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Off Topic Thread 5.0

[Deleted User]

Thread continued from here https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057835955&page=250

The usual rules apply. Non-rugby talk here. Consider this a social place, but like a pub, things like religion and politics can be divisive, so don't say things here you wouldn't say to someone's face in the pub. Sober

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swiwi_

Clegg wrote: »

She tested negative!

Always good to know your grannie doesn’t have HIV.

Oh wait, doesn’t have Covid.

Excellent news Clegg, delighted for you!

irishbucsfan

Delighted for you and the family Clegg.

I wonder what the next steps on testing will be. I wonder if there’ll be a widespread push or if they won’t take that approach and just push social distancing until there’s a vaccine

Squidgy Black

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Delighted for you and the family Clegg.

I wonder what the next steps on testing will be. I wonder if there’ll be a widespread push or if they won’t take that approach and just push social distancing until there’s a vaccine

I think the road map they've laid out is showing that social distancing is gonna stay around for a long while, I was chatting to the facilities lads in our offices (which they're prepping for the gradual return of some people) and the HSE etc have told them that they'll have to have measures in place for several months in terms of keeping distance between desks and one-way systems around the building. And encouraging WFH as much as possible where feasible. The word going around is that it'll be next year before the office gets back up to more than 70% capacity with the goal being something like 50% by the end of this year with people only doing a day or two a week in the office.

irishbucsfan

Squidgy Black wrote: »

I think the road map they've laid out is showing that social distancing is gonna stay around for a long while, I was chatting to the facilities lads in our offices (which they're prepping for the gradual return of some people) and the HSE etc have told them that they'll have to have measures in place for several months in terms of keeping distance between desks and one-way systems around the building. And encouraging WFH as much as possible where feasible. The word going around is that it'll be next year before the office gets back up to more than 70% capacity with the goal being something like 50% by the end of this year with people only doing a day or two a week in the office.

Our office will be the same alright.

I’ve no need to return to Ireland currently but I’d consider it if there was some call for the public to start doing antibodies tests or something like that, but that doesn’t seem to be on the horizon

awec

I'll be WFH for 2020 at least.

Podge_irl

Globally my company is WFH til Sep at least, but they are looking at potentially bringing us back earlier in some fashion here in Geneva. My office has technically never closed and 2 or 3 people have been going in the whole time - mostly cause they just didn't like working from home I think. Had it been more people I guess that may have caused issues but as it worked out it was fine.

thomond2006

The WFH part on Monday-Friday isn't a big deal to me. The dead weekends are the mood killer.

Yeah_Right

I imagine some companies might look to make WFH standard practice. If they can have half their workforce WFH, then they can reduce the size of their premises saving on rent and facilities costs. The wife works for a company that has a main office but had to rent a second site because their work force has grown so much over the years. If they could have a third of their staff WFH, they could get rid of that second site. Some businesses could probably have 95% of their staff WFH.

The Lost Sheep

Squidgy Black wrote: »

I think the road map they've laid out is showing that social distancing is gonna stay around for a long while, I was chatting to the facilities lads in our offices (which they're prepping for the gradual return of some people) and the HSE etc have told them that they'll have to have measures in place for several months in terms of keeping distance between desks and one-way systems around the building. And encouraging WFH as much as possible where feasible. The word going around is that it'll be next year before the office gets back up to more than 70% capacity with the goal being something like 50% by the end of this year with people only doing a day or two a week in the office.

Yeah the superintendent pharmacist I'm working for was saying social distancing is just going to be a new norm. How people queue and attend events and things in general will just be different from now on.
As said .before I've had all events for next few months cancelled. I think the next big event I may work with crowds could be the listowel races in the middle of September but even then I'm not sure
Unfortunately I cant work from home for most of what I do but still can get hour or two done from home every day which is something on top of pharmacy work

Stheno

thomond2006 wrote: »

The WFH part on Monday-Friday isn't a big deal to me. The dead weekends are the mood killer.

Exactly the same here for me, M-F is fine, but dear God the weekends just drag.

Not helped by the bank holidays

stephen_n

Dog Botherer wrote: »

I’m not trying to be flippant but i’d have an easier time believing Biden would be quietly competent if he wasn’t obviously mentally unwell.

Trust me, i hate Trump and want him gone. I just think that Joe “Nothing Will Fundamentally Change” Biden is not the answer. How could you not want to change the circumstances that brought forth Trump? It’s madness.

What brought forward Trump is America being a deeply divided and racist country. Obama was the lightening rod that created Trumps support. What or who do you think would change the circumstances that created the last 4 years?

Squidgy Black

Podge_irl wrote: »

Globally my company is WFH til Sep at least, but they are looking at potentially bringing us back earlier in some fashion here in Geneva. My office has technically never closed and 2 or 3 people have been going in the whole time - mostly cause they just didn't like working from home I think. Had it been more people I guess that may have caused issues but as it worked out it was fine.

