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Police Shooting USA. Rayshard Brooks.

lawrencesummers

Cops called because a guy was asleep in his car in the queue for a drive through.
Failed field sobriety test.
Tussled with cops.
Shot and killed.
Looks on the outset like another use of excessive Force by police, but there is so much more wrong with it.

One cop has been fired and the other is Put on leave.

Firing somebody that immediately and without due process is probably in a bid to quell the protests - (but it hasn’t) But it can’t be right, surely these matters need investigation, statements and the a just decision, which may well be dismissal / charges filed etc.

There is a big risk of the authorities in the USA actually losing their own police force if they don’t maintain the law and order and due process that everyone deserves. Has the cop in this instance actually violated the procedures That are given to him for arresting people? If a cop needs to be fired then fine, fire hundreds of them but only after due process.

RIP the victim, On his daughters birthday apparently.

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ronivek

AbusesToilets wrote: »

He attacked the police and took their weapon and used it against them. The officers were absolutely justified in using lethal force against him, and I imagine will likely win a wrongful dismissal lawsuit when it all shakes out.

And if he had taken pepper spray instead of a taser? Would he deserve to have been shot dead?

What if the officer had a nut allergy and the guy was throwing peanuts at him as he was running. Would he also deserve to be shot dead?

What about if he had taken the officer's baton and was running? I mean he could have thrown it at the officer and hit him in the eye or something... would he deserve to be shot dead in that case?

Or in your mind is anyone who dares to resist arrest deserving of being lethally shot?

Pythagorean

The journal .ie had a recent report about Garda detectives surrounded by 15 youths who attacked them, and tried to throw them under an approaching car. One of the detectives said that he felt that one of the assailants had attempted to take his gun. So we in this country may not be as immune to these situations as we might like to think we are.

Luxxis

ronivek wrote: »

And if he had taken pepper spray instead of a taser? Would he deserve to have been shot dead?

What if the officer had a nut allergy and the guy was throwing peanuts at him as he was running. Would he also deserve to be shot dead?

What about if he had taken the officer's baton and was running? I mean he could have thrown it at the officer and hit him in the eye or something... would he deserve to be shot dead in that case?

Or in your mind is anyone who dares to resist arrest deserving of being lethally shot?

But he didn't. He took the TASER and they knew that.

froog

Danzy wrote: »

Statistical evidence shows us he would be more likely to be shot dead.

wrong as i showed earlier. unarmed black people are much more likely to be shot dead.

Danzy

ronivek wrote: »

And if he had taken pepper spray instead of a taser? Would he deserve to have been shot dead?

What if the officer had a nut allergy and the guy was throwing peanuts at him as he was running. Would he also deserve to be shot dead?

What about if he had taken the officer's baton and was running? I mean he could have thrown it at the officer and hit him in the eye or something... would he deserve to be shot dead in that case?

Or in your mind is anyone who dares to resist arrest deserving of being lethally shot?

Pointing the weapon was the deciding factor. Resisting arrest is mild.

declanflynn

NotMOL wrote: »

You are missing the point which has been made a million times ITT, Ireland and America are completely different when it comes to guns. Cops are regularly shot at and killed in America.

Also you and others defending him keeping leaving out the point were he was drunk behind the wheel, you make it seem like he was just having a nap outside the burger shop

how many are shot dead in an average year

Danzy

froog wrote: »

wrong as i showed earlier. unarmed black people are much more likely to be shot dead.

As I showed you, per similar arrests numbers whites die more than blacks.

AbusesToilets

froog wrote: »

what if it was a baton he stole and waved about? is shooting him dead still justified?

You attack a cop with a weapon, expect to get shot. Would you any less dead if I crack you across the head with a baton?

Michael Brown attacked a cop and tried to take his gun, yet folks acted like he was gunned down in the street. The majority of shootings by cops in the US are justifiable, something folks like you are no doubt loath to admit.

punisher5112

Pythagorean wrote: »

The journal .ie had a recent report about Garda detectives surrounded by 15 youths who attacked them, and tried to throw them under an approaching car. One of the detectives said that he felt that one of the assailants had attempted to take his gun. So we in this country may not be as immune to these situations as we might like to think we are.

They were afraid to use it as they would end up been the ones in trouble which is nuts....

Remember watching a clip of the troubles up north and two British soldiers in a car were traveling between bases I believe, they had their side arms but when surrounded by a non and taken out of the car and the guns used against them, they didn't shoot at anyone and died for holding back.

froog

NotMOL wrote: »

You are missing the point which has been made a million times ITT, Ireland and America are completely different when it comes to guns. Cops are regularly shot at and killed in America.

Also you and others defending him keeping leaving out the point were he was drunk behind the wheel, you make it seem like he was just having a nap outside the burger shop

i never even commented on him drunk driving. because its completely irrelevant to whether it was right to shoot him dead.

ronivek

Luxxis wrote: »

But he didn't. He took the TASER and they knew that.

They're all "less lethal" forms of weapon. In fact many departments require an officer who carries a taser to have been tasered at least once in order to certify. My point is all of these options are very similar in terms of potential damage.

declanflynn

ronivek wrote: »

And if he had taken pepper spray instead of a taser? Would he deserve to have been shot dead?

