nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

Random EV thoughts.....

Old diesel

The main motors forum has the motors chat thread for the little things one would like to say but might not justify a thread.

Thought it might be an idea for here re hybrids and EV stuff.....

To kick off - i wonder if a new measurement for EVs might be assuming a start trip at 100 percent......

A how much range do you get with a 15 minute stop.

With a 350 kw charging a Porsche Tayman might do very well with getting on for 400 miles...

A Leaf 62 not so good.

Obviously where a car can do more then 50 kw charging we would need both a 50 kw and a whatever the cars top rate is figure*.

*IF chargers are available

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

redcup342

A Company in Dusseldorf is rolling these out in Germany to cover areas where rapid charging could be useful but a bit investment is needed.

https://www.uniper.energy/services/move-by-uniper

Would be handy in parts of Ireland where the Infrastructure isn't there or to cover extra demand while they build new charging stations.

September1

Water John wrote: »

A study in the UK out today, says it will need storage of 30GW which is 30% of peak demand when the system becomes carbon neutral. UK has 3GW at present.

Should be need for 2GW here, maybe a good bit more.

I think UK has nuclear power, which is carbon neutral and solves may problems with renewable sources.

Water John

A study in the UK out today, says it will need storage of 30GW which is 30% of peak demand when the system becomes carbon neutral. UK has 3GW at present.

Should be need for 2GW here, maybe a good bit more.

BTW as I suggested before, it says the cheapest electricity will be during day time, solar and wind combined, and biggest demand in the evening.

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

Interesting.

Also interesting is that we are at 1/3 renewable for MTD

Our yearly average for renewable is about 30% for a few years now.
They want to double that in the decade ahead!

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

A year or more ago coal was consistently at about 15%.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=111242744&postcount=319

Its now consistently <5% (at 3% for the last month) and had several months at 0% because the plant was offline for maintenance. Its close to being mothballed I'd say.

Officially its decommissioning date is 2025, I think.

Interesting.

Also interesting is that we are at 1/3 renewable for MTD

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

Really?
http://smartgriddashboard.eirgrid.com/#roi/generation suggests otherwise

A year or more ago coal was consistently at about 15%.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=111242744&postcount=319

Its now consistently <5% (at 3% for the last month) and had several months at 0% because the plant was offline for maintenance. Its close to being mothballed I'd say.

Officially its decommissioning date is 2025, I think.

ELM327

unkel wrote: »

Thankfully, Ireland pretty much stopped using coal for electricity generation nearly a year ago.

Really?
http://smartgriddashboard.eirgrid.com/#roi/generation suggests otherwise

MJohnston

unkel wrote: »

Thankfully, Ireland pretty much stopped using coal for electricity generation nearly a year ago.

What about Moneypoint?

unkel

ELM327 wrote: »

I think there must be some way to incorporate this - im not saying as a replacement for coal but to reduce reliance on coal.

Thankfully, Ireland pretty much stopped using coal for electricity generation nearly a year ago.

jprboy

Markcheese wrote: »

Pumped electric storage is great, an amazing asset ,but effectively it's a battery ...great for short peaks and troughs ..there's another one in some stage of development in an old mine (Midlands maybe), but it doesn't seem to be progressing very fast ..

Yep, proposed pumped hydro 360 MW in old mining site in Silvermines, Co. Tipp

https://silvermineshydro.ie/

Black_Knight

September1 wrote: »

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/planning-permission-granted-for-controversial-energy-plant-in-roscommon-935133.html

Picked the wrong county to implement something progressive.

Markcheese

Pumped electric storage is great, an amazing asset ,but effectively it's a battery ...great for short peaks and troughs ..there's another one in some stage of development in an old mine (Midlands maybe), but it doesn't seem to be progressing very fast ..

We're going to still need fossil fuels to back up wind ,batteries and interconnectors will reduce how much spinning reserve we need ... But to cover that dead calm,cold week in january that we get every few years it's going to need gas

September1

ELM327 wrote: »

I think there must be some way to incorporate this - im not saying as a replacement for coal but to reduce reliance on coal. Reduce peak needed by generating at night and using that throughout the day

There are multiple problems with balancing electrical network, you seem to be focusing on daily peaks which are not only problem. For example battery in Australia which is one of most known projects is not dealing with that issue, as it charges and discharges multiple times a day. It helps to stabilize network by smoothing quick changes in supply and demand that happen throughout a day, like wind breeze becoming weaker for few minutes. This means that they could buy cheaper electricity and then sell it with profit multiple times per day, however I'm pretty sure that economics is more complicated and they also get some fixed fees as there is value in being available - however for simplicity lets assume that they get multiple sales of electricity per day. I think such battery would be profitable in most places right now with current technology.

Then there is a problem you mention about daily balancing of production and supply, which I guess requires only one cycle and provides only with one sale of energy per day. This kind of storage could be close to being profitable with current technology, but it may also make more sense economically to manufacture batteries for cars and sell then with higher premium. This problem can also be helped with smart meters, commercial freezers, EV charging and couple other ways to balance things on demand side.

The biggest problem is long-term balancing, where renewable sources are off for many days, such battery would be rarely needed so it will be difficult to make it profitable but then it would have much higher capacity then in other cases as it would have to power country for weeks.

ELM327

September1 wrote: »

I think issue is that you would need to store energy for handle longer periods of no wind than single day, which I think is not something that can be economical with batteries for decades - as this kind of storage would be used handful times a year, and perhaps not at all on some years.

I think there must be some way to incorporate this - im not saying as a replacement for coal but to reduce reliance on coal. Reduce peak needed by generating at night and using that throughout the day

unkel

ELM327 wrote: »

I said it years ago, I don't know why we don't use storage to balance out demand.

We do (a bit), see Turlough hill

Battery storage is still far too expensive for commercial use here in Ireland when we can generate electricity so cheaply at night with wind

We should use a massive pump and release hydro system in the west of Ireland though, it's a great idea, but nobody seems willing to invest in it. We need a friendly dictator to rule the country for a bit to push it through, just like they did in China :pac:

September1

ELM327 wrote: »

Then, perhaps
But now, I reckon we're getting close to the point of viabilty
Especially on the green argument. Imagine being able to run the renewables 24/7 and having somewhere to store excess wind energy generated throughout the night!

I think issue is that you would need to store energy for handle longer periods of no wind than single day, which I think is not something that can be economical with batteries for decades - as this kind of storage would be used handful times a year, and perhaps not at all on some years.

ELM327

slave1 wrote: »

Economics, too expensive to install versus importing/exporting I'd have to imagine

Then, perhaps
But now, I reckon we're getting close to the point of viabilty
Especially on the green argument. