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Trevor Deely case - new witness

tdf7187

There was a previous lengthy thread on the case but it was locked for review and has yet to be reopened.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/new-witness-backs-up-gardas-theory-that-deely-killed-in-row-with-gang-38755889.html

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20Wheel

As someone in the other thread said, there is... Or at least was.... one more angle to look at.
Phone calls. MIB takes at least two.

Even on a burner phone the appropriate credit must be charged.
So if your number makes a call at x time for x duration that must be recorded to calculate the price.

Which phones made a call at both ~3:00 and ~3:30. Line up the times with the CCTV. To find mibs phone number.

Can't have been many.

noodler

So this gang had spotters in buck whaleys at 2am.

Picked out TD somehow.

Phones ahead.

Spotters, cars etc.

Hang around in the rain for a full hour.

Have no idea if TD would come back out of the bank.

Didn't think to hit an easier target in the interim.

Oh, and btw, if you are wondering why they'd be so stupid as to get themselves on the gate CCTV..it's because they are on the gear (despite the elaborate premeditation described above).

20Wheel

noodler wrote: »

So this gang had spotters in buck whaleys at 2am.

Picked out TD somehow.

Phones ahead.

Spotters, cars etc.

Hang around in the rain for a full hour.

Have no idea if TD would come back out of the bank.

Didn't think to hit an easier target in the interim.

Oh, and btw, if you are wondering why they'd be so stupid as to get themselves on the gate CCTV..it's because they are on the gear (despite the elaborate premeditation described above).

Spotters, cars. Plural. Way to embellish what was said.

Pathetic.

completedit

Always and continues to scare me so much. I mean it's weird though, how it's the unknown that makes it so fascinating and eerie. I mean the end result is the same, Trevor was taken from his family and friends without an explanation but if he has just been found lifeless then wouldn't be as scary. Something about a young guy just vanishing on a cold Miserable December night it's so unsettling. Even stuff like the way there was a taxi strike seems unsettling for some reason. All conspired to his disappearance

Jeff2

There was a courier company van parked up on Mount Street at the bottom of Herbert Street around the dates.

For a few nights.

noodler

20Wheel wrote: »

Spotters, cars. Plural. Way to embellish what was said.

Pathetic.

You used the EXACT words spotter and car.

What on earth are you talking about?

Nice imagination anyway, the curious tale of the out of it junky gang who planned the logistics of muggings hours in advance.

Fiftyfilthy

Gangs drove up and down the red light area all the time as would deliver heroin to the working girls. Easy money. Usually 100e min bought from just one brazzer

20Wheel

noodler wrote: »

You used the EXACT words spotter and car.

What on earth are you talking about?

Nice imagination anyway, the curious tale of the out of it junky gang who planned the logistics of muggings hours in advance.

Bye. Don't waste my time.

KWAG2019

I’m not quite sure how but I came across an older thread from over 2 years ago about TD. Extraordinarily similar to this but even more detailed analyses of CCTV and lights and puddles. Some interesting themes: why Haddington Rd route, why not visible on CCTV at US or Israeli embassy, not visible on CCTV in Ballsbridge, water featured too with the canal largely dismissed but one poster who tragically lost a relative in the river (Dodder I assume) was told they were lucky as a crane operator spotted body at the port before it was swept out to sea. Thread seems to have got confused about CCTV images and thought they had a “breakthrough” looking at other employees.

In short, same questions and same range of answers. It’s a bit Groundhog Day.

Alliance123

20Wheel wrote: »

As someone in the other thread said, there is... Or at least was.... one more angle to look at.
Phone calls. MIB takes at least two.

Even on a burner phone the appropriate credit must be charged.
So if your number makes a call at x time for x duration that must be recorded to calculate the price.

Which phones made a call at both ~3:00 and ~3:30. Line up the times with the CCTV. To find mibs phone number.

Can't have been many.

Being following your posts. You talk amazingly good sense. Well done

Alliance123

Sad but absolutely no chance of an accident - water or car imo. Altercation following interaction. Man at gate has answers and 100% guilty. Unknown motive, which is kinda irrelevant at this stage. Best wishes to his mates & family

[Deleted User]

Jeff2 wrote: »

There was a courier company van parked up on Mount Street at the bottom of Herbert Street around the dates.

For a few nights.

