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Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

[Deleted User]

Continued from here
https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057953711/251
All Ireland Senior XV related talk here.

MOD: Bear in mind this thread is starting during the World Cup window and the zero tolerance policy is in force. Trolling will be rewarded with an instant ban. For the duration of the tournament any mention of Zebo in this thread will not be permitted, it is just dragging current Ireland squad talk off topic.

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Stout Warrior

On the succession to Sexton - I don't think Carty, Byrne or Burns are the answer. Maybe a stop gap until we feed through a few younger players who will become more established.

I think long term it will be Carbery, Healy maybe younger Byrne. We will need to feed through more fly halves into academies in the coming years until we get a proper replacement. I'm looking at you Mr. Nucifora.

Shefwedfan

Stout Warrior wrote: »

On the succession to Sexton - I don't think Carty, Byrne or Burns are the answer. Maybe a stop gap until we feed through a few younger players who will become more established.

I think long term it will be Carbery, Healy maybe younger Byrne. We will need to feed through more fly halves into academies in the coming years until we get a proper replacement. I'm looking at you Mr. Nucifora.

If anything Ireland is stronger now than ever at 10

We have

Sexton
Carbery
Carty
R Byrne
Burns
Fitzgerald
Healy
H. Byrne
johnson

all playing at provinces......not sure how you are going to find space for more 10's?

At one stage it was ROG or .......well nobody

Also writing off R Byrne is a bit early. He is only around the same age as when Sexton broke into the Ireland team. Any game he has played this season he has been exceptional. The Glasgow game as well when he took the ball in the back field and ran at speed back into the line, I dont think I was the only one who thought it was Keenan. I would not be surprised at all to see him pushing to start for Ireland. Especially if Sexton is out and he will be playing all the games till the 6 nations

Burns as well is only into his second season, he has played a lot better now after adjusting to switch.

Sugar Free

What's the latest with Carbery?

[Deleted User]

Sugar Free wrote: »

What's the latest with Carbery?

Don't ask me where I read it but targeting the Leinster game, might not make it.

aloooof

Niallof9 wrote: »

...whats it matter if he misses a near mickey mouse match against the Scots..

Do you really need to use this hyperbole? You seem awfully invested in what you are deeming a "mickey mouse match".

In any case, it's a real shame that Carbery's injury may be coinciding with Sexton's here. If Carbery can get himself fit and firing, it's a potentially great opportunity for him to get some consecutive starts in for Ireland.

Eod100

Interested Observer wrote: »

Don't ask me where I read it but targeting the Leinster game, might not make it.

Think it was end of December alright

[Deleted User]

Sexton is in good spirits about it

https://i.imgur.com/cmy7jL0.jpg

Faugheen

If form is the shiny word around here, then Ross Byrne should be starting.

awec

Ross Byrne is going to have a great platform to give a good account of himself for the next 8-10 weeks anyway.

New Ireland coach, new ideas (hopefully), that #10 jersey should be there for someone to grab.

Dubinusa

I would not write off RB. With Carberry injured and now Sexton injured, he has a chance to get a run of games. Farrell, may be open to all the 10's. Carberry may not be annointed just yet. Carty may regain form and Burns is playing well for Ulster.
Regardless. the lads need to stake a claim. I wouldn't be too disappointed with Byrne getting the nod. It's a golden opportunity to see who's up to the challenge.

Former Former

awec wrote: »

Ross Byrne is going to have a great platform to give a good account of himself for the next 8-10 weeks anyway.

New Ireland coach, new ideas (hopefully), that #10 jersey should be there for someone to grab.

I dunno, Byrne has had an armchair ride in pretty much every game he's played this season and he's still not standing out for me.

Like, JGP has looked a class act while the Leinster pack have been grinding opponents to dust, but I just haven't seen it from Byrne.

I don't think anyone will challenge a fit Carbery

awec

Former Former wrote: »

I dunno, Byrne has had an armchair ride in pretty much every game he's played this season and he's still not standing out for me.

Like, JGP has looked a class act while the Leinster pack have been grinding opponents to dust, but I just haven't seen it from Byrne.

I don't think anyone will challenge a fit Carbery

I agree that he hasn't stood out.

My point was he has 10 weeks now where he is likely to start every game of importance, so if he wants to play for Ireland he better start standing out. He has a platform that the other contenders can only dream of.

Dubinusa

Thing is Leinster viewed Byrne as the better 10. Graham Henry spent a week or 2 with Leinster and annointed Carberry. Iirc.
Carberry hasn't impressed me very much. He does'nt seem to control the game. Anyway, we will see fairly soon.

