the N11 and also on Brewery Road which has become a disaster given that the lights at the junction with Leopardstown Road will only allow four cars through (legally that is) and this being a feeder road to the M50 makes no sense at all.

PS I will always call it The Industrial Estate despite the efforts of the Sandyford Business District group.

Resistant to change eh?

In fairness it forces maybe 5 to 10 cars an hour to route by the N11. Those right turns have been banned for 15 years now and they assist flow in and out of Sandyford estate pretty well and lets face it, thats the dominant demand.

Seaswimmer

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

Not entirely accurate.

Any vehicles coming or going onto Seapoint Avenue from many of the local residential roads are forced to turn left. Therefore anyone who intends to go towards DL, now now must do so by going towards Blackrock, this certainly has made a change to the traffic in that direction.

But there is no reason for them to go down to Seapoint Avenue as most can go up to Monkstown Road. If they are going to Dun Laoghaire they simply go up to Monkstown Road and turn left.

Glencarraig

Larbre34 wrote: »

Resistant to change eh?

In fairness it forces maybe 5 to 10 cars an hour to route by the N11. Those right turns have been banned for 15 years now and they assist flow in and out of Sandyford estate pretty well and lets face it, thats the dominant demand.

What do you call your vacuum cleaner........I bet its "the hoover"

Larbre34

Glencarraig wrote: »

What do you call your vacuum cleaner........I bet its "the hoover"

The wife takes care of all that

Awaaf

I have been away but checked the Sandycove to Seapoint sections yesterday. For background these measures divert traffic towards where I live on a main road so I pay a price for this. However I feel that the experiment is justified.

My experience as a driver at teatime was that traffic was a bit heavier one street in from the seafront (i.e. the George's St Alignment). We are obviously in the quieter summer weeks however. The seafront alignment was relatively quiet traffic wise.

From the perspective of cyclists and pedestrians there are huge positives. I woke up this morning and was thinking of getting the bike out to try out the new route. I haven't cycled in the area for a few years.

It seems to me that they have twin goals 1) give over space to non-car users and 2) eliminate through traffic from the Blackrock Bypass to Sandycove as a further discouragement to car use. The latter addition may be a bridge too far in my opinion (but it is early days).

In the long term I think they should retain the first goal but compromise on the second i.e. have a through route for traffic (one-way) on the sea route. I think the direction chosen for this one way system should be opposite to the direction of the George's St. one-way section.

Signore Fancy Pants

ted1 wrote: »

The N11 is being upgraded and it’s really only bad at the Dublin City council side

Its very long overdue but there's very little evidence of maintenance or repair along the N11 (DLRCC side) its in an awful state.

You know the roads as well as I do, our opinions just differ. I would like to have seen the funds prioritised to improve existing infrastructure first, for the benefit of many more people.

The speed at which the DL cycleway has progressed in combination as to how slow the other existing commuter routes have been dealt with is ridiculous.

At least there was an *attempt* in some parts of the Rock Road a few years ago but its still not great.

[Deleted User]

Any idea why DLRCoCo decided now was a good time to re do the footpath and roads in Glasthule?

Larbre34

According to their twitter, they're reallocating parking space to footpaths and cycleways in Glasthule village as they did in Dalkey and Blackrock. That kinda explains the now bit.

[Deleted User]

They’ve put bollards outside Cavistons and the punnet to allow queue space, but other than that It looked like they just resurfaced everything with no changes, which seemed odd.

Gareth Keenan

Aegir wrote: »

They’ve put bollards outside Cavistons and the punnet to allow queue space, but other than that It looked like they just resurfaced everything with no changes, which seemed odd.

it's not finished yet. Those areas that have been cordoned off by bollards are to be resurfaced and landscaped

patrickbrophy18

I think they have the right idea as far as Sandycove. Unfortunately, the consultation process for the Dalkey portion was hijacked by 12 people in the area which would have either seen a mass one-way system introduced or complete pedestrianization of the main street.

Consequently, a bastardized version of it with a 4.8 meter wide two-way system through the main street emerged. As a result, there is no consistency with the one-way system the entire way from Blackrock to Dalkey.

Anyway, the road designs emerging in general are good. Now, I will be disappointed if cyclists are still using the road immediately adjacent to the two-way cycle lane in spite of all of this investment in a two-way cycle system. Having said that, when turning on to one of the side roads, then, take to the main carriage way.

[Deleted User]

Gareth Keenan wrote: »

it's not finished yet. Those areas that have been cordoned off by bollards are to be resurfaced and landscaped

So not a temporary change then?

It would be nice to see Glasthule get the same treatment as Monkstown, it’s a great little village and more outdoor space would be a huge plus.

Gareth Keenan

Aegir wrote: »

So not a temporary change then?

