Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

hetuzozaho wrote: »

Yep it's good. And he often tweets false claims. E.g.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1262364231288197123

So this one is easily proven to be false.

Is the plan going forward that they fact check any false tweet now, or is it just now and again?

I imagine it'll just be used for things that are of national importance, such as the virus and the election. It's their way of keeping him on Twitter, letting him say whatever he wants, and still claim they're doing something.

In fairness, this isn't the worst of ways they could deal with it. It's better than just flagging the tweet as "potentially false" or anything. But he's still allowed to say whatever he wants (even if it's clearly false, defamatory or whatever), it'll still get through to his voters many of whom won't check or trust the fact-checking and it won't really change anything other than making it look like Twitter are doing something.

He should be banned from Twitter for some of the things he's said, particularly the Scarborough thing. Twitter previously said they wouldn't ban world leaders because their tweets are of national importance etc, but they still said they could be banned for extreme things. Accusing someone of murder just because he complains about him on TV... how the f*ck does that not get him banned?

Christy42

Blueshoe wrote: »

Why do people automatically take Twitter fact check as actual fact?

Is it anti Trumpism? People complaining about how twitter conduct themselves regularly yet once they go against Trump suddenly their word is golden.

Now that's not to say what Trump is saying isn't bullsh1t just interesting that twitter staff are suddenly all knowing

The fact check says there Trump said this without evidence. Unless someone can provide evidence for Trumps claims Twitter is indeed correct that he made the voter fraud claim without evidence.

Twitter are not all knowing. They have managed the basic principle of obvious lie is obvious lie which is not quite the same thing as all knowing.

Their fact check was just a link to the news story about said tweet. So people can make up their minds after reading that.

Penn wrote: »

Same here, the switch to talking about Pat Kenny on the radio made no sense to anyone who wasn't listening to Pat Kenny on the radio.

Yep exactly. Ah looks like it was not clear to a good few of us. No harm, lesson learnt I guess.

pixelburp wrote: »

As said, if you follow the actual "Fact check" link, it takes you to a page that outlines the sources disproving Trump's claim. It's not Twitter's gospel, it's the press' investigations, Twitter is just pulling a Snopes here and collating the information for the browser to decide. Not a question of gospels. You already quoted the link so I presume you ignored it. Here it is again:

https://twitter.com/i/events/1265330601034256384

One doesn't have to like Twitter to see the quantifiable effort they're making to at least challenge easily-verifiable lies spouted by the President. As also mentioned, by any accounts Trump should be banned for his Scarborough comments but is shielded by his status and the blowback Twitter would receive.

Yep it's good. And he often tweets false claims. E.g.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1262364231288197123

So this one is easily proven to be false.

Is the plan going forward that they fact check any false tweet now, or is it just now and again?

hetuzozaho wrote: »

TBF to pixelburp I found it a bit confusing too.

Same here, the switch to talking about Pat Kenny on the radio made no sense to anyone who wasn't listening to Pat Kenny on the radio.

Blueshoe wrote: »

In that case because it's been investigated and by Trump's "side" and found to be not happening Trump is full of it. No argument

I still wouldn't take what twitter or any other private company as gospel

As said, if you follow the actual "Fact check" link, it takes you to a page that outlines the sources disproving Trump's claim. It's not Twitter's gospel, it's the press' investigations, Twitter is just pulling a Snopes here and collating the information for the browser to decide. Not a question of gospels. You already quoted the link so I presume you ignored it. Here it is again:

https://twitter.com/i/events/1265330601034256384

One doesn't have to like Twitter to see the quantifiable effort they're making to at least challenge easily-verifiable lies spouted by the President. As also mentioned, by any accounts Trump should be banned for his Scarborough comments but is shielded by his status and the blowback Twitter would receive.

StringerBell

Tbf, you entered a discussion regarding Twitter, had a pop at that in terms of bias and then tagged on a bit about pat Kenny having a whinge on newstalk, finishing with talk about bias

So it's not exactly clear that you are no longer talking about the ongoing discussion, that you have veered off into your own bug bear.