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

I dunno, Byrne has had an armchair ride in pretty much every game he's played this season and he's still not standing out for me.

Like, JGP has looked a class act while the Leinster pack have been grinding opponents to dust, but I just haven't seen it from Byrne.

I don't think anyone will challenge a fit Carbery

Not sure what R Byrne needs to do to be honest. He has played in HC a few years now and played well at all times. Loads of games, Exeter in Aviva, Toulouse last year etc.

He kicks his scores, scores tries. Links the forwards and backs. More times that not is on winning side. Can close out difficult games(Ulster last season in HC).....

Has brought a running threat to his game this season.

Still people seem to find issues with him. Not sure what it is......

Dubinusa

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Not sure what R Byrne needs to do to be honest. He has played in HC a few years now and played well at all times. Loads of games, Exeter in Aviva, Toulouse last year etc.

He kicks his scores, scores tries. Links the forwards and backs. More times that not is on winning side. Can close out difficult games(Ulster last season in HC).....

Has brought a running threat to his game this season.

Still people seem to find issues with him. Not sure what it is......

I don't get it either. Playing behind the world rugby player of the year and all. He's done well, imo

Faugheen

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Not sure what R Byrne needs to do to be honest. He has played in HC a few years now and played well at all times. Loads of games, Exeter in Aviva, Toulouse last year etc.

He kicks his scores, scores tries. Links the forwards and backs. More times that not is on winning side. Can close out difficult games(Ulster last season in HC).....

Has brought a running threat to his game this season.

Still people seem to find issues with him. Not sure what it is......

It’s because he’s not fancy or flashy.

Give me substance over style everyday

Shefwedfan

Dubinusa wrote: »

Thing is Leinster viewed Byrne as the better 10. Graham Henry spent a week or 2 with Leinster and annointed Carberry. Iirc.
Carberry hasn't impressed me very much. He does'nt seem to control the game. Anyway, we will see fairly soon.

It was on the back of Henry comments that Carbery suddenly jumped the queue and was on the plane to Chicago.

Carbery hasn't played enough at 10, he has a total of 53 caps between Leinster and Munster. Most of the Leinster caps at 15....he is still very young and injury has hampered his chance to nail himself down as the heir to Sexton. Huge amount of pressure on him as well....

Ross Byrne for instance has played 71 times, all at 10.

Former Former

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Not sure what R Byrne needs to do to be honest. He has played in HC a few years now and played well at all times. Loads of games, Exeter in Aviva, Toulouse last year etc.

He kicks his scores, scores tries. Links the forwards and backs. More times that not is on winning side. Can close out difficult games(Ulster last season in HC).....

Has brought a running threat to his game this season.

Still people seem to find issues with him. Not sure what it is......

Ugh, is the little dig at the end absolutely necessary?

But you tell me.

If Ross Byrne is all that, and I just have some ulterior motive for questioning him, how did he end up behind Jack Carty in the Ireland pecking order?

aloooof

Dubinusa wrote: »

Thing is Leinster viewed Byrne as the better 10. Graham Henry spent a week or 2 with Leinster and annointed Carberry. Iirc.
Carberry hasn't impressed me very much. He does'nt seem to control the game. Anyway, we will see fairly soon.

Carbery has been brilliant in spells for Munster, but his biggest issue is staying fit. If he can shake off the injury problems, imo he's in poll position to take over after Sexton.

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

Ugh, is the little dig at the end absolutely necessary?

But you tell me.

If Ross Byrne is all that, and I just have some ulterior motive for questioning him, how did he end up behind Jack Carty in the Ireland pecking order?

What little dig?

Former Former

Shefwedfan wrote: »

It was on the back of Henry comments that Carbery suddenly jumped the queue and was on the plane to Chicago.

You come out with the maddest sh*t and it's always factually incorrect.

Carbery started that season as the Leinster out-half, Byrne wasn't featuring at all, in fact he was behind Cathal Marsh in the 'queue'. It was only Marsh's injury and Carbery's international involvement that got him into the reckoning.

It was Paddy Jackson's visa issues that got Carbery on the plane to Chicago, not something Graham Henry might have said.

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

It was on the back of Henry comments that Carbery suddenly jumped the queue and was on the plane to Chicago.

Carbery hasn't played enough at 10, he has a total of 53 caps between Leinster and Munster. Most of the Leinster caps at 15....he is still very young and injury has hampered his chance to nail himself down as the heir to Sexton. Huge amount of pressure on him as well....

Ross Byrne for instance has played 71 times, all at 10.

