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Child Item

Election called for Saturday 8 February

Thelonious Monk

Can't see a thread on this. That's pretty soon huh? I hope people vote anything but FF/FG. Why not do something different for a change?

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saabsaab

elperello wrote: »

The only way I could see it working is if it was completely voluntary.

Not linked to LPT.

If the person decided that they would like to take an interest free loan repaid when they pass it would be up to them and their family to decide.

Can't see any tax being voluntary, if it was introduced.
LPT mechanism for collection is already there and BER would be just used to adjust same. No new system to develop.

Of course it would be up to the owner to decide to upgrade but if they don't they will pay by higher fuel costs.

fly_agaric

Bambi wrote: »

The housing we built in the 30s actually worked. By the 60s we had housing projects of the future designed by very clever social engineers who gave us Ballymun and Tallaght and its been downhill ever since

As far as I can see the terrible Ballymun and Tallaght are better than just not building anything + leaving it all to the market or depending on incentive policies like tax breaks for builders/buyers & welfare for private landlords via HAP.

As said already, the country hadn't got a pot to piss in decades past relative to now but still the councils of the day were able to both fund and organise construction of housing.

It was a point of pride (I think - wasn't around) back then & there was a large amount of political & public will. Since around 90s-00s I'd say it became a much lower priority, setting things on the road to where they are now. IMO over the years FF became more interested in the needs and profit margins of the people buying and selling the land/properties and constructing the houses/apartments. In fairness, don't know if FG ever pretended to prioritise the social democracy aspect (ensuring good, low cost housing is provided to all citizens).

Anyway I'm sure the good folk of AH/Current affairs will be bending the ear of their local FF/FG politician over next few weeks...no spending my squeezed middle "tax monies" on "forever homes" for the "fake homeless/idle poor" + will get a deferential little nod & a quiet promise in return!

elperello

saabsaab wrote: »

In order.

Maybe you're right but it could be tweaked/
Again maybe you're right but ditto
I am old enough myself and speak to pensioners all the time I think they would like to upgrade their homes and not have to be saddled with high fuel bills at ongoing cost every winter.
Those taxes don't affect older people directly and a limit could be placed on the % value loss if in the few cases all 3 are levied!

The only way I could see it working is if it was completely voluntary.

Not linked to LPT.

If the person decided that they would like to take an interest free loan repaid when they pass it would be up to them and their family to decide.

Idbatterim

Millionaire only not wrote: »

Who’s the poor people in society certainly not the dole / pyjamas family !

Try the clowns working that can’t get a deposit , start a family everything is on hold for them , yet some of our society can fire out kids at 17 onwards !

so we have the "poor" who get everything for nothing and we have the working poor, who pay E60 for a gp visit etc, the ones paying into the system, often avoid the gp, because they cant justify it or afford it! Is it just me, or does this sound like one hell of a fcuked up system? One poor person gets it all for nothing and the other "poor" person, pays a fortune!

The more you pay in, the less you get out!

James Brown

Millionaire only not wrote: »

Who’s the poor people in society certainly not the dole / pyjamas family !

Try the clowns working that can’t get a deposit , start a family everything is on hold for them , yet some of our society can fire out kids at 17 onwards !

I'd cap allowances at 2 kids and evict anyone not paying rent. I'd also make social housing available to any worker not earning enough to rent. I'd also make sure nobody stayed in them once the market cooled enough.
But folk keep voting FG and expecting changes

Idbatterim

Millionaire only not wrote: »

Until Margaret cash is hauled back to one child and I mean one because that will be two for sure , it will never improve!

Such a simple solution and no one will introduce it !

There breaking this country ! Ad in lower taxes coming in from diesel and petrol in few years ! Guess where they’ll be knocking on mr. Workers door again!

yeah , as a motorist, who has been paying E1809 for the last few years (voluntairly, I knew what I was getting myself into) they now have a system, whereby most cars, petrol, diesel, electric are as good as free motor tax. with electric, yeah they may increase the cost of it, but they will never come close to replacing, what they are going to lose, compared to if you kept your petrol or diesel. I am just echoing your point, the car related revenue may not drop in total, but the revenue per motorist, will start sharply declining IMO...

