Fann Linn wrote: » Who was it that said ,'if FG saw a sleeping dog, they'd kick it'.? You just have to hand it to them.
Professor Genius wrote: » I was born on a Dublin street where the royal drums did beat, And those loving English feet they tramped all over us, And each and every night when me father came home tight He'd invite the neighbors outside with this chorus: Come out ye Black and Tans, come out and fight me like a man, Show your wife how you won medals down in Flanders, Tell them how the IRA made you run like hell away From the green and lovely lanes of Killashandra.
WAW wrote: » Looks like Cromwell's soldiers might be getting a plaque toohttps://www.change.org/p/fine-gael-stop-louth-county-council-plan-to-commemorate-cromwellian-soldiers-killed-in-drogheda?recruiter=false&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=psf_combo_share_initial&utm_term=petition_dashboard&recruited_by_id=bb665e60-2fd1-11ea-965b-2162424e76d3&utm_content=fht-19958774-en-gb%3Av12
Nift wrote: » ah come on now its all fair points, hardly nonsense. No need for the commemoration but its funny that people can't see the wood for the trees. the very reason there will never be a United Ireland is incidents and outrage like this.
We need to take a mature stance around this.
People are quick to forget the facts.
It seems a pr own goal in a way, but this has been flagged for some time. The 1916 celebrations were easy in comparison.
Nift wrote: » ah come on now its all fair points, hardly nonsense. No need for the commemoration but its funny that people can't see the wood for the trees. the very reason there will never be a United Ireland is incidents and outrage like this. We need to take a mature stance around this. I mean if people don't want a United Ireland fair enough, but what will they do when a hypothetical United Ireland celebrates the Battle of the Boyne with a national holiday? this is the reality we are facing. People are quick to forget the facts.https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/theroyalfamily/8121389/How-George-V-was-received-by-the-Irish-in-1911.html We laud the British buildings, the language, the anglo writers, the soccer teams, the culture but oh yeah boy do we hate the English. It seems a pr own goal in a way, but this has been flagged for some time. The 1916 celebrations were easy in comparison. The war of independence and the civil war that followed will be very hard to celebrate.https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/heritage/commemorating-our-journey-to-nationhood-will-not-be-easy-1.3739459
FrancieBrady wrote: » Nonsense. Most people in this country understand the nuances you allude to in the first part of your post. We know there were those in the RIC and the DMP who were just doing their jobs as there were in any colonial force in the world, or as there was in the RUC and the BA. However, honouring/commemorating the existence of the RIC or the DMP and their boot boys as 'organisations' is a step too far. No other peoples/societies would be expected to do it. It is hardly a wet week since another couple of those organisations The RUC and the UDR had to be 'forgotten' because of their behaviour.
mariaalice wrote: » Its a bit craven having the commemoration but on the other hand, the reaction against is way over the top.
ReginaldSmythV wrote: » I’ve seen the petition and all but nothing of a protest yet. Surely there will be one?
TwoMonthsOff wrote: » Ive signed that petition, what's the story with people donating money, what charity does it go to?
Junkyard Tom wrote: » The Ladybird version of history includes 'oh they were just ordinary Irishmen doing a job'. 'Just doing their job'.... How many despicable regimes that committed heinous crimes were 'ordinary men just doing their jobs' instrumental in? That's a rhetorical question.
markodaly wrote: » The reaction to this in my opinion is one of the reason Ireland still is not a mature country. We do have a very odd sense of our historical self and the mythmaking that surrounds pre 1916 Ireland. The whole 800 years blah blah blah stuff doesnt help. People going on about a UI and border poll. The mask is slipping and Unionists in the north are going to take note.
