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M7 - Naas/Newbridge Bypass Upgrade [Junction 9a now open]

JupiterKid

Following on from the suggestion of a poster, this thread has been set up to discuss the need for widening the M7.

The section of the M7 IMO in immediate need (really a backlog need) for widening is the section from the Maudlins Interchange at Naas to the M9 interchange - basically the original 1983 Naas Bypass and half of the 1993 Newbridge Bypass. Is this likely to proceed in the near future?

Would the central median be wide enough for widening to D3M here? I'm pretty sure it is wide enough on the Newbridge bypass section but I'm not so sure in the case of the Naas Bypass.

Also, what bridges will need to be demolished and rebuilt? Or would it be more practical to drop the hard shoulder through the existing bridges?

What about the proposal a few years back to build a new junction at on the Naas Bypass at Osberstown? Will it still go ahead?

In the longer term, does anyone see a need to widen the M7 to the N7/M8 junction?

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emfifty

newholland mad wrote: »

Talking to a worker who drives an excavator on that scheme and he said there's a roumor on site that 7km is subsiding and might have to be redone. After driving northbound on Saturday I'd well believe that.

If it's true, wouldn't surprise me.
If the 80km/h speed limit has not been removed from Monday 23rd, we'll know why!

road_high

newholland mad wrote: »

Talking to a worker who drives an excavator on that scheme and he said there's a roumor on site that 7km is subsiding and might have to be redone. After driving northbound on Saturday I'd well believe that.

Oh dear god, I hope that isn't true. That land is generally good solid soil, i could understand if it was through bog land.
It does feel uneven and wallowy in parts alright. Thought especially around the still unopened Kerry exit. A very poorly executed and managed project it has to be said.

road_high

regedit wrote: »

TBH, the whole widening project is sloppy enough.
As if though people have stopped taking pride of the work they do. The final layer is bumpy enough in multiple places and I dont know if there's any way this can be fixed.
The thing was optimistically meant to open in April but while we're nearing the end of the year, there seems to be a lot needed to complete the job. Even announcements on the M7 widening website are incorrect re speed limits etc. Not sure if it's siac or the abysmal KCC. I thought exit 9a was meant to open up but there's still cones and n indication when they may open it up. Hardly any builders or equipment there anymore so they must have shiftd their focus on the Sallins Bypass

You'd have to wonder are there issues with payments between SIAC and TII or whoever ultimately pays the invoices. Usually when there's a slowdown/general abandonment like this, money usually the root of it.

antietam1

BuzzFish wrote: »

Received the below from Kildare CoCo on Friday. My read is that the contractor does not give 2 ####s about the pain they have caused in Naas and Sallins during construction and don't want to do anything to at least get J9a open to address traffic problems in the run to Christmas. I'd have hoped that Kildare CoCo would be keeping them under pressure but they seem to be just waiting...

From Kildare CoCo:
Please note that we are awaiting confirmation from the contractor that the works have been completed at Junction 9a Osberstown and that a road safety audit has been carried out to confirm that it is safe to open the new Junction 9a.

we are currently awaiting word from the contractor on this matter and have received no indication from the contractor as to when the Junction 9a will be ready in terms of an opening date.

Co Councils are unbelievable, I put pressure on them with the help of neighbours to fix the trip hazards caused by roots erupting through like mini volcanoes.
They came in all tooled up and did the safe footpaths an left the dangerous ones, one 15 metre stretch has 10 trip hazards.
Sorry for going off topic, thank for all the info

Darc19

newholland mad wrote: »

Talking to a worker who drives an excavator on that scheme and he said there's a roumor on site that 7km is subsiding and might have to be redone. After driving northbound on Saturday I'd well believe that.

Ah come on, do you really really think people will believe that sh1te???

It's not a brand new road, it's an extra lane on a road that has been there for years.

WishUWereHere

road_high wrote: »

Oh dear god, I hope that isn't true. That land is generally good solid soil, i could understand if it was through bog land.
It does feel uneven and wallowy in parts alright. Thought especially around the still unopened Kerry exit. A very poorly executed and managed project it has to be said.

Fair play to Regedit. He/She flagged the uneven surface soon after the 3rd lane was opened

Traffic was mental around the bundle of sticks tonight.

Darc19

WishUWereHere wrote: »

Fair play to Regedit. He/She flagged the uneven surface soon after the 3rd lane was opened

Traffic was mental around the bundle of sticks tonight.

Actually, it was a poster called Harr and Regedit felt the same.

BUT, it was the resurfacing of lane ONE that the issue was with - that is not a new lane and therefore I call the anonymous "person who works on it" post, BS.

You'd have to have completely different ground geology in a line directly in tandem with current road for 7km. Basically impossible. Hence total BS.

_Kaiser_

Darc19 wrote: »

Actually, it was a poster called Harr and Regedit felt the same.

BUT, it was the resurfacing of lane ONE that the issue was with - that is not a new lane and therefore I call the anonymous "person who works on it" post, BS.

You'd have to have completely different ground geology in a line directly in tandem with current road for 7km. Basically impossible. Hence total BS.

Why is it that you have an issue with everyone or everything that questions the competence or delivery of this project?

At best it's been a mess from a communication standpoint. At worst it's been a shambles of poor organisation, poor delivery, and questionable quality of the end product.

Darc19

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Why is it that you have an issue with everyone or everything that questions the competence or delivery of this project?

At best it's been a mess from a communication standpoint. At worst it's been a shambles of poor organisation, poor delivery, and questionable quality of the end product.

I have no issues with anyone who provides real and reliable information, but bs about someone someone knows said xyz and gives nothing else, is pure BS.

Same with posters saying xyz was mentioned before when what was mentioned before was not what that poster was saying.

That's how people get mis information - believing bs spouted by uninformed people.

Some posters have a real insight on this project from their workplaces and official information and their information has been proven to be reliable.

I'd rather believe those posters.

Emme

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Why is it that you have an issue with everyone or everything that questions the competence or delivery of this project?

At best it's been a mess from a communication standpoint. At worst it's been a shambles of poor organisation, poor delivery, and questionable quality of the end product.

I gave up posting here for that reason. Anyone who questioned the timeliness of the project or the activities of the work teams was shot down. There seemed to be a vested interest in doing that. Yet the project has been consistently late with milestones delayed several times. The M7/M9 merge southbound is treacherous at best. That's only one example of the mess. I never approach the M7 from the Bundle of Sticks (or what's left of it) now. When will it be finished? Between that and the new Children's Hospital we don't seem to be able to do project management in Ireland. Being in the Chinese, the Germans, the Norwegians - ANYONE - just get the road finished!

road_high

Emme wrote: »

I gave up posting here for that reason. Anyone who questioned the timeliness of the project or the activities of the work teams was shot down. There seemed to be a vested interest in doing that. Yet the project has been consistently late with milestones delayed several times. The M7/M9 merge southbound is treacherous at best. That's only one example of the mess. I never approach the M7 from the Bundle of Sticks (or what's left of it) now. When will it be finished? Between that and the new Children's Hospital we don't seem to be able to do project management in Ireland. Being in the Chinese, the Germans, the Norwegians - ANYONE - just get the road finished!

Not just me then? I thought it worked much better pre "upgrade"!

road_high

In many ways critics of the operation of this project have been vindicated and more in hindsight. Partly even worse than what they’d predicted (Junction 9a shambles and Bundle of Sticks fannying about being cases in point). And I’d dearly wished they were wrong

newholland mad

Darc19 wrote: »

Ah come on, do you really really think people will believe that sh1te???

It's not a brand new road, it's an extra lane on a road that has been there for years.

This wasn't a one off encounter with a stranger. I know this person and talking to him on a regular basis his job would come up in discussion and at any stage up to now he hasn't fed any of us bs. So not saying it will happen for sure but it's obviously been talked about

jmkennedyie

There is so little official info trickling out on this project that I for one appreciate whatever snippets people come across through unofficial channels and chats and take the time to post in good faith. They may not turn out to be true - no worries - but maybe they are. It shouldn't happen this day and age, but given the final surface had to be dug and laid in seperate strips due to live lanes, it seems like a technical possibility to me that a base layer is not deep enough or compacted enough or densities etc between strips are not perfectly uniform and so lateral settling. Hopefully not. Time will tell.