Looked more like pat Kenny was whinging about the Twitter fact checking thing also tbh

Blueshoe wrote: »

In that case because it's been investigated and by Trump's "side" and found to be not happening Trump is full of it. No argument

I still wouldn't take what twitter or any other private company as gospel

And Twitter aren't saying "This is our opinion", it's a combination of news sources, and noted as such.

So which would you consider more trustworthy (not gospel, just more trustworthy); Multiple verified, attributable news sources, or Trump's tweet with no back-up data?

Blueshoe wrote: »

Why?
Other posters understood straight away. If you aren't sure just ask

TBF to pixelburp I found it a bit confusing too.

pixelburp wrote: »

Maybe include the context of your own posts, we can't debate with you if you're having your own little vent the rest of us aren't privvy to. For reference, this is the tweet about Postal Fraud

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1265255835124539392?

It's up to Trump to prove his accusation - that's literally how these sort of things work. It's not on Twitter to disprove it. Otherwise I could accuse you of being a lizard alien and it's on you to prove it. Burden of proof is always with the person making the claim.

If you follow the link on the Tweet flagging the fact checking, it takes you here:
https://twitter.com/i/events/1265330601034256384

The sources are quoted: "Fact checking" isn't hard. You just need bodies to chase sources. It's not magic, or something arcane. Just requires patience and time.

Why?
Other posters understood straight away. If you aren't sure just ask

Penn wrote: »

The Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity was created by Trump, to investigate his claims that millions of illegal immigrants voted illegally and that was why he lost the popular vote to Hilary.

They didn't find anything. Nothing. Nada. Zilch.

As for Twitter's fact checking, it's a summary of different news organisations. It's not opinion, or the ramblings of an egotisitical, petty man-child, it's facts.

In that case because it's been investigated and by Trump's "side" and found to be not happening Trump is full of it. No argument

I still wouldn't take what twitter or any other private company as gospel

Blueshoe wrote: »

What happened to the opinion that twitter, FB, YouTube etc can ban anyone they choosy as they are a private business.

They have the power to ban him of they choose but as with all businesses they are watching their bottom line. Keep an eye on twitter stock as this spat inevitably develops.

I think the it's better to keep him there and fact check the tweets. A good way for people to learn.

StringerBell

duploelabs wrote: »

"People are accusing Jack Dorsey of murder to test if Trump is receiving preferential treatment"

https://www.dailydot.com/debug/dorsey-trump-scarborough-twitter-murder/

He is receiving preferential treatment, his lies and dangerous tweets about covid-19 are allowed to remain while Brazil's leader and Maduro I think in Venezuela have had their misleading tweets deleted. As always with Trump he is receiving preferential treatment but it isn't enough for him.

[Deleted User]

Blueshoe wrote: »

What happened to the opinion that twitter, FB, YouTube etc can ban anyone they choosy as they are a private business

I'd have to look it up but the rules changed for Trump as he's a public official and he choose to use twitter to speak to the public

Billy Mays

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think they can by law. He's a unique user at this point. He can say what he want and its deemed information that the public must have access to. He can't block anyone either. It went to court a while back.

And yet he still has

https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTrFan/status/1262793642256879616

Blueshoe wrote: »

I don't know what the report found. Who carried it out?

The Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity was created by Trump, to investigate his claims that millions of illegal immigrants voted illegally and that was why he lost the popular vote to Hilary.

They didn't find anything. Nothing. Nada. Zilch.

As for Twitter's fact checking, it's a summary of different news organisations. It's not opinion, or the ramblings of an egotisitical, petty man-child, it's facts.

Blueshoe wrote: »

Pat Kenny is complaining about Trump not wearing a mask, protestors carrying guns and a few other things. He is telling his phone in American guest that trump is wrong on everything. Twitter not mentioned. Different story

I don't know what the report found. Who carried it out? Im only referring to twitter fact checking his posts

Maybe include the context of your own posts, we can't debate with you if you're having your own little vent the rest of us aren't privvy to. For reference, this is the tweet about Postal Fraud

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1265255835124539392?

It's up to Trump to prove his accusation - that's literally how these sort of things work. It's not on Twitter to disprove it. Otherwise I could accuse you of being a lizard alien and it's on you to prove it. Burden of proof is always with the person making the claim.

