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Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

ancapailldorcha

This thread is a continuation of the megathreads for discussing the presidency of Donald Trump and any matters which relate to this.

Please keep discussion civil and constructive and bear the charter in mind before posting.

Update 16/5/20:

Threadbanned users:

Outlaw Pete
everlast75
mcmoustache
BonnieSituation

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Itssoeasy

Since Friday I've watched a national geographic documentary on watergate and I'm on part one of another Nixon and watergate documentary. I realise this is off topic a bit but Nixon is like a Rhodes scholar compared to trump in all fairness. The common thread with Nixon and trump isn't the actions they took but it's the cover up of the dodgy acts.

My point to tie this all back into Donald trump is the same question applies in that what did the president know and when did he know it.There are reports that as early as January and February the US intelligence were aware of the possibility the corona virus could get serious. Think that may be something that is looked at when this is all over. Did Donald trump know about it and did he intentionally downplay it or as seems more likely to be the case is that he was told about this and didn't understand it and had no intention of learning about it ?

eire4

coastwatch wrote: »

Interesting article in the Guardian last weekend, suggesting the Trump administration will begin to look for scapegoats for the crisis, and may even look to postpone the November elections.
The author is clearly not a fan, and might be exaggerating, but it sounds plausible.
It also sounds like what you might expect from Putin!

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/14/trump-may-exploit-coronavirus-crisis

Whatever about whether he will try to postpone or otherwise delegitimize the November US elections or not there is no doubt in my mind he will look to find scapegoats and lash out at them for the fact that he and his administration have made a complete mess of this crisis and have and are making it worse. I will repeat once again what I said from early on when he took office if a genuine emergency happens while this demagogue is in power run for the hills. It will be a disaster and we sadly are witnessing this happening before our very eyes day by day now.

reg114

The fact that the USA more than any country on the planet relies on consumerism to thrive is their achilles heel. A lockdown is the nightmare of every capitalist, no more so than the posterboy for capitalism Trump. His downright recklessness placing the markets ahead of the health of the American population is testament to his maniacal laserlike focus on the economy at the expense of everything else.

You are going to see 500,000 cases in the US within 10 days with cities like New York really struggling. This hasnt even started for the US. The Dow Jones has lost 33% of its value since Valentines day, but once the virus gets into the population the losses on the stock market so far will be small by comparison.
I mention the stock market because its the one entity that Trump speaks to more than any other. He has taken personal credit for doubling the value of the Dow since 2016. He has also taken credit for record job creation and the bull market America has enjoyed since 2011. Till now Trump's ability to be re-elected was predicated on his handling of the economy, but the only thing that matters now is his handling of covid19. To date it has been utterly disastrous and will absolutely cost lives.

I hope and expect Trump's dishonest calamitous and chaotic approach to this pandemic will finally illustrate to the majority how much of a snake oil salesman he really is. When his elderly base start dying in their droves from this virus, the writing will be on the wall for this clown.

One thing is certain the world will heave a collective sigh of relief when it rids itself of covid19 and of Trump.

Water John

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Since Friday I've watched a national geographic documentary on watergate and I'm on part one of another Nixon and watergate documentary. I realise this is off topic a bit but Nixon is like a Rhodes scholar compared to trump in all fairness. The common thread with Nixon and trump isn't the actions they took but it's the cover up of the dodgy acts.

My point to tie this all back into Donald trump is the same question applies in that what did the president know and when did he know it.There are reports that as early as January and February the US intelligence were aware of the possibility the corona virus could get serious. Think that may be something that is looked at when this is all over. Did Donald trump know about it and did he intentionally downplay it or as seems more likely to be the case is that he was told about this and didn't understand it and had no intention of learning about it ?

Trump was briefed early on but didn't want to hear. Someone was briefing him and all he was concerned about was some question he had about vaping.

Itssoeasy

Water John wrote: »

Trump was briefed early on but didn't want to hear. Someone was briefing him and all he was concerned about was some question he had about vaping.

So the latter then.

everlast75

An interesting counter to the "chinese virus" labeling?

DELETED TWEET - NOT TRUE

Rjd2

Water John wrote: »

Trump was briefed early on but didn't want to hear. Someone was briefing him and all he was concerned about was some question he had about vaping.

It was definitely something he would have been aware of as Carlson has been on from pretty early and I think Bannon was sounding the alarm in January.

Carlson in his interview alluded to the likes of Rick Scott and Graham who he is close with constantly downplaying it to him while he had to spell it out to him and mainly in election terms how serious it was for him when they met a few weeks ago.

Headshot

Good Old Trump, specifically calling the virus "Chinese Virus"

Water John

Is that the Rick Scott now urging the citizens of Florida to get off the beaches? Another great leader!!

Itssoeasy

The fact that trump isn't the best at retaining information may be a defence used. Just because he was told something doesn't seem to be a guarantee that he retains info he's told.

Richard Nixon for all his faults he was an intelligent guy and not on trumps level.

Headshot

Itssoeasy wrote: »

The fact that trump isn't the best at retaining information may be a defence used. Just because he was told something doesn't seem to be a guarantee that he retains info he's told.