Are you mentioning this on first hand knowledge or did you read it somewhere.

[Deleted User]

Alliance123 wrote: »

Sad but absolutely no chance of an accident - water or car imo. Altercation following interaction. Man at gate has answers and 100% guilty. Unknown motive, which is kinda irrelevant at this stage. Best wishes to his mates & family

I'd hate for you to be on a jury.

100% guilty just like that? No room for doubt? You could argue why hasn't he come forward but then chances of things could be considered like he's actually not even from Dublin/Ireland and lives abroad so this stuff doesn't make it to his knowledge. He himself could be dead.

Some people I know have never even heard of the Trevor Deely case. My mate is a serving memeber of the Gardai and didn't know about it when the renewed appeal happened a few years ago. You cannot make absolute assumptions.

Yes it's eerie and it's suspicious but it can't be known for sure what happened at all.

[Deleted User]

20Wheel wrote: »

As someone in the other thread said, there is... Or at least was.... one more angle to look at.
Phone calls. MIB takes at least two.

Even on a burner phone the appropriate credit must be charged.
So if your number makes a call at x time for x duration that must be recorded to calculate the price.

Which phones made a call at both ~3:00 and ~3:30. Line up the times with the CCTV. To find mibs phone number.

Can't have been many.

There could have been thousands.
It's December party season, there are loads of people on phones, people live and work in the area.

First you have to take the two networks Eircell and Esat Digifone.
Then you have to determine the range of their transmitters in the area, (some overlap)
Then you have to look at each and every call, both incoming and outgoing on those transmitters that fit the time period.
Then you have to chase up on each and every one of those numbers to eliminate people.

And what do you do with the ones you have left that are pay as you go, burner as you call them ?

Start cross referencing each and every one of them with other calls they made the same night/next day to find some sort of pattern ?

It's an adult missing persons case remember, not an criminal case.

dubstarr

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

And to hang around in the cold and wet in full view of CCTV as part of the plan ?

Hardly

Well full view or not,we dont know who the MIB is.

It just takes one person having a conscience,and come forward.And this could be solved.

The only reason MIB hasnt come forward is because hes the reason Trevor disappeared.

[Deleted User]

dubstarr wrote: »

Well full view or not,we dont know who the MIB is.

It just takes one person having a conscience,and come forward.And this could be solved.

The only reason MIB hasnt come forward is because hes the reason Trevor disappeared.

No, there many different reasons why MIB has never been identified.

1. He could be deceased.
2. He could be some one that takes no interest in the news, we all know people who don't watch the news or read the papers so he might be totally unaware of all this.
3. He may have seen the Trevor Deely missing posters in the city but makes no connection with Trevor being the guy he talked to.

How much media attention was there about looking for a man that talked to Trevor outside BOIAM during the early days of the case ?

4. He may have left the country for any one of hundreds of reasons.

dubstarr

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

No, there many different reasons why MIB has never been identified.

1. He could be deceased.
2. He could be some one that takes no interest in the news, we all know people who don't watch the news or read the papers so he might be totally unaware of all this.
3. He may have seen the Trevor Deely missing posters in the city but makes no connection with Trevor being the guy he talked to.

How much media attention was there about looking for a man that talked to Trevor outside BOIAM during the early days of the case ?

4. He may have left the country for any one of hundreds of reasons.

How likely is all your scenerios or how likely is mone.Statistically the last person to see someone alive is the person that doen the crime.

Plus how could you not realise the person you where talking to,in now missing.
And the amount of coverage the case got,you would have to be on Mars or under a rock.

Day Lewin

dubstarr wrote: »

How likely is all your scenerios or how likely is mone.Statistically the last person to see someone alive is the person that doen the crime.

Plus how could you not realise the person you where talking to,in now missing.
And the amount of coverage the case got,you would have to be on Mars or under a rock.

Nothing in life is certain: but yet, this is mostly true.

Cops always start an investigation like this with "Who saw him last?"

smelly sock

Day Lewin wrote: »

Nothing in life is certain: but yet, this is mostly true.

Cops always start an investigation like this with "Who saw him last?"

We have no idea who saw him last. Cctv is inconclusive.

Imo suicide is the most logical explanation with the body being lost at sea.

