BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 2:17pm #1

Right,

I have just read this article, and to be honest, either it is Really badly worded, or it is telling us to keep quiet and know our place.

https://news.sky.com/story/the-misconceptions-behind-the-white-lives-matter-banner-12013727

Can someone clarify the meaning of this for us normal people?

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Sam Quentin · 29-06-2020 2:20pm

The World's going mad, everybody's crazy and social media rears our children.....
Doomed DOOOOOMMMMMED I TELL YA.

ancapailldorcha · 29-06-2020 2:23pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Right,

I have just read this article, and to be honest, either it is Really badly worded, or it is telling us to keep quiet and know our place.

It didn't come across as either of these IMO.

29-06-2020 2:26pm

Some ramble about "white privilege". An exercise in box fitting, I wouldn't take it seriously.

ancapailldorcha · 29-06-2020 2:30pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Some ramble about "white privilege". An exercise in box fitting, I wouldn't take it seriously.

I watched the video. He never directly said "white privilege".

The Raging Bile Duct · 29-06-2020 2:30pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

it is telling us to keep quiet and know our place.

I'm scratching my head trying to figure out how you got that from the article and accompanying video.

The Raging Bile Duct · 29-06-2020 2:33pm

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I watched the video. He never directly said "white privilege".

It's in the accompanying article.

You may have heard the phrase "white privilege" and been antagonised by it. Don't be.

It doesn't mean that you live in the lap of luxury and spend your life deciding which magnum of champagne you will have with your dinner. It means that life is tilted in your direction to such an extent that you probably don't even notice.

When you walk around the shops is it assumed you are a criminal? Do the police stop you regularly because you look suspicious? If you are black the answer is yes. Is it for you?

In your business what colour are the people who have the power? What colour are the people who make the decisions? What colour is the manager of your favourite football team? What colour is the owner of your favourite football team?

The chances are that the answers are probably white and if you are white it has probably never crossed your mind to give it much thought. Have a think about it now. That is white privilege.

Can't see anything wrong there. It's simply trying to explain what people mean about white privilege by giving context.

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 2:33pm

So the statement " You may have heard the phrase "white privilege" and been antagonised by it. Don't be. " is just an innocent term?

"understand that black people want a level playing field, an equal chance. That is all. Not more than you, just the same opportunities as you."

To be honest, of all the black people i know none are paid less than me.

SO where is the White Privilege here?

These terms are being thrown around by the media and are being used to antagonise people of different colours against each other, otherwise we would not need the likes of SkyNews, and the BBC.

GreeBo · 29-06-2020 2:35pm

I don't see any issue with that video tbh.

It's basically explaining to those white people who seem to think BLM somehow means BLM more than WLM, that actually BLM means Black Lives Matter Too.

If you are not black then you have no idea what BLM means as having to explain that "lives matter" isn't a thing that has ever occurred to you. You get it for free due to your race. Other races dont and they are a minority, so they are trying to explain to the rest of us "hey, life is kinda sh1t for us yunno, can we get this changed?"

GreeBo · 29-06-2020 2:36pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

So the statement " You may have heard the phrase "white privilege" and been antagonised by it. Don't be. " is just an innocent term?

"understand that black people want a level playing field, an equal chance. That is all. Not more than you, just the same opportunities as you."

To be honest, of all the black people i know none are paid less than me.

SO where is the White Privilege here?

These terms are being thrown around by the media and are being used to antagonise people of different colours against each other, otherwise we would not need the likes of SkyNews, and the BBC.

And thats fine, but you need to understand that your experience of black people is in the tiniest of tiny realities.

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 2:36pm

GreeBo wrote: »

I don't see any issue with that video tbh.

It's basically explaining to those white people who seem to think BLM somehow means BLM more than WLM, that actually BLM means Black Lives Matter Too.

If you are not black then you have no idea what BLM means as having to explain that "lives matter" isn't a thing that has ever occurred to you. You get it for free due to your race. Other races dont and they are a minority, so they are trying to explain to the rest of us "hey, life is kinda sh1t for us yunno, can we get this changed?"

