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Trevor Deely case - new witness

tdf7187

There was a previous lengthy thread on the case but it was locked for review and has yet to be reopened.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/new-witness-backs-up-gardas-theory-that-deely-killed-in-row-with-gang-38755889.html

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tdf7187

smelly sock wrote: »

No. Not really. I just dont think it adds up to TD been missing for this long.

Well, I disagree. There are potential non-sinister explanations for his behaviour - for example, he could have been a taxi driver that was breaking the strike and knowing there were plenty of offices in the area & that it was Xmas party season, hung around the entrance to one hoping to get a fare there. But if the MIB is the same person that followed Trevor, then it's hard to see a non-sinister rationale.

tdf7187

smelly sock wrote: »

I find TDs behaviour more odd.

Over to my block list with you so.

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

But that's the thing about MIB - IMO he's totally and utterly inconsequential.
He's not some shifter as you call him

Both Trevor and his colleagues talk to him.
Trevor do not mention him to they guy he talked to in the office.
The colleagues talked to him but have nothing else to offer.
I'm sure the (now deceased) security guard was also asked about him but had nothing interesting to offer either.

you seem well read on the topic, waht do you think happened if you had to guess?

i can't believe you consider the MIB inconsequential

20Wheel

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

There is no central database for what you are looking for.

The effort involved in filtering out all the numbers that were in use during that time and investigating each and every one is mammoth.

Mammoth to who?... a human with a pencil? Yeah.
An industrial computer. Hardly

I doubt there was no database of calls made. (maybe an expert in telecoms can clarify).

I'd imagine that as appropriate charges must be made to all customers accouts, that its the telecoms companys very duty to record which account called which account and when for how long.
And then to update the account balances.

If not you'd call 171, press option 2 and get an automated voice going your account balance is... 'Hmm ehh, minus 4, carry the 5, ehh was it you that called 123456 a few seconds ago, shyte, hang on'.

And no, you're not going to get many phones connecting at both recorded times. The odds of calling at 1 given time in 24 hours are reasonably small, the odds of calling at 1 given time and then again at another precise time out of the 24 hours available must be pretty damn remote.
Even with all the phones out there you're going to end up with a small list.

Probably something like (1/[24*60] ) * (1/[24*60] ) if dealing with minutes. I don't know, get me Rachel Riley.

And a mathematician too.

Fiftyfilthy

I used the word shifter as anyone standing outside a building for 30 mins on a stormy morning with no clear explanation is shifty. Standing beside someone who then goes missing mins later is shifty

Thus a shifter

smelly sock

Fiftyfilthy wrote: »

I used the word shifter as anyone standing outside a building for 30 mins on a stormy morning with no clear explanation is shifty. Standing beside someone who then goes missing mins later is shifty

Thus a shifter

No explanation we know of.

Party goer
Friend of someone
Waiting for someone looking for shelter
Homeless guy

All the above is far more logical than a member of a criminal gang hanging around in the pissings if rain to rob some spare change off someone and then kill him. Transport and dispose of a body without a trace in a city centre.

Not buying that as in anyway credible.

smelly sock

tdf7187 wrote: »

Over to my block list with you so.

What??

tdf7187

smelly sock wrote: »

What??

Do you not understand you will get this thread locked if you carry on implying Trevor committed suicide when there is no actual evidence for that.

smelly sock

If i was shown cctv of myself from 17 year ago which was at best blurry and hard to make out i dont think i could make myself out. Especially in the pouring rain and dark.

Fiftyfilthy

smelly sock wrote: »

If i was shown cctv of myself from 17 year ago which was at best blurry and hard to make out i dont think i could make myself out. Especially in the pouring rain and dark.

Unless I frequented the gates of buildings at 3:30am in the pouring rain in the red light district all the time then I would have no trouble in recalling that night

Fiftyfilthy

smelly sock wrote: »

No explanation we know of.

Party goer
Friend of someone
Waiting for someone looking for shelter
Homeless guy

All the above is far more logical than a member of a criminal gang hanging around in the pissings if rain to rob some spare change off someone and then kill him. Transport and dispose of a body without a trace in a city centre.

Not buying that as in anyway credible.

I’ve never said that either, I don’t know what happened to him

I’d like all avenues explored. You have your suicide theory and therefore everything else is “incorrect” as it doesn’t fit in with what you think

20Wheel

smelly sock wrote: »

No explanation we know of.

Party goer
Friend of someone
Waiting for someone looking for shelter
Homeless guy

All the above is far more logical than a member of a criminal gang hanging around in the pissings if rain to rob some spare change off someone and then kill him. Transport and dispose of a body without a trace in a city centre.

Not buying that as in anyway credible.

Outside TDs workplace, and later following TD according to the times quote in reference to UK experts.

