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Cork developments

snotboogie

I noticed that the Limerick equivalent is a very popular thread over on their forum so I thought I might get one going here. To kick things off I'll list the bigger current projects I can think of:

Under Construction

Navigation Square: Four building office development on the former Navigation House site on Albert Quay. 310,000 sq ft of office space for up to 3000 employees. First phase to be completed Feb 19'

89-90 South Mall: 50,000 sq ft office, 5 storey office building.To be completed in December 18'

Dalata Hotel South Mall: Six storey hotel, 165 beds. To be completed in December 18'

Various Student Accommodation: Western Road and Beamish site are under construction, Crows Nest has planning and should start soon, Square Deal is facing appeals, Coca-Cola site on the Carrigrohane Road has had planning for over a year but nothing has happened? O’Riordans Joinery, Gillen House on Farranlea Road, Model Farm Road/Melbourne Road and Copely Street are all at various stages of planning and/or limbo.

Planning/Appealed

Horgan's Quay: Office Space for 5,000 employees, 200 apartments, 136 bed hotel and 3000 sq metres of restaurants and retail. Got planning permission in March but it was appealed by Port of Cork. Uncertain when the final decision will be. Construction on the Hotel will hopefully begin in Q4 this year with the office and apartments commencing in 2019.

Sullivan's Quay: 6 storey Office & 193 bed 4 star Hotel. Planning granted and immediately appealed. Given that demolition is nearly complete I'd expect this to go into construction as soon as planning is granted. Potential hold up over the height of the hotel, at 12 storeys and 47 metres, it is set to make the top 20 tallest buildings in the state if completed. An Taisce not happy.

Former Victoria Hotel: Knocking much of the Victoria and rebuilding to the back and refurbishing the original historic front/facade and to integrate the two sections into a new high order retail unit, of 25,000 sq ft, over four floors. Rumoured to be taken over by Zara. Planning granted in Feb, nothing happened on site since.

Metropole Redevelopment: €50m redevelopment of the Metropole Hotel to include a new five-storey boutique hotel on Patrick's Quay. Planning granted with amendments in March. No date for work to start.

Wilton Shopping Centre: €100 million revamp proposed. Mistake made in planning permission. In the process of resubmitting.

In Limbo

Event Centre: 6000 all seater multi purpose event centre with a tourist brewery experience. Arguably the most controversial construction project in the history of the city. After a bleak 6 months at the back end of 2017 there have been two instances of positive murmurs from the Government and BAM in January 2018 and April 2018. Construction allegedly to start in Q4 2018 but there are still conflicting and contradictory statements from all parties involved. Most would be shocked to see this start in 2018.

Anderson Quay/Camden Quay/Trinity Quarter: All have had planning for years with no work on site. Camden Quay allegedly had some work going on last week but I'd be shocked if it was related to the actual construction. I can't see any of these sites being developed as per their current proposals.

Concept/Pre Planning

Docklands Tower: 40 storey mixed use tower with the redevelopment of the existing customs house warehouses into cultural, tourist and retail space. By a mile the most ambitious development in Ireland. Announced over one year ago and no sign of a planning permission application yet, allegedly waiting for the Docklands development plan this summer to rezone heights for the site. If we don't see a planning application by the end of the year I'd be worried.

Ford Distribution Depot: Put on sale last week. Former site of the extremely ambitious Atlantic Quarter. Major development opportunity

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namloc1980

the beer revolu wrote: »

It's the cars dropping off and picking up passengers that cause the problems on the quay, rather than the busses, IMO.

It's not just one thing that causes issues there. It's a multitude of factors that all lead back to it being an unsuitable location for a transport terminal. It's an open quay with zero passenger facilities. There is no facilities for drop off/pick up and this also is a busy road with alot of traffic passing and it isn't integrated with the rest of the transport services in the city. You mention that the cause of the problems is the pick up/drop off by cars which points to it being totally unsuitable location that needs to be addressed.

the beer revolu

namloc1980 wrote: »

It's not just one thing that causes issues there. It's a multitude of factors that all lead back to it being an unsuitable location for a transport terminal. It's an open quay with zero passenger facilities. There is no facilities for drop off/pick up and this also is a busy road with alot of traffic passing and it isn't integrated with the rest of the transport services in the city. You mention that the cause of the problems is the pick up/drop off by cars which points to it being totally unsuitable location that needs to be addressed.

I've no argument with any of that.

kub

namloc1980 wrote: »

It's not just one thing that causes issues there. It's a multitude of factors that all lead back to it being an unsuitable location for a transport terminal. It's an open quay with zero passenger facilities. There is no facilities for drop off/pick up and this also is a busy road with alot of traffic passing and it isn't integrated with the rest of the transport services in the city. You mention that the cause of the problems is the pick up/drop off by cars which points to it being totally unsuitable location that needs to be addressed.