If they mean Black Lives Matter Too, then the slogan would be less antagonistic and should say All lives matter!!

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 2:37pm

GreeBo wrote: »

And thats fine, but you need to understand that your experience of black people is in the tiniest of tiny realities.

How so?

I work in IT, and have done for almost 20 years.

Explain how Tiny my reality really is!!

The Raging Bile Duct · 29-06-2020 2:40pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

If they mean Black Lives Matter Too, then the slogan would be less antagonistic and should say All lives matter!!

That makes zero sense when you are trying to highlight the issues that black people face.

What do you find antagonistic about highlighting racism?

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 2:41pm

Its not highliting racism, it is blatantly stating that Only Black Lives Matter, or have they changed the slogan since I last checked?

The Raging Bile Duct · 29-06-2020 2:48pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Its not highliting racism, it is blatantly stating that Only Black Lives Matter, or have they changed the slogan since I last checked?

This is seriously what you're getting from it?!?! They state, both in the video and article, that it doesn't mean that at all but to say that black lives matter just as much as white lives.

Here is the type of thing that never would have happened to a white father and son going on a charity cycle.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/28/black-teenager-on-family-cycle-ride-injured-during-aggressive-police-arrest

Slowyourrole · 29-06-2020 2:55pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Its not highliting racism, it is blatantly stating that Only Black Lives Matter, or have they changed the slogan since I last checked?

Nowhere has anyone said "only" black lives matter. It's not the idea that "White Lives Matter" where an issue arises, it's that the phrase is only ever used to counter black lives matter.

tonycascarino · 29-06-2020 3:01pm

BLM rubbish has gone way over the top now at this stage. If anything, more normal thinking people will turn against it such is the way it is rammed down our throats on a daily basis.

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:03pm

All Lives Matter.
I'm not putting anyone in a special place for privilege or for discrimination. BLM is a racist, black supremacy movement. Same as the KKK is a white supremacy movement.

The Raging Bile Duct · 29-06-2020 3:09pm

ELM327 wrote: »

All Lives Matter.
I'm not putting anyone in a special place for privilege or for discrimination. BLM is a racist, black supremacy movement. Same as the KKK is a white supremacy movement.

I hadn't realised that people connected to the Black Lives Matter movement were lynching people and burning crosses and that its chief aim is to keep white people subordinate.

I really need to start paying more attention to the news.

cfuserkildare · 29-06-2020 3:10pm

Slowyourrole wrote: »

Nowhere has anyone said "only" black lives matter. It's not the idea that "White Lives Matter" where an issue arises, it's that the phrase is only ever used to counter black lives matter.

Saying only Black Lives Matter is a antagonistic phrase and ishoild be labelled as a racist statement.

The fella that flew over the Etihad with the White Lives Matter showed how white people are not permitted to use on such terminology.

Slowyourrole · 29-06-2020 3:11pm

ELM327 wrote: »

All Lives Matter.
I'm not putting anyone in a special place for privilege or for discrimination. BLM is a racist, black supremacy movement. Same as the KKK is a white supremacy movement.

If you really thought all lives matter, you wouldn't have an issue saying black lives matter.

As for your comparison of KKK to the BLM, you obviously know sweet **** all about either.

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:11pm

The Raging Bile Duct wrote: »

I hadn't realised that people connected to the Black Lives Matter movement were lynching people and burning crosses and that its chief aim is to keep white people subordinate.

I really need to start paying more attention to the news.

They are attacking innocent people and burning buildings

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:12pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Saying only Black Lives Matter is a antagonistic phrase and ishoild be labelled as a racist statement.

The fella that flew over the Etihad with the White Lives Matter showed how white people are not permitted to use on such terminology.

+1

White lives matter, black lives matter, all lives matter.

suicide_circus · 29-06-2020 3:13pm

Ah BLM, Grade-A charlatans.