The premeditated gang thing is way off. There would be evidence of interaction if TD was involved with a gang.

tdf7187

I was aware of the case as I worked and socialised in the area and certainly remember all the posters and so on. I honestly don't remember if I was out that night, I don't know how anyone could remember what they were doing on specific night from 19 years ago unless they have a photographic memory or keep detailed diaries.

The MIB's movements and behaviour are suspicious, that's all we can say. The cops may have info they have not released to the public.

smelly sock

dubstarr wrote: »

Well full view or not,we dont know who the MIB is.

It just takes one person having a conscience,and come forward.And this could be solved.

The only reason MIB hasnt come forward is because hes the reason Trevor disappeared.

How do you know he is the reason?

tdf7187

smelly sock wrote: »

We have no idea who saw him last. Cctv is inconclusive.

Imo suicide is the most logical explanation with the body being lost at sea.

The premeditated gang thing is way off. There would be evidence of interaction if TD was involved with a gang.

IMO it is these kinds of speculations that probably upset the family and got the last thread closed. There is literally no evidence for suicide - none at all.

Fiftyfilthy

Hasn’t come forward as possibly dead. More would be dead than alive 20 years later if connected to the goings on in that area

[Deleted User]

dubstarr wrote: »

How likely is all your scenerios or how likely is mone.Statistically the last person to see someone alive is the person that doen the crime.

Plus how could you not realise the person you where talking to,in now missing.
And the amount of coverage the case got,you would have to be on Mars or under a rock.

How much coverage was there of "the last person to see Trevor was an yet to be identified man standing outside BOIAM" back in December 2000 ?

This guy may have no idea that the guy he talked to for a few seconds late that night is the same guy on the posters.

For every missing person poster you see or hear about do you look into the circumstances and go back over your memory to figure if you might have interacted with them ?

If the answer is no then put yourself in the shoes of MIB in December 2000.

dubstarr

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

How much coverage was there of "the last person to see Trevor was an yet to be identified man standing outside BOIAM" back in December 2000 ?

This guy may have no idea that the guy he talked to for a few seconds late that night is the same guy on the posters.

For every missing person poster you see or hear about do you look into the circumstances and go back over your memory to figure if you might have interacted with them ?

If the answer is no then put yourself in the shoes of MIB in December 2000.

If i was around the area the time they went missing.I would got to the guards,it just takes that small bit of information to crack it.

And about would you remember what you where doing 20 years ago.Now i wouldnt but i would have 20 years ago.

smelly sock

tdf7187 wrote: »

IMO it is these kinds of speculations that probably upset the family and got the last thread closed. There is literally no evidence for suicide - none at all.

There is no evidence for any outcome.

[Deleted User]

dubstarr wrote: »

If i was around the area the time they went missing.I would got to the guards,it just takes that small bit of information to crack it.

And about would you remember what you where doing 20 years ago.Now i wouldnt but i would have 20 years ago.

You see posters of Trevor around town in December 2000.

So you go to the Gardai with your information.

Let's say you go to them a week after Trevor went missing

Do you recall ever person you saw that night ?
Do you recall ever person you talked to that night ?
Do you recall who ever person you talked to was with that night ?

Trevor's colleagues talked to MIB, yet they have zero recollection of anything significant about him.

BDI

John_Rambo wrote: »

Every fit young healthy man? Speak for yourself BDI.

Nearly every. I’ve never been myself

smelly sock

tdf7187 wrote: »

IMO it is these kinds of speculations that probably upset the family and got the last thread closed. There is literally no evidence for suicide - none at all.

I think without being insensitive that the Deely family need to accept after 19 years people are going to speculate as to the outcome. Human nature and curiosity takes over here and theories are given. We could all just stop talking about it and forget it. That wouldn't be good either.

As another poster rightly said its the media who mentioned and chance altercation with a criminal gang involved with brazzers. Not us. We are merely debating that theory.

tdf7187

smelly sock wrote: »

I think without being insensitive that the Deely family need to accept after 19 years people are going to speculate as to the outcome. Human nature and curiosity takes over here and theories are given. We could all just stop talking about it and forget it. That wouldn't be good either.

As another poster rightly said its the media who mentioned and chance altercation with a criminal gang involved with brazzers. Not us. We are merely debating that theory.

Well I wouldn't disagree with you there. It's the media and police who are putting forward these theories, if the family object their grievance lies with the media and police not a few anonymous accounts on an internet board. Most posters have been respectful.