We kept one of our offices open and there's been around 30-40 people in every day, but that's only like less than 2% of our employees.

From conversations I've had there's definitely people who are dying to get back into the office, mostly those who've never WFH before (or those with young kids who just want the break) and this being their first experience of extended periods, but it isn't really a fair reflection on how things would normally be.

Former Former

Yeah, a lot of people will want to come back into the office, and I think companies are going to find that while WFH is very possible, productivity takes a massive hit. I don't think we're looking at a seismic shift tbh.

Podge_irl

Squidgy Black wrote: »

We kept one of our offices open and there's been around 30-40 people in every day, but that's only like less than 2% of our employees.

From conversations I've had there's definitely people who are dying to get back into the office, mostly those who've never WFH before (or those with young kids who just want the break) and this being their first experience of extended periods, but it isn't really a fair reflection on how things would normally be.

Aye, my office is only for 50 odd people (that detail is important!).

I used to work 1 day a week from home. I would be more than happy to go back to that, or even 2 days. But I don't care for mon-fri at all.

Stheno

Former Former wrote: »

Yeah, a lot of people will want to come back into the office, and I think companies are going to find that while WFH is very possible, productivity takes a massive hit. I don't think we're looking at a seismic shift tbh.

Our office had a wfh policy in place forever, and most staff would have wfh at least once a week, and it wasn't uncommon for people who lived down the sticks to wfh 2/3 days a week

We are all wfh from the rest of the year, and it's likely that after that it will be 2/3 days a week in the office for most.

I think our lease is up in the next twelve months, and the company would not renew all the floorspace we have, likely reduce it by a third.

Now our office is slightly different than most in that the average age of the workforce is over 40, we've maybe 2.5% of our staff who are under thirty, and as our teams are spread around the world we always worked over skype/teams/zoom/webex anyway so our productivity hasn't been hit tbh, if anything it's gone up as we are not socialising as much as we would have in the office.

Buer

Former Former wrote: »

Yeah, a lot of people will want to come back into the office, and I think companies are going to find that while WFH is very possible, productivity takes a massive hit. I don't think we're looking at a seismic shift tbh.

What I've noticed is that it's very easy to identify who is capable of working from home and who isn't and I don't mean that from technical limitations/infrastructure.

Some people just cannot reliably work at home. Some can. But I find it's very easy to see who is coasting at the moment and I'd put good money they have Netflix on for 5 hours of the day. I know in my team that I can rely on 2 or 3 people to work from home and the others simply cannot deliver on it and will end up on a PIP if they do so.

All in all, I think there will be some sort of change and additional flexibility but a process for personal accountability and performance monitoring will need to be developed in conjunction with it.

awec

Buer wrote: »

What I've noticed is that it's very easy to identify who is capable of working from home and who isn't and I don't mean that from technical limitations/infrastructure.

Some people just cannot reliably work at home. Some can. But I find it's very easy to see who is coasting at the moment and I'd put good money they have Netflix on for 5 hours of the day. I know in my team that I can rely on 2 or 3 people to work from home and the others simply cannot deliver on it and will end up on a PIP if they do so.

All in all, I think there will be some sort of change and additional flexibility but a process for personal accountability and performance monitoring will need to be developed in conjunction with it.

Yes, weaker links get found out very quickly. You need to have good self discipline.

Squidgy Black

Buer wrote: »

What I've noticed is that it's very easy to identify who is capable of working from home and who isn't and I don't mean that from technical limitations/infrastructure.

Some people just cannot reliably work at home. Some can. But I find it's very easy to see who is coasting at the moment and I'd put good money they have Netflix on for 5 hours of the day. I know in my team that I can rely on 2 or 3 people to work from home and the others simply cannot deliver on it and will end up on a PIP if they do so.

All in all, I think there will be some sort of change and additional flexibility but a process for personal accountability and performance monitoring will need to be developed in conjunction with it.

I've found that WFH tends to magnify people's workloads and productivity that they'd normally get away with in the office.

I guess it all depends on the kind of work and metrics as well, for us it's fairly easy to see how productive someone is as we're a development team so we have fairly comprehensive metrics in terms of story points completed in release cycles etc and tickets closed or progressed. But I'd imagine in a more business-y role that kind of thing gets a bit murky to deem whether someone's flat out or just watching Netflix.

Stheno

Buer wrote: »

What I've noticed is that it's very easy to identify who is capable of working from home and who isn't and I don't mean that from technical limitations/infrastructure.

Some people just cannot reliably work at home. Some can. But I find it's very easy to see who is coasting at the moment and I'd put good money they have Netflix on for 5 hours of the day. I know in my team that I can rely on 2 or 3 people to work from home and the others simply cannot deliver on it and will end up on a PIP if they do so.