I have to wonder is it time that The NTA stood in and told Bus Eireann that the bus station should be used by all operators.

namloc1980

kub wrote: »

I have to wonder is it time that The NTA stood in and told Bus Eireann that the bus station should be used by all operators.

They could but they have no statutory power to do anything as the station is CIE property. I suppose the Department might be able to do something but it's likely a legal question more than anything of what could possibly be done. I'd imagine either way Bus Eireann and the unions would fight tooth and nail to prevent private operators to come in under "their" roof.

kub

Whilst not attempting to be the prophet of doom, but I heard today that JCD have put their development for The Sextant site on hold.

rounders

The perfect spot would be across the road from the bus station on the Andersons Quay site, O’Callaghan Properties has been holding it for ages. Would just need the private operators to pool resources but that's easier said than done especially with everything going on at the moment

leahyl

rounders wrote: »

The perfect spot would be across the road from the bus station on the Andersons Quay site, O’Callaghan Properties has been holding it for ages. Would just need the private operators to pool resources but that's easier said than done especially with everything going on at the moment

Was thinking the exact same thing myself - would be the perfect location

Apogee

Examiner wrote:

A disused commercial building at the eastern end of Oliver Plunkett St, behind Connolly Hall, could be set for a new lease of life. LHC Investment Ltd has applied to Cork City Council for permission to convert the building at the corner of Lower Oliver Plunkett St and Connell St. It was previously used for motorcycle sales and as Cork Community Print Shop. The proposal is to revamp the building into a ‘guest accommodation’ facility with 19 bedrooms, numbering some 43 beds, and a café.

Planners will make their decision by the start of September.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/property/commercial/arid-40016795.html

who_me

kub wrote: »

I have to wonder is it time that The NTA stood in and told Bus Eireann that the bus station should be used by all operators.

Does it have the capacity though? Seems busy as-is.

Nigel Fairservice

the beer revolu wrote: »

It's the cars dropping off and picking up passengers that cause the problems on the quay, rather than the busses, IMO.

No doubt that doesn't help things either but it's a combination of a number of different factors. The location of the stops are terrible for passengers (outside their central location) and other road users. Bus users block the footpath. There's no queuing system due to space constraints, people just cram around the doors when they open. There's no shelter for people, no toilets, no information displays. A lot of people, especially tourists, get confused about which bus goes where and people aren't often sure about intermediate stops on routes as well so I'm sure displays would help there.

Other road users have to contend with cars pulling in all over the place to pick people up/drop people off, buses blocking a whole lane of traffic because they can't park, pedestrians darting across the road to and from the buses.

Patrick's Quay may have been fine when buses first started going from there but I think it has outgrown its current location.

Captainsatnav

Nigel Fairservice wrote: »

No doubt that doesn't help things either but it's a combination of a number of different factors. The location of the stops are terrible for passengers (outside their central location) and other road users. Bus users block the footpath. There's no queuing system due to space constraints, people just cram around the doors when they open. There's no shelter for people, no toilets, no information displays A lot of people, especially tourists, get confused about which bus goes where and people aren't often sure about intermediate stops as well so I'm sure displays would help there.

Other road users have to contend with cars pulling in all over the place to pick people up/drop people off, buses blocking a whole lane of traffic because they can't park, pedestrians darting across the road to and from the buses.

Patrick's Quay may have been fine when buses first stated going from there but I think it has outgrown its current location.

It's definitely outgrown it, I agree. I think, medium term, an integrated hub in Kent station may be way to go? Long term (i.e. never

) light rail will stop in Kent as well anyhow...

the beer revolu

Regarding busses:

I cant see private busses being allowed in the bus or train station.

Remember a few years ago there was a private airport bus that did two routes around the city and on to the airport?
They were prevented from having a stop inside the train station.

namloc1980

.

Install of cycle/footpath bridge at Dunkettle. It'll form part of the Glanmire/Little Island/Carrigtwohill cycle scheme.

kub

who_me wrote: »

Does it have the capacity though? Seems busy as-is.

Well in passing I noticed that BE coaches seem to operate from the back of the station primarily, they used to operate from the front.
It looks to me like there is always adquate room at the front.

the beer revolu wrote: »

Regarding busses:

I cant see private busses being allowed in the bus or train station.

Remember a few years ago there was a private airport bus that did two routes around the city and on to the airport?
They were prevented from having a stop inside the train station.

It is incredible in this day and age the power that these Unions have.

the beer revolu

kub wrote: »

It is incredible in this day and age the power that these Unions have.