In other news, this minor roundabout is now open: https://www.openstreetmap.org/?mlat=53.20638&mlon=-6.71255#map=17/53.20638/-6.71255. Plenty of work in that general area (large reservoir) in recent weeks. Also on the bypass, especially Osberstown overbridge/railway bridge/canal bridge area. Sadly
J10 S roundabout still needs a final layer

WishUWereHere

Emme wrote: »

I gave up posting here for that reason. Anyone who questioned the timeliness of the project or the activities of the work teams was shot down. There seemed to be a vested interest in doing that. Yet the project has been consistently late with milestones delayed several times. The M7/M9 merge southbound is treacherous at best. That's only one example of the mess. I never approach the M7 from the Bundle of Sticks (or what's left of it) now. When will it be finished? Between that and the new Children's Hospital we don't seem to be able to do project management in Ireland. Being in the Chinese, the Germans, the Norwegians - ANYONE - just get the road finished!

I find it sad to learn people with input/views stop posting because of the approach adopted by certain posters.

Personally, I only have 3 people on ignore, This darc19 is one. The reason I have them there is because His/Her approach is very bombastic & arrogant.

prunudo

One thing that this thread has shown me is that simply adding a lane to an existing road is getting harder and more complicated with all the new rules and regulations regarding h&s and just the fact of having to deal with live traffic.
Lessons will have to be learnt if the plan a similar upgrade to the n11, where you have added hindrances of conservation areas, 2 large water mains and many businesses to contend with.

prunudo

WishUWereHere wrote: »

I find it sad to learn people with input/views stop posting because of the approach adopted by certain posters.

Personally, I only have 3 people on ignore, This darc19 is one. The reason I have them there is because His/Her approach is very bombastic & arrogant.

Its a shame you feel you have to put people on ignore, even if you don't agree with them, its never good to blank out an opposing view.
There are posters I disagree with on certain posts but then agree with on others, they'd have to really insult me or offend me before I'd put them on ignore.

traco

Quick note - at the new exit 10 Southbound the roundabout at the top of the slip is now open for traffic to proceed directly to Newbridge rather than having to travel back towards Naas to the bundle of sticks to make a U-Turn.

Downside is that traffic is very heavy at the bundle of sticks heading from Naas to Newbrdige as its a single lane and with the new roundabout open it is being held up getting through the new roundabout due to traffic from the M7 using it.

This is as of 7:45 am this morning when I drove through.

As mentioned in other posts the new nearside lane from exit 9 to 10 is not great, several dips or ruts, not holes but undulations that aren't normally on a motorway surface. I decided to stay in for the duration this morning just to verify for myself.

traco

Another update from our office admin that arrived late due to traffic. Refer to above post for further info

Came from Naas town and said traffic was backed up heading towards Newbridge, this was back to Chadwicks / Jigginstown castle and is an entirely new thing. She said it was nuts so I'm guessing its a knock on effect from traffic not being able to make it through the new roundabout now open at the top of the exit 10 southbound off ramp now being open. Probably compounded by only one lane being available coming from Naas going towards Newbridge.

_Kaiser_

Darc19 wrote: »

I have no issues with anyone who provides real and reliable information, but bs about someone someone knows said xyz and gives nothing else, is pure BS.

Same with posters saying xyz was mentioned before when what was mentioned before was not what that poster was saying.

That's how people get mis information - believing bs spouted by uninformed people.

Some posters have a real insight on this project from their workplaces and official information and their information has been proven to be reliable.

I'd rather believe those posters.

That's fine, but your attitude could do with some work, expecially considering that a lot of the information from "official sources" around finishing times and restoration of speed limits has been proven to be just as unreliable.

As I've said repeatedly, this project has been a mess of poor communication, poor planning, and poor delivery - especially given the supposed (and self-promoted) expertise of the parties involved.

We can only hope that serious lessons have been learned here, but I somehow doubt it. The next major roads project will tell us a lot though.

Pete_Cavan

Emme wrote: »

I gave up posting here for that reason. Anyone who questioned the timeliness of the project or the activities of the work teams was shot down. There seemed to be a vested interest in doing that. Yet the project has been consistently late with milestones delayed several times. The M7/M9 merge southbound is treacherous at best. That's only one example of the mess. I never approach the M7 from the Bundle of Sticks (or what's left of it) now. When will it be finished? Between that and the new Children's Hospital we don't seem to be able to do project management in Ireland. Being in the Chinese, the Germans, the Norwegians - ANYONE - just get the road finished!

Questioning unsubstantiated information is one thing but I don't see how posts like the above are acceptable. What gives posters like this the right to question the ability of everyone in a particular industry? Can we sack these posters and all their colleagues and bring in replacements from abroad when a problem arises?

