Reuben1210 wrote: » Exactly why infrastructure spending needs to be ring-fenced like in France! Takes the politics out of it...
Pete_Cavan wrote: » ...The time it takes for a road to progress through the design phases, go through the motions with ABP, fight the inevitable challenges and complete procurement is longer than a government term...
schmittel wrote: » I don't think the GOTD is currently wide enough to incorporate a bus lane either side, so if they have to widen the road in the glen to add a bus lane, that will get tied up in the courts for a decade as well.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » The point would be to transfer sufficient drivers onto buses such that the GOTD section stays as is. You just need to get the number of vehicles down to a level that traffic can flow. Sorting out all the junctions and accesses from there north will allow traffic to flow better along there so no knock on effects further south. There is not going to be any major increase in road capacity any time soon so the only real option is to reduce traffic to within the existing capacity.
josip wrote: » Very interesting. I had never considered this aspect of it before. Do you think this is a good or a bad thing? Removing parish pump politics from national infrastructure decisions is definitely desirable.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » It has nothing to do with parish pump politics. The time it takes to deliver a major road project is more driven by the legal system, everything from CPOs, planning approval and procurement is open to legal challenges for multiple reasons so everything has to be watertight and that takes time (could be done faster than we currently do things here but not overly so). Often are challenges are made on the basis of EU rules so these are not things that an Irish government can eliminate.
schmittel wrote: » That makes sense in theory I agree, not sure how well it would work in practice. Leaving GOTD as is means converting one lane either side (even if only for rush hour) to a bus lane. This is essentially trying to force drivers into buses by making the traffic even worse that the bus becomes the only tolerable option!
prunudo wrote: » Regarding any possible litigation, at what stage can people take a court case? Can it be done when the preferred route is choosen or can a case only be taken after its gone through full design and been heard at an Bord Plenala oral hearing.
josip wrote: » Do you really believe that the initial prioritisation of projects is currently completely independent of political influence?
josip wrote: » If the GOTD has the worst congestion on the N11, then there is very little point in doing works on any other part until that is addressed. In any throughput-based system, you must resolve the bottlenecks first.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » If a good percentage of those drivers were instead on buses, such that that section of road was within its operating capacity, wouldn't that address the problem?
Pete_Cavan wrote: » I think bus lanes could only be from Kilmac north. The other thing additional road capacity doesn't address the lack of capacity north of Bray. Getting more cars to already congested roads faster will only lead to longer tailbacks. Making traffic even worse is the only thing that will happen, unless you give people an alternative. Having buses using a bus lane to pass sitting traffic from Kilma north makes them a viable alternative.
prunudo wrote: » Thanks Schmittel, wasn't sure at what stage someone could bring it to court. And for the record I have no intention of taking it to court, was just curious on likely time frames should someone wish to do so.
prunudo wrote: » Seemingly there's a new 133 timetable coming out in March with additional services so we'll see if that makes a difference.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » That has nothing to do with it. The time it takes for a road to progress through the design phases, go through the motions with ABP, fight the inevitable challenges and complete procurement is longer than a government term. That is why this project isn't an issue for the next government.
prunudo wrote: » no provision for rail, bus or other transport corridors.
recyclops wrote: » They should get round to cleaning up the ropes, plastic and camps they left behind from the last protest before starting another.
schmittel wrote: » There’s not seriously still remnants of the last protest surely?
punisher5112 wrote: » Just looked up the original protest and it's comical the amount of hippies there. None looked like they ever worked but are the type to tag etc and do dope by the looks of it. Imagine how much safer and less congested it would be if they built it right the 1st time. Hard shoulder is basically not even that safe for a cyclist and a car broken down won't fit in it.... Great job there tree huggers as if you think about it Yee actually caused more environmentally damaging issues by having vehicles bumper to bumper .
spacetweek wrote: » Yikes.... lot of cynics here. The idea that the protesters did more damage than the cars is laughable. Those ropes you see aren't harming the trees at all. I agreed with the GOTD road being widened, but I see it as part of the environmental cost of having cities. It just can't be avoided.
sideswipe wrote: » I think the poster who mentioned damage done was referring to the fact they stopped the road being done effectively and properly with the protest and now traffic is stopped or moving slowly causing extra carbon omissions. Don't think anybody was suggesting the ropes were hurting the trees :pac:
Kian Fast Photography wrote: » Is the timetable really the problem? Maybe sticking to the current timetable might be a start, and actually showing up. Wexford Bus already go the most direct route possible, so I don't see what a new timetable will achieve. The busses are stuck in this congestion too, and will be until an alternative is put in place. I know that more people on public transport will reduce congestion, but getting people to change from car to bus will take years. It needs to be cheaper and quicker than driving, and a pleasant experience. If i decide to get a bus home this evening, I've to walk 10 minutes to a bus stop, then stand there in the rain with no bus shelter. Usually WB will show up in 5 or 10 mins, but I have been waiting for 40 before. It will take over an hour to get to destination stop, then walk 20 minutes home. The alternative is walking outside, jump in the car, and it will take about 80 mins home. I won't get wet, I won't have a stranger beside me, nudging me, and taking up more than their share of space, and if I see traffic, I can take an alternative route. Ive tried the 133, Wexford Bus, train, and driving to the DART and LUAS, but driving point to point wins hands down.