2,800 African Americans murdered in the US in 2016, 2,500 of these by other African Americans. Not a peep out of BLM.

Who will suffer most when police forces are disbanded? Residents of deprived communities.

When you donate to BLM, where does the money go? Democratic candidates. Also why do BLM get active in 2016 and 2020? Election years was it?

Calling your group BLM means any valid criticism means you dont think "black lives matter" - pure marketing.

Absolute sham.

Slowyourrole · 29-06-2020 3:13pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Saying only Black Lives Matter is a antagonistic phrase and ishoild be labelled as a racist statement.

The fella that flew over the Etihad with the White Lives Matter showed how white people are not permitted to use on such terminology.

They guys who had all the racist stuff on his social media? Let me ask you this, how many times have you heard or seen the phrase "white lives matter" other than in contrast to BLM? The answer is never, because it is only used as response to black lives matter.

patsman07 · 29-06-2020 3:16pm

The Raging Bile Duct wrote: »

This is seriously what you're getting from it?!?! They state, both in the video and article, that it doesn't mean that at all but to say that black lives matter just as much as white lives.

Here is the type of thing that never would have happened to a white father and son going on a charity cycle.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/28/black-teenager-on-family-cycle-ride-injured-during-aggressive-police-arrest

Nonsense. Anybody can be arrested in error. A (white) friend of mine had a baton drawn across his head outside a night club because he happened to be talking to someone who had stole a Garda's hat a few minutes earlier, was handcuffed, brought to the station and held for two hours.

Turning everything into a race issue is quickly becoming a bigger problem than actual racism.

I've been driving almost twenty years. I've encountered the Gardai on the road around 20 times, checkpoints etc. I'd say at least five out of the twenty times, the particular Garda I encountered was arrogant & impolite. I drove away from those encounters thinking 'he was a dick.' If I were black, in the current climate, I'd be thinking 'he was a racist.'

punisher5112 · 29-06-2020 3:18pm

Look at Canada and the USA.

They're nuts.

Mainly white women and white men and from what I see most are from the lgbtqvdsc groups

punisher5112 · 29-06-2020 3:20pm

patsman07 wrote: »

Nonsense. Anybody can be arrested in error. A (white) friend of mine had a baton drawn across his head outside a night club because he happened to be talking to someone who had stole a Garda's hat a few minutes earlier, was handcuffed, brought to the station and held for two hours.

Turning everything into a race issue is quickly becoming a bigger problem than actual racism.

I've been driving almost twenty years. I've encountered the Gardai on the road around 20 times, checkpoints etc. I'd say at least five out of the twenty times, the particular Garda I encountered was arrogant & impolite. I drove away from those encounters thinking 'he was a dick.' If I were black, in the current climate, I'd be thinking 'he was a racist.'

Why would race come into it.

Black or white or Asian or Eskimos can be dicks.

Annasopra · 29-06-2020 3:21pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Its not highliting racism, it is blatantly stating that Only Black Lives Matter, or have they changed the slogan since I last checked?

No. Thats your misinterpretation of it. Noone has ever said only black lives matter.

Annasopra · 29-06-2020 3:23pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Saying only Black Lives Matter is a antagonistic phrase and ishoild be labelled as a racist statement.

The fella that flew over the Etihad with the White Lives Matter showed how white people are not permitted to use on such terminology.

Nobody says only black lives matter though so your points are points are irrelevant and redundant

punisher5112 · 29-06-2020 3:25pm

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

No. Thats your misinterpretation of it. Noone has ever said only black lives matter.

But the whole BLM bull**** movement is about exactly that and it's an attack against white people.

I tell you for a fact if I went out tomorrow an done up a sign white lives matter.... I'd be attacked.

Annasopra · 29-06-2020 3:26pm

patsman07 wrote: »

Nonsense. Anybody can be arrested in error. A (white) friend of mine had a baton drawn across his head outside a night club because he happened to be talking to someone who had stole a Garda's hat a few minutes earlier, was handcuffed, brought to the station and held for two hours.