Your party goer seemingly followed a soon to be missing man over a good 600 meters. After coincidentally waiting outside the same man's workplace for half an hour.

In the rain. When there's surely multiple options for shelter locally.

And went round the corner to gawk through a fence for reasons that like totally are unrelated to TDs arrival.

[Deleted User]

I find the Trevor Deely case very interesting. I hope it gets solved at some point, if nothing else, just so the family can have some level of closure. Must be incredibly difficult having to live with this in your life all the time. I get annoyed at the unsolved/mystery aspect of this all the time, and I only see the case mentioned once in a blue moon, so I can imagine it's very tough on the family who are exposed to it constantly.

My own armchair-detective work leads me to believe that the man in black is the cause of Trevor's disappearance. If he was an innocent bystander, he would have come forward and ruled himself out by now. If you were a normal Joe Soap, you wouldn't let that hang over you for years if you didn't do anything wrong, and considering how widely publicised this is, there's no way would you be that Man in Black and not be aware that the Gardai were looking for you to come forward.

A related issue to not knowing who he is, is also the fact that, because we have no ID on the Man in Black, he himself could be dead long ago and people just don't know about it as we can't tie him to this case.

Personally, although I do believe he is involved in the disappearance of Trevor, I don't think he is part of a larger community of thieves, nor do I think he acted alongside others, or deliberately set out to cause this, as I reckon that would mean he would have had to have told other people what happened, and that's generally how people get caught out. You tell one person, they invariably tell another person, rumours spread, the Gardai show up and you're in the spotlight.

So my thinking is that he operated alone and possibly never intended for this to happen.

(Unless of course Trevor's death was particularly violent, and they cut him up to get rid of the body or something, and thus anyone else who may know about it, may also be so heavily involved that they couldn't mention it as they'd be hanging themselves, etc. but I still think you'd have a much higher risk of things coming out if there was more than one person involved, which leads me to think this was a single-person effort. Unfortunately that single person could have been so guilted that they hung themselves over it 15 years ago and we're just none the wiser.

Again.. armchair detective here, so take my post with the grain of salt it deserves.

LillySV

Omackeral wrote: »

I'd hate for you to be on a jury.

100% guilty just like that? No room for doubt? You could argue why hasn't he come forward but then chances of things could be considered like he's actually not even from Dublin/Ireland and lives abroad so this stuff doesn't make it to his knowledge. He himself could be dead.

Some people I know have never even heard of the Trevor Deely case. My mate is a serving memeber of the Gardai and didn't know about it when the renewed appeal happened a few years ago. You cannot make absolute assumptions.

Yes it's eerie and it's suspicious but it can't be known for sure what happened at all.

I’d love if he was on the jury... if u think that man hasn’t anything to do with trevors disappearance then your mad... he was clearly casing him , having Sussed him out earlier.... perhaps he thought td was a soft touch... or maybe td has said something to piss him off...

In regard to the falling into the river and prostitutes theories.... the man went in to talk to his friend in boi!! Not something a lad does while thinking of jumping into a river or getting a prostitute.... he had a coffee and picked up an umbrella../ he sounds like a man that was very much with it .... so using common sense....he is very likely to have been attacked and murdered.... probably killed by accident ... but a murder all the same

As regards your pal having the interest to be in the guards and not knowing about the td case.... he should be in another profession.... my dog probably knows about the case ffs.... featured regularly in press throughout the years

dubstarr

Fiftyfilthy wrote: »

Unless I frequented the gates of buildings at 3:30am in the pouring rain in the red light district all the time then I would have no trouble in recalling that night

That was exactly my point a few pages back.Its unusual enough to remember.2o years later you mightnt recall,but certainly the weeks after you would.

20Wheel

Deleted User wrote: »

My own armchair-detective work leads me to believe that the man in black is the cause of Trevor's disappearance.

So my thinking is that he operated alone and possibly never intended for this to happen.

He was.

But, if he acted alone, Where's the body?

The canal locks were closed.

cj maxx

20Wheel wrote: »

He was.

But, if he acted alone, Where's the body?

The canal locks were closed.

Was it ever searched properly,?

Coconut12

20Wheel wrote: »

He was.

But, if he acted alone, Where's the body?

The canal locks were closed.

I don’t think he acted alone because didn’t he take a call just before TD arrived to the bank. Plus how did he even know TD was heading that way and at that time he waited there ... in the videos online if the footage in slow motion it showed a car lights or indicator reflecting from the water just after TD went by in the last recording.

[Deleted User]

MyPeopleDrankTheSoup wrote: »

you seem well read on the topic, waht do you think happened if you had to guess?

i can't believe you consider the MIB inconsequential

I honestly think that Trevor went into the Dodder or Dublin Bay, by accident or by his own choice.