Minutes played would be more revealing than caps (Byrne would still come out well ahead) but even so, I don't think the extra experience would swing it in Byrne's favour. If you're good enough, you're old enough, as the saying goes.

Shefwedfan

aloooof wrote: »

Minutes played would be more revealing than caps (Byrne would still come out well ahead) but even so, I don't think the extra experience would swing it in Byrne's favour. If you're good enough, you're old enough, as the saying goes.

Im not saying Carbery isn't good enough. I was replying to a comment that said Carbery hasn't impressed and can't control a game...

I was just pointing out he has had a lot of injuries which has interrupted his progress. I just used Byrne as a comparison as he is similar age and both started at the same time....Byrne has a lot more time at 10 and minutes under his belt....

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

You come out with the maddest sh*t and it's always factually incorrect.

Carbery started that season as the Leinster out-half, Byrne wasn't featuring at all, in fact he was behind Cathal Marsh in the 'queue'. It was only Marsh's injury and Carbery's international involvement that got him into the reckoning.

It was Paddy Jackson's visa issues that got Carbery on the plane to Chicago, not something Graham Henry might have said.

First I am making an imaginary dig and now your having a little rant

Yes everyone is fully aware it was supposed to be PJ on the flight to Chicago. Do you not think Carbery suddenly getting on the plane was a surprise at the time? from my recollections (factually correct or not) was it was a huge surprise and a massive story in the news

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Im not saying Carbery isn't good enough. I was replying to a comment that said Carbery hasn't impressed and can't control a game...

I was just pointing out he has had a lot of injuries which has interrupted his progress. I just used Byrne as a comparison as he is similar age and both started at the same time....Byrne has a lot more time at 10 and minutes under his belt....

Fair enough. Part of the picture of their minutes at 10 is also their international caps as well tho; Byrne has 3 while Carbery has 22.

P.Walnuts

Shefwedfan wrote: »

First I am making an imaginary dig and now your having a little rant

Correcting one of your " facts" as garbage is not going on a rant.

Former Former

Shefwedfan wrote: »

First I am making an imaginary dig and now your having a little rant

Yes everyone is fully aware it was supposed to be PJ on the flight to Chicago. Do you not think Carbery suddenly getting on the plane was a surprise at the time? from my recollections (factually correct or not) was it was a huge surprise and a massive story in the news

Dude, you spend all day every day fighting people on this board. I won't indulge you.

You said that "it was on the back of Henry comments that Carbery suddenly jumped the queue and was on the plane to Chicago". In no sense is that accurate.

Done.

Shefwedfan

aloooof wrote: »

Fair enough. Part of the picture of their minutes at 10 is also their international caps as well tho; Byrne has 3 while Carbery has 22.

It's a pity since the Munster move Carbery hasn't had a full run at a season. He was playing great v Italy in warm up's.....

Byrne lack of caps as I might have mentioned before baffles me....but for whatever reason the Ireland management team dont rate him. I don't see that changing with Farrell in charge.

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

Dude, you spend all day every day fighting people on this board. I won't indulge you.

You said that "it was on the back of Henry comments that Carbery suddenly jumped the queue and was on the plane to Chicago". In no sense is that accurate.

Done.

Dude?

Google "Carbery picked out by Graham Henry", see what it throws up!!

Im not fighting with anyone, its a forum. Throwing a strop because you think someone had a dig at you is your problem, not mine

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

It's a pity since the Munster move Carbery hasn't had a full run at a season. He was playing great v Italy in warm up's.....

Byrne lack of caps as I might have mentioned before baffles me....but for whatever reason the Ireland management team dont rate him. I don't see that changing with Farrell in charge.

Interestingly, Carbery had very similar minutes to Byrne last season, even with injury. Carbery played 990 minutes for Munster. Ross Byrne player 1131 for Leinster. Add in their Ireland minutes and it's 1120 vs 1151. (I was surprised to see it so close tbh).

Their kicking stats for last season are quite different tho:

Serbian wrote: »

Objectively, Ross Byrne's place kicking is not top notch. It's acceptable. He kicked a pressure kick against Ulster last season which in fairness was good, but I'd consider his place kicking another area of weakness for him.

His success rate of 73% last season is the worst of all players who regularly take kicks at Irish provinces. For comparison Carbery kicked at 88% last season, Sexton at 85%, Bill Johnston at 85%, Carty at 80%, JJ Hanrahan 79%, and Cooney at 78%.

That stat doesn't account for difficulty of kick / angle etc tho, so I don't know how much can be read into it. (Byrne doesn't strike me as a particularly poor kicker at all tbh, but I was surprised this stat was so comparatively low).