James Brown

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Hundreds of people, myself included, are in full time employment thanks to JobBridge. It got me the experience I lacked. Gave me the opportunity to prove myself.

Blanch brought up jobbrige as a ruse.
Did a Fas scheme myself one time. Two of us working part time, different shifts. Beat having to pay some fella wages.

Millionaire only not

smurgen wrote: »

You're right it's definitely all poor peoples fault.

Who’s the poor people in society certainly not the dole / pyjamas family !

Try the clowns working that can’t get a deposit , start a family everything is on hold for them , yet some of our society can fire out kids at 17 onwards !

smurgen

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Rents paid?

Sure DCC is owed 33 million in arrears and can t evict these people.

160 euro a month in rent and they can't even pay it.

Would never see a return in investment even if they paid.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/dublin-city-council-5-4956180-Jan2020/%3famp=1

"The latest figures show around 60% of tenants are in arrears with over 5% of tenants owing at least €7,000"

But yeah let's build more social houses for sponges and leeches.

33 million is a pittance.the government just authorized 52 million on a 25 year lease for 87 high end homes for social housing in dublin to a German investment fund.for a cost benefit analysis can you tell me was this a good return over building lower spec adequate housing that the government would have owned as an asset for good while collecting some contribution from tenants?

Plumbthedepths

Bambi wrote: »

The housing we built in the 30s actually worked. By the 60s we had housing projects of the future designed by very clever social engineers who gave us Ballymun and Tallaght and its been downhill ever since. That clown Eoin O'Broin is the latest of the Utopian eejit playing socialist lego with housing

We actually know what works in housing, proper houses, but they still cant resist building cockamamie "social" housing projects.

I lived in social housing from '99-O4. I won't be saying where but it worked well for my family and I. An affordable rent and the opportunity to gather the money to buy my own home. Also there was a varied mix in the scheme. 50 houses in all. 2/3's from my memory were working. Several serving soldiers, a guard, single mums and some unemployed families. Lumping together one class of society is asking for trouble.
As I said it worked for my family, I know several families still living there and to me mixing things up is good for the next generation it sets an example and breaks the generational trap of welfare. My one issue with social housing is selling the asset, that should never happen and all rents should be collected at source of arrears of more than 2 months accrue.

[Deleted User]

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Not in that article.
FYI one of the top Jobbridge lads was using them more than every other business to fill his offices with tax payer paid jobbridge staff. I suppose the tax payer giving free labour to private business is cool. Beats giving people a job right?

Hundreds of people, myself included, are in full time employment thanks to JobBridge. It got me the experience I lacked. Gave me the opportunity to prove myself.

Idbatterim

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Well the thing is unless there is a serious effort made regards housing we are going to start losing FDI. You can attract all the foreign companies you want but if there is nowhere for their employees to live they will look elsewhere. Plus more social housing more private rental available, rental prices drop.

you are absolutely right and this is already happening and has been the case for years no doubt. Crap transport, outrageous marginal tax rate. Rip off housing, high street rents a joke. Rates very high. But companies dont rip in and say we didnt choose Dublin and then just lambast the place, they quietly choose somewhere else and you never hear about it...

saabsaab

elperello wrote: »

I doubt that your idea could gain traction.

Any politician with a good political antennae would run a mile.

You should have a chat with some old people.

Ask them whether it would affect them to have a lien placed on the house they worked hard to provide for themselves.

Inheritance tax and Fair Deal Tax are already enough to worry about.

In order.

Maybe you're right but it could be tweaked/
Again maybe you're right but ditto
I am old enough myself and speak to pensioners all the time I think they would like to upgrade their homes and not have to be saddled with high fuel bills at ongoing cost every winter.
Those taxes don't affect older people directly and a limit could be placed on the % value loss if in the few cases all 3 are levied!

elperello

Idbatterim wrote: »

whats the issue with inheritance tax, they wont miss it when they are dead...

When you get a chance have a chat with a few older people and they will tell you the issue with having liens placed on their property.