I wasn't claiming that the prevention came from the unions.
I don't know what the motivation was.

Mefistofelino

I'd have thought the private bus parking should have been moved over to the back of Kent Station, off Horgans / Penrose Quay. Links in with rail and local bus, space enough to allow for set-down and gets the buses off Patrick's Quay.

whisky_galore

the beer revolu wrote: »

I wasn't claiming that the prevention came from the unions.
I don't know what the motivation was.

The unions couldn't care less if it doesn't affect their members. The CIE Group of companies might not like a bunch of competitors on it's own turf. Unless they pay rent for the privilege of sharing facilities?

EnzoScifo

kub wrote: »

Well in passing I noticed that BE coaches seem to operate from the back of the station primarily, they used to operate from the front.
It looks to me like there is always adquate room at the front.

It is incredible in this day and age the power that these Unions have.

Nothing to do with the Unions. Parnell Place bus station is owned by CIE not NTA

kub

EnzoScifo wrote: »

Nothing to do with the Unions. Parnell Place bus station is owned by CIE not NTA

Then surely CIE is just another part of the Civil service ?

Justin Credible Darts

why should cie or bus eireann or whatever allow their competitor to use their facilities ?

Its a business not a charity

kub

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

why should cie or bus eireann or whatever allow their competitor to use their facilities ?

Its a business not a charity

Indeed, charge them like Victoria Coach station in London does.

cantalach

kub wrote: »

Then surely CIE is just another part of the Civil service ?

It’s an incorporated company in which the Minister for Transport is the sole shareholder. The same ownership model as once applied to Aer Lingus, Eircom, etc. before those companies were privatised. That’s very different to the Civil Service. Conditions of employment very different.

snotboogie

It's a bit depressing to see the pictures for the apartments at the Marina Quarter considering they are at best delayed. 2021 would have been a transformational year for the city.

hans aus dtschl

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

why should cie or bus eireann or whatever allow their competitor to use their facilities ?

Its a business not a charity

This is exactly it.
And they would (as any business would) charge significant sums to frustrate their competition.

bingo9999

snotboogie wrote: »

It's a bit depressing to see the pictures for the apartments at the Marina Quarter considering they are at best delayed. 2021 would have been a transformational year for the city.

Where did you get this?

EDIT Found it over on SSC. Absolutely unreal. I'm not sure yet it will be delayed given how much run time there could be before the thing would move anyway. Hopefully that can be happening and its coming on stream for an economic bounceback spurred by program for govt housing stimulus measures.

leahyl

Wow that looks unreal! So much potential in our city!!

namloc1980

snotboogie wrote: »

It's a bit depressing to see the pictures for the apartments at the Marina Quarter considering they are at best delayed. 2021 would have been a transformational year for the city.

I remember the Howard Holdings proposal for the Marina, it was very exciting back in the day and never materialised. The cynic in me from all these past plans never materialising, sees this in the same light. Fancy artist's impressions are great and all, but they are very much in the realm of believe it when you see it actually being built.

snotboogie

bingo9999 wrote: »

Where did you get this?

EDIT Found it over on SSC. Absolutely unreal. I'm not sure yet it will be delayed given how much run time there could be before the thing would move anyway. Hopefully that can be happening and its coming on stream for an economic bounceback spurred by program for govt housing stimulus measures.

This was tentatively meant to start around Q4 of this year. LATM was cancelled as a result (prep works I assume), since LATM is now scheduled to go ahead next year, it's unlikely anything will happen on site in 2021.

Was on my phone the last time so here are the full list of photos, apologies for the size but worth posting imo:

a5390795677963.5e9d5d0a3f3f9.jpg

Would have been crazy to see this scheme, the JCD tower and the Prism all being built at the same time

With the London company buying up North Main Street, Glenveagh becoming active in Cork and Tower Holdings building the Prism, we would have had 6 major developers active in the city.

namloc1980 wrote: »

I remember the Howard Holdings proposal for the Marina, it was very exciting back in the day and never materialised. The cynic in me from all these past plans never materialising, sees this in the same light. Fancy artist's impressions are great and all, but they are very much in the realm of believe it when you see it actually being built.

I would have had good confidence in this being built. They had cancelled a money making event on their site and Glenveagh are an established developer with a good record of delivering on their plans.

leahyl

Have they resumed work on the Prism now?

namloc1980

snotboogie wrote: »

This was tentatively meant to start around Q4 of this year.

I don't think this has planning so it couldn't start in Q4. It went to ABP for a pre-planning consultation with the latest update from May being that further consideration is required. It's a long way off full planning yet.

http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/306166.htm