Turning everything into a race issue is quickly becoming a bigger problem than actual racism.

I've been driving almost twenty years. I've encountered the Gardai on the road around 20 times, checkpoints etc. I'd say at least five out of the twenty times, the particular Garda I encountered was arrogant & impolite. I drove away from those encounters thinking 'he was a dick.' If I were black, in the current climate, I'd be thinking 'he was a racist.'

The point is if you were black it would more likely be multiples of 20 times

DavidLyons_ · 29-06-2020 3:34pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

But the whole BLM bull**** movement is about exactly that and it's an attack against white people.

I tell you for a fact if I went out tomorrow an done up a sign white lives matter.... I'd be attacked.

That witch Beyoncé calling her new album Black is King. If a white performer called their next album White is King they’d have no career left after the woke gobsh1tes were finished with them.

All of these insincere, disingenuous @rseholes apologising for voicing CARTOON characters of different ethnicity and the idiot Florence Pugh saying sorry for wearing cornrows in her hair as a teenager.

Fcuking madness. The media are to blame for much of this. They’re giving this wanton stupidity credence and validity instead of dismissing it as the laughable, pointless virtue signaling it is.

Tokyo · 29-06-2020 3:38pm

ELM327 wrote: »

BLM is a racist, black supremacy movement. Same as the KKK is a white supremacy movement.

Mod: Think of this as preventative modding.

Couching this as a logical argument isn't going to cut it here - you can not possibly equate the two. This is a dumb comparison that I will consider trolling if you make it again.

4068ac1elhodqr · 29-06-2020 3:39pm

suicide_circus wrote: »

Ah BLM, Grade-A charlatans.
2,800 African Americans murdered in the US in 2016, 2,500 of these by other African Americans. Not a peep out of BLM.
Who will suffer most when police forces are disbanded? Residents of deprived communities.
When you donate to BLM, where does the money go? Democratic candidates. Also why do BLM get active in 2016 and 2020? Election years was it?

The B-on-B homicide rates there are shocking, yet just handfulls of crooked white cops control the narrative.
A similar pattern is emmerging in the uk, but with a certain ideology +300% prison population representation (and rising), compared to the general population.

Poverty is the given default excuse, but a 4/5yr sensible slog for a degree is such an unattractive proposition when idols are often rappers, 'distribution entrepreneurs in flash cars' or TV sports stars. Of which there is only room for a very few. Throw in the mix of high single parent rates, and pressure upon females against independent study, travel and work in many ethnic communites.

Besides the billionaires fiscally supporting the BLM/Dem cause, there is some suggestion that China is also now backing this.
Feeling the rath of the Dealmaker's Trade deals, they would love to see a civil war erupt across the West, and sleepy Joe would be a softer option for them.
China has it's own 'methods' of dealing with ethnic groups, which is rarely called out. India too, with it's cast system should be of international attention.

Chris_Heilong · 29-06-2020 3:39pm

BLM are not a good representation of their namesake, I had no time for them when they stormed the stage of a Bernie Sanders address and grabbed the mic of the old man demanding they give them the stage or they will shut down the event and I have not time for them as enter private gated property because they passed it and thought it looked like a nice house they wanted to destroy, at least the home owners were willing to fight back.

When a group says among its goals are "to dismantling capitalism and the patriarchal system, disrupting the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure" you know you are not dealing with sound minded people.

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:42pm

mike_ie wrote: »

Mod: Think of this as preventative modding.

Couching this as a logical argument isn't going to cut it here - you can not possibly equate the two. This is a dumb comparison that I will consider trolling if you make it again.

The logical argument is that BLM are not the peaceful protesters they are being made out to be. They are looting, burning, blocking off areas, attacking the police etc.

I retract the KKK comparison and will not reference it again. I appreciate the preventative moderating.