Inheritance tax and Fair Deal Tax only really affect people who own their house and have put a bit away for their retirement.

They generally prefer to leave what is left when they die to people they know rather than the government taking a chunk to give to strangers.

James Brown

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Rents paid?

Sure DCC is owed 33 million in arrears and can t evict these people.

160 euro a month in rent and they can't even pay it.

Would never see a return in investment even if they paid.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/dublin-city-council-5-4956180-Jan2020/%3famp=1

"The latest figures show around 60% of tenants are in arrears with over 5% of tenants owing at least €7,000"

But yeah let's build more social houses for sponges and leeches.

Boss, who do you think is living in the hotels and getting plush apartments leased out for them? The black and tans?

smurgen

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Rather money be spent on a Childrens hospital than houses for the absolute filth of society with 5 kids and contribute nothing.

You're right it's definitely all poor peoples fault.

Millionaire only not

Idbatterim wrote: »

just imagine the cost to society of the likes of a margaret cash child, the cost of maternity hospital, education, medical card, house , likely a life of crime, incarceration, if not, life on welfare. The cost is absolutely ASTRONOMIC. these kids then, go on to pop out a few of their own and the cycle continues.

These country really is in a bad way! The people you want to have kids hold off and often then its too late. They pay for the dregs housing and kids, its obscene, there is just no way, that this is facilitated anywhere else on the planet, the way it is here!

Until Margaret cash is hauled back to one child and I mean one because that will be two for sure , it will never improve!

Such a simple solution and no one will introduce it !

There breaking this country ! Ad in lower taxes coming in from diesel and petrol in few years ! Guess where they’ll be knocking on mr. Workers door again!

Idbatterim

Eric Cartman wrote: »

lets revamp our planning regs to not requiring indoor toilets or insulation and build much smaller houses with single glazed windows.

yeah fair HOWEVER, the cost of building current apartments is way too high for average joe soap taxpayer. They need good sound and insulation etc. But the dual aspect requirement, increases the build cost significantly, its a way less efficient use of space. They need to further change the planning laws. The only thing they will contemplate doing, that would result in more being built and it being more affordable, is what I have just proposed.

What do we currently have? most apartments being BTR. The developers build luxury apartments, un-affordable to the masses. This happens EVERYWHERE with a booming economy. I am not blaming the developers. I am blaming idiotic planning and a complicit government. As affordability goes massively down, people are screaming for affordable places to live, but the market is supplying, what makes sense for the market (business) chasing highest returns. I am sure even FG grasp this, it just goes to show you, how they care about nothing other than high prices.

tayto lover

saabsaab wrote: »

Anyone for a BER tax linked with the LPT. The better the BER the les tax you pay/the worse the BER the more you pay.

What about a “breath tax”?
Charge people for the air they breathe in.
Posts are getting sillier.

Odhinn

Bambi wrote: »

The housing we built in the 30s actually worked. By the 60s we had housing projects of the future designed by very clever social engineers who gave us Ballymun and Tallaght and its been downhill ever since. That clown Eoin O'Broin is the latest of the Utopian eejit playing socialist lego with housing

We actually know what works in housing, proper houses, but they still cant resist building cockamamie "social" housing projects.

Ten points out of ten for that.

Dyr

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I heard Leo describe us as wealthy country, yet in the 30's without a pot to p*ss in this country built vast tracts of public housing. Examples of these schemes can be seen all over the country. Yet despite our supposed wealth we can't do it now.
.

The housing we built in the 30s actually worked. By the 60s we had housing projects of the future designed by very clever social engineers who gave us Ballymun and Tallaght and its been downhill ever since. That clown Eoin O'Broin is the latest of the Utopian eejits playing socialist lego with housing

We actually know what works in housing, proper houses, but they still cant resist building cockamamie "social" housing projects.

Plumbthedepths

Idbatterim wrote: »

Different times, money now is the be all and end all now!

Well the thing is unless there is a serious effort made regards housing we are going to start losing FDI. You can attract all the foreign companies you want but if there is nowhere for their employees to live they will look elsewhere. Plus more social housing more private rental available, rental prices drop.