Richard Nixon for all his faults he was an intelligent guy and not on trumps level.

You need a picture book for Trump

Itssoeasy

Headshot wrote: »

Good Old Trump, specifically calling the virus "Chinese Virus"

Well it seems to a strategy that has worked in US politcs and funnily enough pro wrestling. The wrestling badguys post World War II were all foreigners. So for a certain section of the American electrate anything outside of America is to be seen with varying levels of suspicion.

LessOutragePlz

everlast75 wrote: »

An interesting counter to the "chinese virus" labeling?

https://twitter.com/eugenegu/status/1241701009144995840?s=19

A quick Google of that claim proves him wrong.

"The swine-origin influenza A (H1N1) virus that appeared in 2009 and was first found in human beings in Mexico, is a reassortant with at least three parents"

https://virologyj.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1743-422X-6-207

I wouldn't believe everything I see or read on Twitter tbh.

Itssoeasy

Headshot wrote: »

You need a picture book for Trump

Seems that way alright.

I know I'm jumping threads but if joe Biden wins in November he'd be following a tradition of a president having been a US senator and Vice President. Was Bush 41 a senator or congressman ? If he was the latter then Nixon was the last to be a senator,VP, and president in that order.

Sorry I know I'm full of useless information at times lads.

Rjd2

Water John wrote: »

Is that the Rick Scott now urging the citizens of Florida to get off the beaches? Another great leader!!

Florida could get really really bad.:(

Ron DeSantis the governor has been very slow on getting on top of this, only closing the beaches the other day and also was content for the Dem primary to happen last week.
https://www.miamiherald.com/opinion/editorials/article241403236.html

Miami Herald editorial team tore him apart above.

Was one of the betting favs for 2024, think he can forget about that also.

Water John

Trump at the presser boasting about his favourable ratings with veterans. It is really sad. His reelection is the priority in his mind.

Headshot

what a scummy to thing to be so sarcastic on Mitt Romney

Leroy42

Water John wrote: »

Trump at the presser boasting about his favourable ratings with veterans. It is really sad. His reelection is the priority in his mind.

Surely he can see that dealing with this, even adequately, will almost guarantee him re election.

The bar is so low, simply to stop lying would be seen as success.

Water John

Trump and esp Pence are running with this turning around in 15 days, now on day 7. If you gave odds of 40:1 I wouldn't put €10 on it.

Yes the remark on Romney was shocking, even for Trump.

Thepoet85

What bounder and a cad this man is. Joking about Romney being isolated because of contact with infected Rand Paul. He just can't help himself. I know I shouldn't be shocked or annoyed, but at challenging times like this, this petulant child is the last man they need in charge. And still people here defend him.

<mod - please read the charter before posting again>

Toeuptony

Thepoet85 wrote: »

Joking about Romney being isolated because of contact with infected Rand Paul. He just can't help himself. I know I shouldn't be shocked or annoyed, but at challenging times like this, this petulant child is the last man they need in charge. And still people here defend him.

Here's the footage of that part:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ik-m9vp9v7E

He is unbelievable.

somewhere45

reg114 wrote: »

One thing is certain the world will heave a collective sigh of relief when it rids itself of covid19 and of Trump.

55% approval rating of how he has handled the COVID-19 precautions.
I have actually reached that point where I just don't care and are starting to find the whole thing "funny" in an utter bizarre way.

Its like we have entered a reality show episode of the twilight zone that will last a lot longer than the usual 30min.

Thepoet85

Thepoet85 wrote:

Nice to see the standard of this forum is higher than that if the most powerful office in the world.

Won't happen again.

greenfield21

one world order wrote: »

Mitt Romney is an awful person, wouldn't blame Trump asking the reporter there giving all the back stabbing his done. A bigger issue is what the luciferian worshipping Illuminati have planned next? A lab based virus that's very advanced tricking the immune system to attack itself is one thing, but pulling the plug on the global debt bubble would be much bigger with larger deaths and destruction around the world.

Say it again?? I'm thinking UBI and MMT to the max. Free money for everyone woohoo.

I despise it and hope the whole house of cards falls, but there really is no other way now - they are cornered. They need quick action with a fast recovery. without huge upfront financial support like the uk is doing it would be a very long road back to normality.

Water John

Trump lamenting his own loss of billions because he became President, was a real Padraig Flynn moment.

marno21

Water John wrote: »

Trump lamenting his own loss of billions because he became President, was a real Padraig Flynn moment.

This lark of handing Mnuchin a massive blank cheque and not having to disclose bailout recipients for 6 months reeks of a backdoor plan to solve the massive debt problem the Trump Organisation has.

20Cent

Rand Paul took the test for Corona Virus, then goes to the gym, swimming and meetings as normal. He's a doctor!! Such lack of taking this seriously is shocking.

A matter of time before a president or prime minister gets it.