But I do not retract a post highlighting the hypocrisy of a white woman giving the finger to a black cop in the name of black lives matter.

mouldybiscuits · 29-06-2020 3:42pm

BLM is not a civil rights movement, it's a movement with a political agenda.

SozBbz · 29-06-2020 3:43pm

Gosh people are depressing.

1. Saying "All Lives Matter" puts you in the company of some pretty unsavory people. Its dismissive at best - why are you threatened by marginalised people asking to be treated with decency and respect? If you really believe that all human life matters, you'd see BLM as simply stating the obvious.
2. What BLM are trying to get across is that its not that you can't be white and have a hard life. Its that your life hasn't been made harder by virtue of the colour of your skin.
3. Its hard to fully understand someone elses lived experience, especially if its fundamentally different than your own. But that doesn't mean that its not true or that its something to be dismissive about.

Black Lives Matter is simply seeking to challenge prejudice and create more equal outcomes - fundamentally whats wrong with that?

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:45pm

SozBbz wrote: »

Gosh people are depressing.

1. Saying "All Lives Matter" puts you in the company of some pretty unsavory people. Its dismissive at best - why are you threatened by marginalised people asking to be treated with decency and respect? If you really believe that all human life matters, you'd see BLM as simply stating the obvious.
2. What BLM are trying to get across is that its not that you can't be white and have a hard life. Its that your life hasn't been made harder by virtue of the colour of your skin.
3. Its hard to fully understand someone elses lived experience, especially if its fundamentally different than your own. But that doesn't mean that its not true or that its something to be dismissive about.

Black Lives Matter is simply seeking to challenge prejudice and create more equal outcomes - fundamentally whats wrong with that?

I fundamentally disagree with the creation of equal outcomes.
I support the creation of equal opportunities. This is different, and an important distinction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_of_outcome#Comparing_equalities:_outcome_vs._opportunity

SozBbz · 29-06-2020 3:47pm

DavidLyons_ wrote: »

That witch Beyoncé calling her new album Black is King. If a white performer called their next album White is King they’d have no career left after the woke gobsh1tes were finished with them.

All of these insincere, disingenuous @rseholes apologising for voicing CARTOON characters of different ethnicity and the idiot Florence Pugh saying sorry for wearing cornrows in her hair as a teenager.

Fcuking madness. The media are to blame for much of this. They’re giving this wanton stupidity credence and validity instead of dismissing it as the laughable, pointless virtue signaling it is.

You sound like an angry man.

Beyonce also had a song called "Run the Word, Girls". Does that mean that women now run the world because of a song? And yes, replaceing the word Girls, with boys/men would sound wrong, but typically you don't need to empower those who are already on top.

Mav11 · 29-06-2020 3:48pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Right,

I have just read this article, and to be honest, either it is Really badly worded, or it is telling us to keep quiet and know our place.

https://news.sky.com/story/the-misconceptions-behind-the-white-lives-matter-banner-12013727

Can someone clarify the meaning of this for us normal people?

The Raging Bile Duct wrote: »

I'm scratching my head trying to figure out how you got that from the article and accompanying video.

That's pretty selective quoting really, the addition of the word "or" by the OP gives it a whole different meaning.

SozBbz · 29-06-2020 3:50pm

ELM327 wrote: »

I fundamentally disagree with the creation of equal outcomes.
I support the creation of equal opportunities. This is different, and an important distinction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_of_outcome#Comparing_equalities:_outcome_vs._opportunity

I'll stick wtih outcomes, thanks.

I'd like outcomes where my black friends and colleagues don't get extra hassle at airports, don't get pulled over more often, aren't subject to sly comments that start with "I'm not a racist but...". Those outcomes are important.

This is a great distinction relied upon by those who actually don't want equality.

Why are you so threatened?

DavidLyons_ · 29-06-2020 3:52pm

SozBbz wrote: »

You sound like an angry man.

Beyonce also had a song called "Run the Word, Girls". Does that mean that women now run the world because of a song? And yes, replaceing the word Girls, with boys/men would sound wrong, but typically you don't need to empower those who are already on top.