The fact is that in this country a sizable motorway network was delivered in a short period of time and individual projects were generally successful and without major issues. A small number of high profile issues get splashed all over the media to feed the "we can't do anything right in Ireland" crowd who lap it up. If they looked at working conditions in China and their environmental record, or Berlin new airport, they would find that the grass isn't always greener.

harr

traco wrote: »

Another update from our office admin that arrived late due to traffic. Refer to above post for further info

Came from Naas town and said traffic was backed up heading towards Newbridge, this was back to Chadwicks / Jigginstown castle and is an entirely new thing. She said it was nuts so I'm guessing its a knock on effect from traffic not being able to make it through the new roundabout now open at the top of the exit 10 southbound off ramp now being open. Probably compounded by only one lane being available coming from Naas going towards Newbridge.

I traveled to Naas this morning and used J10 and the traffic coming out of Naas heading to Newbridge was back to the Audi garage and this was 10am .. trying to get off the slip at j10 was a nightmare as it had huge volumes of traffic heading from Naas , cue of traffic was nearly back to motorway.
Very little work being done a few lads fluting about moving traffic cones around the place.
Doesn’t seem to be any urgency in getting any work done ...meanwhile a perfectly usable junction lies empty ( j9a) ..
It’s beyond frustrating at this stage ..

Darc19

When someone posts that they heard from "someone" and it's not backed up by anything and makes no sense, I'll call it as bs.

I've yet to see a single one of these "rumours" come through.

I also have called out the contractors/tii/kcc on their utterly abysmal communications - definitely the most appalling of any project.

As for the jct 10 roundabouts. Seems one or both have opened this afternoon but not made any difference.

BTW, if you are coming from Naas, take the ring road, turn left towards rathasker stud and follow the road all the way down to the old m7 on ramp, drive by Naas Nissan and you're at the bundle of sticks.

Will save you a lot of time

road_high

harr wrote: »

I traveled to Naas this morning and used J10 and the traffic coming out of Naas heading to Newbridge was back to the Audi garage and this was 10am .. trying to get off the slip at j10 was a nightmare as it had huge volumes of traffic heading from Naas , cue of traffic was nearly back to motorway.
Very little work being done a few lads fluting about moving traffic cones around the place.
Doesn’t seem to be any urgency in getting any work done ...meanwhile a perfectly usable junction lies empty ( j9a) ..
It’s beyond frustrating at this stage ..

Can someone Local get on to one of the (useless) Kildare tds that lives there? Martin Heydon is great for photo ops when things are all happy clappy- he’s invisible when problems need sorting

Darc19

Both roundabouts on jct 10 are fully open.
They had lines painted too, so that may have been the delay earlier.
Means traffic from Newbridge going m7 Southbound no longer needs to use bundle of sticks. Same for traffic coming off m7 and heading to Newbridge

Still not making any difference to Naas delays. That needs jct 9a to open. Which they could do in minutes if they really wanted to.

sondagefaux

mrsoundie wrote: »

It may appear that the only option at the moment would be to out Traffic Lights on all the on-ramps to the M7/N7 and use them to control the amount of traffic entering the M7/N7. I can't think of what Motorways have this in the UK.

It's called ramp metering and it's been used on motorways in the UK:

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Ramp_Metering

_Kaiser_

sondagefaux wrote: »

It's called ramp metering and it's been used on motorways in the UK:

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Ramp_Metering

They also have it from the R104 roundabout on-ramp to the M50/M1 just after the port tunnel

https://goo.gl/maps/RT3VMFhunnTGjdh48

sondagefaux

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

They also have it from the R104 roundabout on-ramp to the M50/M1 just after the port tunnel

https://goo.gl/maps/RT3VMFhunnTGjdh48

It's also used in New Zealand.

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/roads-and-rail/ramp-signals/

Mantis Toboggan

sondagefaux wrote: »

It's called ramp metering and it's been used on motorways in the UK:

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Ramp_Metering

Is that what's in action joining South bound at Newlands?

WishUWereHere

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

They also have it from the R104 roundabout on-ramp to the M50/M1 just after the port tunnel

https://goo.gl/maps/RT3VMFhunnTGjdh48

Isn’t there also one coming up onto the Chapelizod by-pass from Kylemore Road heading WB?