Sunny Disposition wrote: » Yeah, it is going a bit far. They had to be taken on or freedom could not be achieved. As severe as it sounds the truth is that they deserved to be killed.
minikin wrote: » Volkstrauertag - a commemoration of ALL who died in war and by oppressive governments. If we don’t humanise all who died then the headbangers will try to dehumanise them and that only leads to further death. And before anyone starts... have ancestors that were involved in opposing sides of the conflict: RIC and Old IRA.Simplifying our history into ‘them and us’ ignores the reality of Ireland at the time.
KWAG2019 wrote: » There are people in the 26 counties today who wish us to rejoin the British Commonwealth. Who wish us to be a satellite of Britain tied by some sort of federal solution akin to Home Rule. That is fine: as long as they are open about it. When state commemorations are set up in such a way as to dishonour the generation that won our freedom they are not fine.
KWAG2019 wrote: » There is so much objectionable, nonsensical and offensive about this commemoration that it is hard to know where to start. The RIC/DMP were agents of British colonial control and oppression in Ireland. There is no reason to commemorate that or its agents. What has happened now is that there is a version of "inclusivity" used to promote absurdities like this commemoration. These men may like many others who served in Brit forces have had all sorts of reasons for doing so but those are all irrelevant in the commemoration of the War of Independence. That commemoration should be of those who fought and died for our freedom, not those who opposed it. By resurrecting the division of 100 years ago the govt has been divisive and provocative. The HARP group of those who promote the memory of RIC/DMP may see this as a win for them but they have re-opened old wounds. It reflects nothing on anybody today that they had a relative in DMP/RIC or British forces upholding colonial oppression here. By creating a commemoration that seeks to honour and remember those who fought against our freedom the State is showing the absurd lack of confidence which has bedevilled it in recent years. There is also an absurd idea that by doing this you are advancing unity. There is a profound naivete and innocence about dealing with Unionists/loyalists and that obsequiousness like this make us more attractive to them. You don't negotiate in advance of negotiations and you don't declare your hand unless you've already surrendered. And let's be very clear: there is an agenda of undermining our status as an independent sovereign republic. When the Minister of Justice refers to the killing of RIC/DMP as "murder" he denies that the War of Independence was a struggle for our freedom. He is implicitly upholding the imposition of British colonialism by force by that force. When John Bruton refers to the highlight of his time as Taoiseach as meeting the Prince of Wales you begin to get a sense of something. There are people in the 26 counties today who wish us to rejoin the British Commonwealth. Who wish us to be a satellite of Britain tied by some sort of federal solution akin to Home Rule. That is fine: as long as they are open about it. When state commemorations are set up in such a way as to dishonour the generation that won our freedom they are not fine.
Kermit.de.frog wrote: » No one deserves to be killed for either their political beliefs or simply doing their job. No one.
TheValeyard wrote: » From what I understood, It does not remember Stasi/ SS but rather their victims. I do see why they remember the soldiers of the wehrmacht though.
Sunny Disposition wrote: » They had to be taken on or freedom could not be achieved. As severe as it sounds the truth is that they deserved to be killed.
Hamsterchops wrote: » Indeed myth has it that Countess Markievicz dispatched one of those "that deserved to be killed" by shooting him in the head in Stephens Green. Apparently this constable on foot tried to usher the Fenians out of the park so she shot him dead, for this she's a hero and he's almost forgotten.....
FTA69 wrote: » Fair play to her.
KWAG2019 wrote: » This proposal is a divisive insult to those who wish to honour those who fought for our freedom. The govt will attempt to control local groups through grants as usual. Their view of history is a denial of reality and an attempt to smuggle unionism into currency on the back of revisionism and condescension. I will attend no govt commemorations and I will donate to local groups who wish to ignore this insult.
corner of hells wrote: » If the local group is a registered charity and you donate 250euros , you'll be able to claim tax relief. Though you'd have to interact with the government.
corner of hells wrote: » Yup , bearing in mind the DMP were largely unarmed.
saabsaab wrote: » I believe that a UI is around the corner and many 'Loyalists' see this too. Although RIC and DMP ended up on the wrong side in 1919-1921 most were at the time ordinary policemen caught up in it and trying to do a job. Several were unhappy with the way the force was used to subjugate the Irish people and worked often in secret for the rebels. A relation of mine was in the DMP but died in the first world war. Don't confuse them with the 'Black and Tans' or 'Auxiliaries' specifically recruited to put down the rebellion they are a different group.
Bambi wrote: » Don'r confuse them? Were you down the back sniffing glue in history class along with the rest of the larries parading around here spouting nonsense about the RIC just local bobbies on the beat? You realise the Black and Tans were actually called the Royal Irish Constabulary Special Reserve and the Auxies were the The Auxiliary Division of the Royal Irish Constabulary They were the RIC and the RIC got what was a long time coming to them in the War of Independance.
Bambi wrote: » Don'r confuse them? Were you down the back sniffing glue in history class along with the rest of the larries parading around here spouting nonsense about the RIC just local bobbies on the beat?You realise the Black and Tans were actually called the Royal Irish Constabulary Special Reserve and the Auxies were the The Auxiliary Division of the Royal Irish Constabulary They were the RIC and the RIC got what was a long time coming to them in the War of Independance.
FTA69 wrote: » More revisionist rubbish. As someone said above, the RIC worked hand in hand with the Black and Tans and served alongside them in their barracks.
spurious wrote: » And many RIC resigned when the Tans were introduced. And there were hundreds of letters of complaint sent by serving RIC men as to what was going on with the Tans. The whole story, not just part of it. As I said, cartoonish versions.
saabsaab wrote: » There was a story of a commanding officer instructing RIC men in Cork to shoot first and ask questions later. One RIC man stood out of the parade and said 'you forget you are talking to irishmen' When an order was given to arrest that man not one moved.
KWAG2019 wrote: » Many resigned under pressure from their community and IRA action. We should honour their resignation not their service. Those who continued to serve chose to attempt to continue British colonialism in Ireland by force.