upupup wrote: » Don't Commemorate The Black and Tans petitionhttps://www.change.org/p/fine-gael-don-t-commemorate-the-black-and-tans
degrassinoel wrote: » anyone else think this stunt is just to poke a finger in Sinn Fein's eye before the elections? Honestly thought it was a waterford whispers article i was reading at first :pac:
gormdubhgorm wrote: » The more I think of this the more it annoys me. There seems to be many with a very simplistic view of history based on a single mindset. Anyone who even has a cursory interest in history, knows that history is not black or white. It is not good v evil. Practicalities come into it and day to day life. If you look at the Solohedbeg ambush for instance. It was eight men against two RIC men guarding gelignite. The Irish Volunteers involved in Solohedbeg were Seán Treacy, Dan Breen, Seamus Robinson Seán Hogan, Patrick McCormack, Patrick O'Dwyer Tadhg Crowe, and Michael Ryan. The two RIC men were killed and their names are largely forgotten or a footnote in most versions of Irish history. Constable Patrick O’Connell was 30 years old, he was from Coachford in Co Cork and was going to get married. James McDonnell was a constable as well, a native Irish speaker. McDonnell was from Belmullet in Co Mayo. In his case it was particularly sad as McDonnell was a 56-year-old widower and the father of seven children. Fellas just trying to make a living like anyone today. Both RIC men Catholics by the way in case people are wondering. For their raid the Irish volunteers got three boxes of gelignite, which Breen said that it never got used anyway, because the frost got at it when it was buried. And it was of more danger to the fella using it than anything. So what did it achieve? Of course, today Robinson, Breen and Treacy etc are feted as heroes. But the RIC lads are forgotten as they were ‘British’. Plus, what happened when Ireland became the Free State? The British Civil Service was kept for decades in Ireland and the red post boxes were given a green coat of paint! I am no Leo fan. But I believe Leo is doing the right thing in this case as it takes away the fakery that hangs over Irish history. Also, it could help towards the goal of a United Ireland in the long run as the Unionists will know that other cultures and viewpoints can be recognised. Not only, the staunch Republican one. I know there is a lot of the stereotypical/hypocritical ‘oh ah up the rah’ brigade with Celtic and Liverpool/Man United tattoos who make little effort with the Irish language. But they can comfortably say ‘we’ for British teams without a hint of irony. They also watch British entertainment shows, like British bands and speak English. Feck all Irish except ‘Tiocfaidh ár lá. Yet still go on about how they hate the English…. These types enjoy the mystic of Republicanism. But to me, those types are nothing more than plastic paddies. These are the people that Mary Lou ( ex Fianna Fáiler) et al are trying to appeal to in these ‘protests’ to try and get republican kudos, with the not so bright and/or bigots.
jmcc wrote: » It is always brave little chicken hawks like you send men out to die rather than go fight themselves. It is as simple as this: Varadkar and Flanagan are traitors to the memory of those who fought for Irish freedom. Flanagan is the son of an anti-semitic gombeen bigot. His father would probably want to commemorate concentration camp guards and he is no better. He wants to commemorate the paramilitary force that guarded the food that was shipped out of Ireland during the Famine when Irish people starved. Varadkar is just a politically incompetent poseur playing at being taoiseach in between Kylie Minogue concerts. Hopefully FG will do the needful soon after the next GE. The RIC was a paramilitary organisation that was intended to keep Ireland suppressed and under the control of the British using terror tactics. The two of these gombeens would rather be good little English MPs rather than Irish TDs. Even that useless gobsh!te John "Unionist" Bruton was on the Claire Byrne show advocating that the Black and Tans be commemorated too. Home Rule isn't freedom. It is serfdom to an inbred bunch of middle class Germans masquerading as a "royal" family. Perhaps you want to be British but this is Ireland. And Ireland -- most of it -- is free because people thought differently to you and fought for the right to be free. The Black and Tans, the Auxillaries and much of the RIC were the enemies of Irish freedom and the Irish people. Varadkar, Flanagan and Bruton are a disgrace to Fine Gael. Regards...jmcc
Sean.3516 wrote: » Honestly I don’t see conscription as a price too high to pay for Home Rule.
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