What if the officer had a nut allergy and the guy was throwing peanuts at him as he was running. Would he also deserve to be shot dead?

What about if he had taken the officer's baton and was running? I mean he could have thrown it at the officer and hit him in the eye or something... would he deserve to be shot dead in that case?

Or in your mind is anyone who dares to resist arrest deserving of being lethally shot?

brilliant questions, shows how wrong the police were

NotMOL

Luxxis wrote: »

I'll add to that by saying if you dont want run in's with the cops, dont break the law.

Especially when you're on parole

declanflynn

AbusesToilets wrote: »

You attack a cop with a weapon, expect to get shot. Would you any less dead if I crack you across the head with a baton?

Michael Brown attacked a cop and tried to take his gun, yet folks acted like he was gunned down in the street. The majority of shootings by cops in the US are justifiable, something folks like you are no doubt loath to admit.

this guy was running away not attacking the cop

froog

Danzy wrote: »

As I showed you, per similar arrests numbers whites die more than blacks.

whites die more than blacks because there is much more of them in america. its the probability of an unarmed person getting killed by police you want to examine. which is what i showed you. it's really not rocket science.

NotMOL

declanflynn wrote: »

how many are shot dead in an average year

38 officers shot to death in the space of 50 weeks

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/02/07/us/2019-officers-killed-trnd/index.html

jam_mac_jam

Pythagorean wrote: »

The journal .ie had a recent report about Garda detectives surrounded by 15 youths who attacked them, and tried to throw them under an approaching car. One of the detectives said that he felt that one of the assailants had attempted to take his gun. So we in this country may not be as immune to these situations as we might like to think we are.

I think the level of training however is quite different. The videos of US police in comparison to the UK ones are completely different. Even when the UK police are being attacked they are drawing back into a defensive position with the baton up. In a keep it up you will get a smack way rather than attacking at the slightest provocation.

The US police are more like an occupying force then a police force. The UK police are de escalating a situation.

It's completely different. One of the reasons is guns, other reasons is competence at their jobs, training, accountability.

I have seen American cops screaming and roaring at people like babies, no authority other then their guns. They look panicked and fearful. Its just completely different.

declanflynn

punisher5112 wrote: »

They were afraid to use it as they would end up been the ones in trouble which is nuts....

Remember watching a clip of the troubles up north and two British soldiers in a car were traveling between bases I believe, they had their side arms but when surrounded by a non and taken out of the car and the guns used against them, they didn't shoot at anyone and died for holding back.

Those 2 were dead no matter what they did mate

froog

AbusesToilets wrote: »

You attack a cop with a weapon, expect to get shot. Would you any less dead if I crack you across the head with a baton?

Michael Brown attacked a cop and tried to take his gun, yet folks acted like he was gunned down in the street. The majority of shootings by cops in the US are justifiable, something folks like you are no doubt loath to admit.

you're fine with someone getting shot dead for waving a baton around. okay.

AbusesToilets

declanflynn wrote: »

this guy was running away not attacking the cop

Except for the part where he turned around and fired at the cop again, at which point he was shot. You keep forgetting to include that detail.

Running away doesn't magically make you immune from the consequences of your actions. If I attack a cop with a weapon, he doesn't lose the right to respond because I show a clean pair of heels. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

NotMOL

froog wrote: »

i never even commented on him drunk driving. because its completely irrelevant to whether it was right to shoot him dead.

But you make it seem like he was innocent and the cops were called for him just having a sleep outside the burger shop

AbusesToilets

froog wrote: »

you're fine with someone getting shot dead for waving a baton around. okay.

I'm fine with someone getting shot for attacking a cop with a weapon, which is what happened here.

declanflynn

NotMOL wrote: »

38 officers shot to death in the space of 50 weeks

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/02/07/us/2019-officers-killed-trnd/index.html

how many by black guys

declanflynn

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Except for the part where he turned around and fired at the cop again, at which point he was shot. You keep forgetting to include that detail.

Running away doesn't magically make you immune from the consequences of your actions. If I attack a cop with a weapon, he doesn't lose the right to respond because I show a clean pair of heels. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

he should 'respond'

Overheal

punisher5112 wrote: »

That's your opinion.

Imo it was warranted.

What would have happened if he wasn’t killed that he had to be put down then and there?

declanflynn

NotMOL wrote: »

But you make it seem like he was innocent and the cops were called for him just having a sleep outside the burger shop

he was asleep outside a burger shop

Overheal

punisher5112 wrote: »

And what if he uses the taser on another officer or breaks into a home......

Seriously he was under arrest they can't be letting people run off with their weapons.

Breaks into a home? He was at a Wendy’s parking lot attended by two cops what home was he going to break into?

AbusesToilets

Overheal wrote: »

What would have happened if he wasn’t killed that he had to be put down then and there?

What would have happened if he hadn't attacked two cops?

Danzy

declanflynn wrote: »

he was asleep outside a burger shop

He was in the drive thru lane, asleep, drunk at the wheel.

froog

NotMOL wrote: »

But you make it seem like he was innocent and the cops were called for him just having a sleep outside the burger shop

i think you're confusing me with another poster. the guy clearly drunk drove, resisted arrest and stole the cops taser. also has previous convictions. he deserved to be arrested and jailed/prosecuted. he didn't deserve to be shot dead.