All in all, I think there will be some sort of change and additional flexibility but a process for personal accountability and performance monitoring will need to be developed in conjunction with it.

We've had an issue where some people are very "this can't be done because" and when we were office based that got papered over because others would pick up the slack.

At the moment, we are all being asked to essentially do more, and the "this can't be done because" crowd who are essentially obstructing progress are becoming very obvious, and it is not going down well with our senior management

Podge_irl

awec wrote: »

Yes, weaker links get found out very quickly. You need to have good self discipline.

Not sure "weaker links" is an entirely fair way to characterise them. If you have been hired to work in an office environment and have done that all your experience and your skills are based around that, then the sudden shift is going to cause problems.

awec

Podge_irl wrote: »

Not sure "weaker links" is an entirely fair way to characterise them. If you have been hired to work in an office environment and have done that all your experience and your skills are based around that, then the sudden shift is going to cause problems.

I mean those who find it hard to do work without having someone looking over their shoulder to force them to do it.

Buer

TIL Podge is a weak link.

[Deleted User]

awec wrote: »

I mean those who find it hard to do work without having someone looking over their shoulder to force them to do it.

Honestly this is me right now

errlloyd

Deleted User wrote: »

Honestly this is me right now

Yeah ditto. Doesn't help that the project I am on has been delayed as a result of Covid. I am on the business end and there is a tech team working away and I feel pretty guilty cleaning up powerpoints and sending emails without any measurable outcomes while they clear tickets.

swiwi_

awec wrote: »

I mean those who find it hard to do work without having someone looking over their shoulder to force them to do it.

Or frittering away their working hours as a mod on boards...

Former Former

Buer wrote: »

What I've noticed is that it's very easy to identify who is capable of working from home and who isn't and I don't mean that from technical limitations/infrastructure.

Some people just cannot reliably work at home. Some can. But I find it's very easy to see who is coasting at the moment and I'd put good money they have Netflix on for 5 hours of the day. I know in my team that I can rely on 2 or 3 people to work from home and the others simply cannot deliver on it and will end up on a PIP if they do so.

All in all, I think there will be some sort of change and additional flexibility but a process for personal accountability and performance monitoring will need to be developed in conjunction with it.

Yeah, exactly. At the moment, it's all touchy-feely, our employees are the most important thing in the world and no-one wants to raise the idea that we're all scratching our arses, but a reckoning will have to come.

I have a team member who's falling squarely into the "it took you all day to come up with THIS?!" category, I know she can do the work, but I don't believe she's actually putting in the hours.

Clegg

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Delighted for you and the family Clegg.

I wonder what the next steps on testing will be. I wonder if there’ll be a widespread push or if they won’t take that approach and just push social distancing until there’s a vaccine

If they decide to test widely the turnaround for results will need to pick up. My nan was waiting for just one day between referral and actual test. But it took 5 days to get the result. Maybe they prioritise the positive tests first, I don't know.

stephen_n

Former Former wrote: »

Yeah, a lot of people will want to come back into the office, and I think companies are going to find that while WFH is very possible, productivity takes a massive hit. I don't think we're looking at a seismic shift tbh.

My company has closed one of its offices permanently. I doubt we will ever go back to a full time office based work force. I would imagine it will be mix and match with hot desking for about 70% of the company.

irishbucsfan

There’s always been people like that. Over years people develop the social skills to distract from that in an office environment. That’s been taken away now. I’d say some companies are absolutely seeing major problems with that. I’ve a small enough team and it’s not an issue for us but we’re all well versed in remote work over the years.

Anyone who does look to shift their performance management should look to take the lead of companies who’ve been doing this for years with remote employees. Knowing many Irish companies, there’ll be some disasters where companies try to reinvent the wheel!

There’s going to be a MASSIVE disruption in Dublin in the next few years. First jobs that were acceptable in an office environment will suddenly seem awful remotely, and people will look to move on there. Next there’ll be people who are being let go rightly or wrongly in the new remote work climate. Then you’ve got the fact commercial real estate is going to be absolutely insane with people trying to break leases now a big portion of their staff want to work remotely. Then you’ll have downstream effects of that on businesses across Ireland. Then what happens to the real estate market if you don’t have to live in Dublin for work? Then what happens to wages if 50% of candidates can live in Sligo or Donegal? What happens to Dublin culture if everyone living in Dublin is suddenly from Dublin (and therefore completely uncultured)? Will they turn the Abbey theatre into a bowling hall/quazar for the Dubs? And so on and so forth...

swiwi_

Buer wrote: »

TIL Podge is a weak link.

I ban you from using acronoyms !

Today I learned that TIL means today I learned.