He was heading in the direction of Dublin Bay when last seen on CCTV and also he had to cross the Dodder to get home from the last last location he was seen at.

That and the fact that young men with drink taken end up in water far more often than they end up dead and buried somewhere as a result of some nefarious act.

If sad, no doubt about that, but in my opinion it's what happened to him.

And MIB is just someone that for some innocent reason has not come forward.

Coconut12

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I honestly think that Trevor went into the Dodder or Dublin Bay, by accident or by his own choice.

He was heading in the direction of Dublin Bay when last seen on CCTV and also he had to cross the Dodder to get home from the last last location he was seen at.

That and the fact that young men with drink taken end up in water far more often than they end up dead and buried somewhere as a result of some nefarious act.

If sad, no doubt about that, but in my opinion it's what happened to him.

And MIB is just someone that for some innocent reason has not come forward.

Well I think the dig at Chapelizod goes against that theory.

[Deleted User]

sugarman wrote: »

Theres strong evidence to suggest the opposite... I mean, if somebody was going to commit suicide by jumping into a river, the last thing they'd care about was to go out of their way to grab an umbrella to keep dry on the way! ...or to check their work emails / make notes for the next following day, or to call a friend back and leave a voicemails saying i'll see you tomorrow!

People who commit suicide don't always have some elaborate plan.
Many many people have gone about their normal day and then took their own life
Trevor's actions are no more an indication that he did not commit suicide than an indication that he did.

[Deleted User]

Coconut12 wrote: »

Well I think the dig at Chapelizod goes against that theory.

Yea on the face of it it does

But what if Trevor was just an excuse for the dig in Chapelizod.

They found a fire arm there, maybe it was a spot they were interested in for other reasons and some tenuous link to Trevor gave them reason to do it.

noodler

Coconut12 wrote: »

Well I think the dig at Chapelizod goes against that theory.

People say that but I don't see how.
Ultimately they didn't find anything.

Sure, they acted but they'd nothing else to go on.

Fiftyfilthy

20Wheel wrote: »

He was.

But, if he acted alone, Where's the body?

The canal locks were closed.

I’ve never mentioned this before as I can’t find any article over the years to back it up

I distinctly remember watching on the news that it was reported that the locks were open either on the mon or before the locks were searched

This is something I remember hearing as clear as day at the time

It must be misinformation that was in the news as I’ve never once read or heard this fact again

smelly sock

sugarman wrote: »

Indeed but why come forward with that information then? They didnt want the €100k reward and allegedly offered it up on the back of guilty conscious.

...and now the recent second witness that backs this up?

The Chapelizod dig could have been just a stab with the witness saying X done it and was known to use Y area back then.. but didnt know where for sure.

Maybe nobody actually came forward.

Coconut12

smelly sock wrote: »

Maybe nobody actually came forward.

Do you actually think the guards would devote all that time and resources and expense to a dig to find a gun or just on a whim. Hardly . They also said they had a credible witness. Granted they didn’t find anything but I wouldn’t dismiss the importance of it all !!

smelly sock

Coconut12 wrote: »

Do you actually think the guards would devote all that time and resources and expense to a dig to find a gun or just on a whim. Hardly . They also said they had a credible witness. Granted they didn’t find anything but I wouldn’t dismiss the importance of it all !!

The guards. Lie and be unethical. Never.

But yeh i agree. Its far fetched.

You'd assume the papers would have been able to find who this witness was.

MilitaryRoad

Hope I'm not going off topic here but I think there is another similar case of a male just disappearing without trace in more recent times which is the case of Jon Jonsson.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/new-photograph-of-missing-icelandic-man-released-by-garda%C3%AD-1.3853672

Not to be a conspiracy theorist about it but you'd have to wonder is there some sort of a group or something that could be behind a situation whereby people, men and women, have vanished over the years.

Looking at the footage of the CCTV in relation to Trevor Deeley, I've ended up with the opinion these these individuals lurking around his workplace in the middle of the night, were clearly out for someone but I don't think that they were specifically out to abduct or cause harm to TD.

It almost reminded me of one of these things that can happen in the US where you can basically go online and buy a "staged abduction".

[Deleted User]

LillySV wrote: »

I’d love if he was on the jury... if u think that man hasn’t anything to do with trevors disappearance then your mad... he was clearly casing him , having Sussed him out earlier.... perhaps he thought td was a soft touch... or maybe td has said something to piss him off...

Lots of "maybes" and "perhaps" there for someone backing a poster calling the unidentified person 100% guilty.

tara73

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/drugs-worth-80000-found-as-dig-for-missing-trevor-ends-36157560.html

apparently they found drugs worth 80.000 during the dig or is this also a hoax from the media, can't believe anything these days anymore I think...

everything around this case is so weird, it's mind-boggling...