If you follow the link on the Tweet flagging the fact checking, it takes you here:
https://twitter.com/i/events/1265330601034256384

The sources are quoted: "Fact checking" isn't hard. You just need bodies to chase sources. It's not magic, or something arcane. Just requires patience and time.

TomOnBoard

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think they can by law. He's a unique user at this point. He can say what he want and its deemed information that the public must have access to. He can't block anyone either. It went to court a while back.

What law could insist that a private social media platform couldn't ban a user who is breaching it's Ts & Cs?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't think they can by law. He's a unique user at this point. He can say what he want and its deemed information that the public must have access to. He can't block anyone either. It went to court a while back.

What happened to the opinion that twitter, FB, YouTube etc can ban anyone they choosy as they are a private business.

They have the power to ban him of they choose but as with all businesses they are watching their bottom line. Keep an eye on twitter stock as this spat inevitably develops.

duploelabs

Blueshoe wrote: »

Pat Kenny is complaining about Trump not wearing a mask, protestors carrying guns and a few other things. He is telling his phone in American guest that trump is wrong on everything. Twitter not mentioned. Different story

I don't know what the report found. Who carried it out? Im only referring to twitter fact checking his posts

Trump is suggesting that mail-in voter fraud is a thing. His own investigation found to the contrary. Twitter labeled his tweet as misleading

[Deleted User]

EltonJohn69 wrote: »

Twitter needs to suspend him... what he do if couldn’t vent ? Press conferences at the White House at 3am

I don't think they can by law. He's a unique user at this point. He can say what he want and its deemed information that the public must have access to. He can't block anyone either. It went to court a while back.

duploelabs wrote: »

Explain why it's bias? What did the Trump instigated investigation/report into voter fraud find?

Pat Kenny is complaining about Trump not wearing a mask, protestors carrying guns and a few other things. He is telling his phone in American guest that trump is wrong on everything. Twitter not mentioned. Different story

I don't know what the report found. Who carried it out? Im only referring to twitter fact checking his posts

Blueshoe wrote: »

I'm referring to the fact check on mail in voter fraud.

Pat Kenny on newstalk having a whing fest right now. Talk about bias

The tweets have false claims in them though?

Blueshoe wrote: »

I'm referring to the fact check on mail in voter fraud.

Pat Kenny on newstalk having a whing fest right now. Talk about bias

There have been a number of investigations into Voter Fraud down the years, such as a 2012 Pew Research Center study, or even Trump himself after the 2016 election headed by Kris Kobach. This information is publicly accessible. There's no voter fraud in the United States. Even Trump knows this 'cos he started his own (admittedly stalled) investigation - but is just sewing doubt 'cos he knows he's in trouble with November. Sounds more like you hate Pat Kenny and are shooting the messenger TBH.

duploelabs

Blueshoe wrote: »

I'm referring to the fact check on mail in voter fraud.

Pat Kenny on newstalk having a whing fest right now. Talk about bias

Explain why it's bias? What did the Trump instigated investigation/report into voter fraud find?

pixelburp wrote: »

You're being disingenuous: nobody is taking Twitter as fact checkers supreme, but rather we're talking about Trump publicising vulgar conspiracy theories that Joe Scarborough had his aide murdered. And the fact being the US President allows you to spread that kind of misinformation and crass, disgusting rumour. This isn't being "Anti Trump", or playfully snorting Trump is talking "bullsh1t" - this is beyond the pale situation here where repercussions should be felt, status be damned.

I'm referring to the fact check on mail in voter fraud.

Pat Kenny on newstalk having a whing fest right now. Talk about bias

Blueshoe wrote: »

Why do people automatically take Twitter fact check as actual fact?

Is it anti Trumpism? People complaining about how twitter conduct themselves regularly yet once they go against Trump suddenly their word is golden.

Now that's not to say what Trump is saying isn't bullsh1t just interesting that twitter staff are suddenly all knowing

You're being disingenuous: nobody is taking Twitter as fact checkers supreme, but rather we're talking about Trump publicising vulgar conspiracy theories that Joe Scarborough had his aide murdered. And the fact being the US President allows you to spread that kind of misinformation and crass, disgusting rumour. This isn't being "Anti Trump", or playfully snorting Trump is talking "bullsh1t" - this is beyond the pale situation here where repercussions should be felt, status be damned.