??? Angry? Nope. I notice this is a default conclusion leapt to by certain posters on here to dismiss and demean their fellow posters without crossing the line of “ attacking the poster” and incurring the wrath of the report button.

What a ridiculous analogy you’ve used with the run the World song. I presume you must agree with the rest of my post.

Mr. Karate · 29-06-2020 3:55pm

IF BLM wants us to believe that they're only for equality then they are their supporters in the media can drop the phony outrage whenever someone dares says "White Lives Matter" or "All Lives Matter."

briany · 29-06-2020 3:55pm

I assumed that Black Lives Matter originally meant "as well", not "only". It can't really be said that American society at large has historically appeared to give as much of a sh*t when black people are killed by cops or overdose on drugs, or even when black kids go missing (how many black milk carton kids were there?), vs those same things happening to white people. It came across as a simple appeal to be seen as equal.

Dave Chappelle did a good bit on it where he compared the crack epidemic among blacks to the opioid epidemic among whites, and questioned why the former was treated as a criminal problem whereas there is at least an awareness of a health problem in the latter case. Why the disparity of public sympathy?

White Lives Matter is a clear reaction to BLM. I don't think anyone was mistaken enough to believe that white lives didn't matter before, except the usual crowd who believe that [insert western city] will be 90 percent Muslim within a decade.

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:55pm

SozBbz wrote: »

I'll stick wtih outcomes, thanks.

I'd like outcomes where my black friends and colleagues don't get extra hassle at airports, don't get pulled over more often, aren't subject to sly comments that start with "I'm not a racist but...". Those outcomes are important.

This is a great distinction relied upon by those who actually don't want equality.

Why are you so threatened?

The distinction is there so that everyone is given the same chances, but only those who earn them on merit, receive the best outcome.

Not everyone can be the director, the highest paid, etc. Some people have to sweep the floor, do the minimum wage job etc

29-06-2020 3:55pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

I tell you for a fact if I went out tomorrow an done up a sign white lives matter.... I'd be attacked.

Yeah, and if you don't understand why then there's no talking to you.

Regardless of your opinion of the BLM movement and the actions of it's members, no one should have a problem with the phrase 'Black lives matter'. It's the absolute definition of white privilege, that the statement 'Black lives matter' makes you feel as though the significance of your life is being left out. That you feel that it implies that your life doesn't matter. Because you're used to the idea of mattering, and being counted, and that equality means getting exactly as much attention as everyone else.

'All lives matter'/'white lives matter' is meaningless, because across this country these facts are already assumed. 'Black lives matter' highlights the fact that black lives are not thought about in the same way as white lives, that being black is seen as different, that when people talk about norms they don't include the experience of black people and that black people are not generally represented politically, legally or in the media in the same way that white people are. To hear 'black lives matter' and reply with 'all/white lives matter', is to dismiss racism. It's taking that phrase and erasing black people from it. Erasing their voice and their identity. That's racism.

GreeBo · 29-06-2020 3:56pm

ELM327 wrote: »

All Lives Matter.
I'm not putting anyone in a special place for privilege or for discrimination. BLM is a racist, black supremacy movement. Same as the KKK is a white supremacy movement.

Its an equality movement, all they are looking for is black lives to matter as much as white lives already do.

ELM327 · 29-06-2020 3:57pm

GreeBo wrote: »

Its an equality movement, all they are looking for is black lives to matter as much as white lives already do.

Well then they should say so, "all lives matter".

29-06-2020 3:58pm

SozBbz wrote: »

I'll stick wtih outcomes, thanks.

I'd like outcomes where my black friends and colleagues don't get extra hassle at airports, don't get pulled over more often, aren't subject to sly comments that start with "I'm not a racist but...". Those outcomes are important.

This is a great distinction relied upon by those who actually don't want equality.

Why are you so threatened?

What a bizarre interpretation of what equality of outcome is.

BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

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