Manic Moran

Leroy42 wrote: »

Who cares? Do you think people really care that there are no masks because of a bureaucratic setup? (Sorry, that is not aimed at your comment, but to Joe Public they only care about the result)

People should be asking if the US can be so unprepared for something like this, given they had advance notice, how can they have any faith in their preparedness for something else?

The press conferences are just the very outward view but the lack of testing, the pictures from Spring Break etc and the fact that everyone knows that Trump is not the right person to be in charge of this give the reality.

Nobody is surprised about the press conferences, except that they are going ahead at all. Trump should stay out of it unless he can act professionally.

I suspect you underestimate Joe Q. Public. You are correct that they only care about the result, but that doesn't mean that they don't know where to ask the questions. After all, we're used to it for everything else which affects us from roads to education, and the people in charge damned well ought to know. If you're outside the US, obviously you're going to be more focused on the Federal level. Yet the questions are indeed being asked at the state levels. For example, from the San Francisco Chronicle last week.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/As-infectious-diseases-rose-in-state-public-15133263.php?fbclid=IwAR2g_Cj8kMCrDVSWXSil0A2UnclDkfglMGSgVIOtqcxKGBUd34rxjCcXl7Y

Even before coronavirus, infectious disease was on rise in California — but spending got cut

California’s fight against the coronavirus comes amid long-term budget cuts that public health officials fear will slow efforts to combat the pandemic.

Even as cases of infectious disease have risen, per-capita spending has dropped 18% since 2008 at the California Department of Public Health, one of the lead agencies responding to the COVID-19 crisis, a Chronicle analysis of expenditures reveals. Two state programs designed to fight outbreaks and respond to emergencies have also experienced a decline in spending.

[...]

Public health officials throughout California, however, warned last year that the erosion of local health departments could endanger their responses to a widespread and prolonged emergency.

[...]

State finance data reviewed by The Chronicle show that spending at the California Department of Public Health fell 18% between 2008 and 2019, from about $97 to $79 per person. Per-capita spending at the agency’s emergency preparedness office, which oversees public health disaster planning, dropped 26%, while spending at the infectious disease branch fell 5%.

Or perhaps the Sacramento Bee. (Sticking with CA since I know it best).
https://www.sacbee.com/news/coronavirus/article241237666.html?fbclid=IwAR2if5l_vgwfgQOM99qvdi-vYb-zoCS_X5cq2Fh67pJtOnvchG9c_IWFYss

Fourteen years ago, California made a huge investment in public health by creating a standalone state department and seeding it with tens of millions of dollars in special funding for emergency supplies.

In 2009, former Republican Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger put it to work, using the new department to lead the state’s response to a swine flu outbreak that year.

Then, the Great Recession hit, and California’s spending on its public health department plateaued, even as a 10-year economic expansion swelled the state’s budget by nearly $100 billion.

[...]

California allocated $3.4 billion — about 2.8 percent of its $119 billion budget — for the public health agency in its 2009-2010 financial blueprint.

A decade later, Newsom allotted the same amount of money, now 1.5 percent, in his current $215 billion budget.

“There was a time there that Arnold Schwarzenegger had a bold vision and a responsible one,” said Jack Lewin, former CEO of the California Medical Association and current chairman of the National Coalition on Health Care. “But I think that got diluted over the course of time. People get complacent, and money goes elsewhere.”

As one observer put it, "I'm all for criticizing Trump, but hey Democrats, criticise our useless governor as well. Because as it stands Trump will get all of the blame and no one on the local level will learn a thing."

(He actually went on to express that if CA spends $3bn/year on Dept of Health, how much could have been provided to health if the High Speed Rail $90bn boondoggle had been cancelled. It's true, but in fairness, though I agree HSR was stupid, I would have put the money to other public transport infrastructure and wouldn't have been any better off).

The failing is not only that of the Federal government. Much has been made here, for example, of how Trump was looking to cut the CDC budget and cost-cut by folding the pandemic response team. How much has been made on here that California has done the exact same thing?

Fortunately, the US media and the US people are aware that there are multiple levels, with multiple responsibilities split up between them.

[Edit: That said, so far, we're not doing too badly. https://google.org/crisisresponse/covid19-map
We are still way behind on testing, so our 'confirmed cases' are well under-reported, but so far, capacity is such that our death rate from those confirmed cases isn't too bad. We're well behind Germany, mind, but ahead of Italy, France, UK, and Switzerland amongst others.]

Outlaw Pete

Quite sickening to see the democrats play politics with people's lives.

They spew their sanctimonious nonsense about how the Trump administration aren't doing enough and then effectively block the coronavirus aid package. Mask slipping from the experts at talking out of both sides of their mouths. Stifling the best efforts of the Trump administration has been their default position for three years, one would have hoped they could forget about November given the current crisis and that so many Americans' lives are in jeopardy. I guess not.

Mitch appeals to them to do the right thing nevertheless:

https://twitter.com/KLF/status/1241875404308307975

Hopefully his efforts are not in vain and they see sense and reason, for once.

Midlife

You think blocking this bill is politically astute. Really?

Funny you don't give details.

Just that not agreeing with the republicans is bad.

Who exactly is playing politics there?