It would be nice to see Glasthule get the same treatment as Monkstown, it’s a great little village and more outdoor space would be a huge plus.

the announcement said that the changes were possible because of the temporary reallocation of some parking spaces. So technically I suppose if these were allocated back, the changed surface areas would be reclaimed. Maybe it would become seasonal.

The seafront cycle patch was given a similar "temporary" explanation. Who knows.

Mav11

Gareth Keenan wrote: »

the announcement said that the changes were possible because of the temporary reallocation of some parking spaces. So technically I suppose if these were allocated back, the changed surface areas would be reclaimed. Maybe it would become seasonal.

The seafront cycle patch was given a similar "temporary" explanation. Who knows.

Is there not a plan to create a Sutton to Sandycove promenade and cycle way? The Booterstown to Sandycove portion would have a big influence on the surrounding roads and villages.

uberwolf

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

I think they have the right idea as far as Sandycove. Unfortunately, the consultation process for the Dalkey portion was hijacked by 12 people in the area which would have either seen a mass one-way system introduced or complete pedestrianization of the main street.

Consequently, a bastardized version of it with a 4.8 meter wide two-way system through the main street emerged. As a result, there is no consistency with the one-way system the entire way from Blackrock to Dalkey.

Anyway, the road designs emerging in general are good. Now, I will be disappointed if cyclists are still using the road immediately adjacent to the two-way cycle lane in spite of all of this investment in a two-way cycle system. Having said that, when turning on to one of the side roads, then, take to the main carriage way.

was this consultation public? curious to see the objections

patrickbrophy18

uberwolf wrote: »

was this consultation public? curious to see the objections

According to the following Facebook thread, there was:

https://m.facebook.com/groups/332685676782224?view=permalink&id=3393333007384127&sfnsn=mo

fixXxer

Went down on the bike last night to try out the new set up. Very nice to cycle, and a good few other bikes on it in both directions. Good few pedestrians on it too. Traffic was pretty light around the area but it was after 6. The biggest hold up was the a cyclist on the seapoint section who was on the road instead of in cycle section. It really makes you feel the difference in road when you get out on the stretch of road between Blackrock and SVUH, lots of broken damaged parts around there.

fixXxer

https://twitter.com/RTESunMisc/status/1289340758479245313?s=19

Mav11

fixXxer wrote: »

https://twitter.com/RTESunMisc/status/1289340758479245313?s=19

Really enjoyed Joe O'Connor.

Homesick Alien

Re cycleways there was a piece in the Sunday Times the week before last where all other councils, Dublin and elsewhere, were pointing to Dun Laoghaire as a shining of example of what can be done if you just get on with it and stop waiting for every single vested interest to have their say. The reality is that if any of the cycle paths proved to be problematic they are easily reversible, though I sincerely hope that doesn't happen.

pm1977x

Homesick Alien wrote: »

Re cycleways there was a piece in the Sunday Times the week before last where all other councils, Dublin and elsewhere, were pointing to Dun Laoghaire as a shining of example of what can be done if you just get on with it and stop waiting for every single vested interest to have their say. The reality is that if any of the cycle paths proved to be problematic they are easily reversible, though I sincerely hope that doesn't happen.

Time will tell. I went for a drive one evening a week ago to check it out, maybe it was a coincidence but I found the drive very relaxing, people were out cycling and walking and I pootled along at a steady pace, no cars behind me, soaking in the atmosphere, nearly made me want to dust off the bike in the shed! But once the schools are back and more professions return to work it may just overload the roads throughout the area at rush hour, it was already bad so unless there's a huge uptake in cycling I can't see it being anything but a disaster (for drivers and overloaded bus users, but perhaps that's the plan).

Vic_08

Homesick Alien wrote: »

Re cycleways there was a piece in the Sunday Times the week before last where all other councils, Dublin and elsewhere, were pointing to Dun Laoghaire as a shining of example of what can be done if you just get on with it and stop waiting for every single vested interest to have their say. The reality is that if any of the cycle paths proved to be problematic they are easily reversible, though I sincerely hope that doesn't happen.

Yes. That democracy lark just gets in the way of telling the little people what we know is best for them.

[Deleted User]

Vic_08 wrote: »

Yes. That democracy lark just gets in the way of telling the little people what we know is best for them.

Do you think the 'little people' actually know all that much about traffic management? Should we do healthcare by consultation with the little people, voting on which way to carry out your next surgery?

Signore Fancy Pants

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Do you think the 'little people' actually know all that much about traffic management? Should we do healthcare by consultation with the little people, voting on which way to carry out your next surgery?

What a lazy and stupid comparison to make.

Homesick Alien

Vic_08 wrote: »

Yes. That democracy lark just gets in the way of telling the little people what we know is best for them.

Bureaucracy I think is the word your looking for there. If people feel strongly against the new cycleways they will let local councillors/media know and if the support is there they can change it. That's democracy.