amacca wrote: » I dont see it like that I have to say........of course I could be wrong. 30 months is just an arbitrary age as far as I'm concerned and it promotes intensive beef production with lower returns to the primary producer (its probably good for grain merchants, processors et al and dare I say it intensive dairy farmers with lots of male calves to sell that know a culling policy wouldn't be great image wise for their industry) Its probably a simplification and I could be wrong but wouldn't lower beef numbers in the country from raising that 30 month limit maybe result in a better price for the animal, it would certainly result in less intensive beef farming from current levels imo which would be good for the green image (more co2 sequestration etc) ...... not to mention less heads for the beef farmer to look after, less vet bills, less fertiliser and inputs + other associated costs? ..... or will processors just continue to undercut by importing tonnes of cheap intensively farmed meat from elsewhere in a scenario like that? I personally believe that 30 month rule is good for everyone except the beef farmer...at least everyone the beef farmer has to buy a product or service off and supply his product to but prove me wrong I suppose.
bogman_bass wrote: » If every proof was needed that the 30 month rule is needed to protect farmers from themselves there you have it. The final tally might look great but the margin on that animal isn’t great.
memorystick wrote: » Cattle killed. 1/3 were Ps and 2/3 Os. Mostly fat score 3 and 2. Averaged €1093 after stoppages. Ate under 1/2 ton each of meal. Cost €550 in March 2019. Did ok I think.
dzer2 wrote: » Made about 200 a head maybe a little less for 16 months 15 euro a month.
memorystick wrote: » Are you my accountant?
Water John wrote: » Bit of a paradox when the organic market doesn't care about a 30 month limit. As the Minister has said, the 30 month had nothing to do with them, this was dreamed up between other parties. Don't want to upset some posters here.
Bass Reeves wrote: » I be disappointed after feeding 500kgs/head if I had many FS2. At 550/head last spring they must have been a fairly decent weight when buying 300kgs???. I think you said they went in at 3.5 flat. Average weight 315 kgs so 640/650kgs LW at slaughter. 470 days on farm would give 0.67kgs gain LW/day. Grass is the key with Friesians. I gave up trying to kill in large numbers a few years ago I trickle them out in 3's and 4's and maybe 6-8 at the time. Really struggling to fact cover on them this year, they have taken another growing spurt over the last 4-6 weeks even the f@@kers on ration. I have 6 Ch in with them and they are flying it but still only FS 3ish's. A lot of the Fr are only FS 2+ but will pill 3-4 next week and a few the following week. 3 went last week. Could do with pulling the Ch's but they have too much left in them. On the other hand 670grams/day is better than an AA would do. I have a belted Galloway in the finishing bunch on ration for 8 weeks just trudleing along gobbling meal but not finishing. Since mid May everything seems to be growing and not finishing.
memorystick wrote: » There were some great Fr but its the Holstein blood that makes them hard to finish. They throve really well. May was a tough month on grass. I bought a cheap batch of mixed cattle and they worked out. I sell a good bite of surplus grass which is zero grazed and get lambs to graze in winter. Tis very challenging to count every penny cost wise but I think it’s ok.
Bass Reeves wrote: » I cost it as follow's per head Transport, slaughter and Mart fees 35 euro Grass 100 euro wintering ( last year 145 days extra long and some low DM silage) 140 euro Vet, medicines, mortality 25 euro ration 40/head misc 35 euro. That is tipping near the 375/head. I probably being a bit harsh on my costs in 1-2 places but I would need to average 600/head gross margin this year to net 200/head. Last winter cost me 30-40/head extra in feeding costs due to length and low dry matter silage.Grass costs at 100/head is nearly 7K for grass costs this year( silage is covered in wintering costs 8.7K for total fertlizer will be in the 4K total mark and slurry about 1800 euro, silage making costs, bought in some and etc shy of 4.5K) so probably a bit more there than I think but I will struggle to average 600/head gross margin. Real killer will be replacements are looking to be 100 more expensive than last year at present
memorystick wrote: » You’ve mad high costs.
DBK1 wrote: » They are definitely the costs associated with keeping cattle for a year and if anything the wintering cost is too low. Bass I don’t know what size stock you keep for the winter but any animal around the 450 to 500 kilos will cost more than €1 a day to keep from my experience. Even with feeding no ration they’ll still cost €1.20 to €1.30 a day and the problem with feeding no ration is their growth will be very poor for that cost.
wrangler wrote: » +1 the guys doing Contract rearing are claiming that they need 1.20+/day average over the year, so 1.50 indoors and €1.00 outdoors.
DBK1 wrote: » I won’t dispute your costs Bass if you have them worked out at that but you seem to be running a fairly efficient system and one that I would imagine 90% of farmers wouldn’t be matching. So for lads that think their costs are lower than that, they either don’t understand what their costs are or they don’t want to know them as they will then know they are losing money! I’d say the costs you’re quoting are the very best any beef farmer can aim for. There’s also nothing included for any once off costs like say purchase, running costs and maintenance of a jeep/van, reseeding, fencing, shed or yard maintenance, a load of concrete every now and then, changing a tractor etc. Start adding a small amount for all them items and that’s when the true costs for lads stack up. Then there’s the most important one of all, your time!! For any farmer try to even pay yourself at minimum wage for the hours you spend on the farm and that’s when, if looked at through an accountants eye’s, they will just ask you why!?
Robson99 wrote: » He is fairly on the ball. I can't see anywhere that he is high on. Maybe you could highlight a few areas and educate us a bit but my figures would be fairly similar to that
memorystick wrote: » I’ll do it ov a wet day but winter cost seems high. Only 4 bales each here. 4 ton of 18 6 12 over 27 acres for grazing.
Jjameson wrote: » 2.00 indoors minimum. Unless you want to loan your facilities for free.
wrangler wrote: » I have been warning Bass about ignoring fixed costs for a while now. :cool:
Bass Reeves wrote: » I give you examples of fixed costs in farming. In the late noughties under the enviormental I build a shed it cost approx 123K, I claimed back about the vat it came to about 16.5K, I then got the grant of about 65K on top of it. In the end the shed cost 43K which I wrote off against tax at the high rate. Now that is totally written off how do I add it in as a fixed cost. If you factor in the lifetime of an average shed is 40 years how do I cost it. If I sell 60 cattle /year that about 2.5K cattle over forty years that is 17 euro/head of a fixed cost. I could go through my accounts for you but I prefer no to In the world of accountancy what is an expense and what is not. I am not driving a Land Cruiser, yes I have a RAV but that is as much a lifestyle choice as a work vehicle. Last year I have over 6K in depreciation and motor running expenses going through the books agri diesel was 300 euro, wages were 9K including fees. Ya I am depreciating a bit of machinery. I do not feed meal for the winter I feed silage and min's only. Last year I got caught with some cattle late in the year and finished about 20+ out of the shed average ration over 59 cattle was about 3.5K, actually my fert and lime was 35 euro....It had gone into the 2018 accounts, I buy 4 ton of 18-6-12, 4.5 Ton Urea, 2 Ton of CAN. Actually when I look at my direct expenses on the account last year it works out at about 190/head if I add in the fertlizer it will add about 60/head to the figures. Over the last 3-4 years I have bought the ration bill on the farm back from hitting 10K to last years 3.5K. Now in 2019 I did not get all my stock through in the calendar year about 6 cattle went into the 2020 accounts but my sales hit 68K that added another 8K to that figure. I had my SFP on top of it. Purchases were about 40K(I have 10 extra stores this year. So ya I am fooling myself