Idbatterim

elperello wrote: »

I doubt that your idea could gain traction.

Any politician with a good political antennae would run a mile.

You should have a chat with some old people.

Ask them whether it would affect them to have a lien placed on the house they worked hard to provide for themselves.

Inheritance tax and Fair Deal Tax are already enough to worry about.

whats the issue with inheritance tax, they wont miss it when they are dead...

Eric Cartman

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I heard Leo describe us as wealthy country, yet in the 30's without a pot to p*ss in this country built vast tracts of public housing. Examples of these schemes can be seen all over the country. Yet despite our supposed wealth we can't do it now.
FGs detractors will say FG has no interest in housing as it doesn't affect their vote base. Afraid it does as parents of all political persuasions watch their children despair at the thought of having their own home.
FG wants us to look forward to the future , ignore the (recent) past.

lets revamp our planning regs to not requiring indoor toilets or insulation and build much smaller houses with single glazed windows.

Idbatterim

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Rather money be spent on a Childrens hospital than houses for the absolute filth of society with 5 kids and contribute nothing.

just imagine the cost to society of the likes of a margaret cash child, the cost of maternity hospital, education, medical card, house , likely a life of crime, incarceration, if not, life on welfare. The cost is absolutely ASTRONOMIC. these kids then, go on to pop out a few of their own and the cycle continues.

These country really is in a bad way! The people you want to have kids hold off and often then its too late. They pay for the dregs housing and kids, its obscene, there is just no way, that this is facilitated anywhere else on the planet, the way it is here!

elperello

saabsaab wrote: »

A Government interested in Green issues might.

Anyway if someone can't pay then they won't. It would pass on to the property as a recovery upon sale. As to it being less valuable when they are gone so what ? Inheritance tax already takes away value and does not directly affect the person concerned.

I doubt that your idea could gain traction.

Any politician with a good political antennae would run a mile.

You should have a chat with some old people.

Ask them whether it would affect them to have a lien placed on the house they worked hard to provide for themselves.

Inheritance tax and Fair Deal Tax are already enough to worry about.

Idbatterim

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I heard Leo describe us as wealthy country, yet in the 30's without a pot to p*ss in this country built vast tracts of public housing. Examples of these schemes can be seen all over the country. Yet despite our supposed wealth we can't do it now.
FGs detractors will say FG has no interest in housing as it doesn't affect their vote base. Afraid it does as parents of all political persuasions watch their children despair at the thought of having their own home.
FG wants us to look forward to the future , ignore the (recent) past.

Different times, money now is the be all and end all now!

Jinglejangle69

smurgen wrote: »

Was there a cost analysis done on the childrens hospital? Doesn't seem like it.

Rather money be spent on a Childrens hospital than houses for the absolute filth of society with 5 kids and contribute nothing.

Idbatterim

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Rents paid?

Sure DCC is owed 33 million in arrears and can t evict these people.

160 euro a month in rent and they can't even pay it.

Would never see a return in investment even if they paid.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/dublin-city-council-5-4956180-Jan2020/%3famp=1

no no no no no! they WONT pay it! I'd love to see their expenditure! no doubt plenty of money for alcohol, take aways and expensive broadband and tv. The latest I phone etc too no doubt ! I forgot the bookies. They are THOSE people's "essentials"I have lived in an area with high concentrations of these people, that is the way it is there. That is their life...

They say they dont have money, what they blow all of their money on, I deem luxuries, hence I dont bloody struggle for the basics at least! Now trying to get the main goal in place, a house, thats what I am working on!

Plumbthedepths

I heard Leo describe us as wealthy country, yet in the 30's without a pot to p*ss in this country built vast tracts of public housing. Examples of these schemes can be seen all over the country. Yet despite our supposed wealth we can't do it now.
FGs detractors will say FG has no interest in housing as it doesn't affect their vote base. Afraid it does as parents of all political persuasions watch their children despair at the thought of having their own home.
FG wants us to look forward to the future , ignore the (recent) past.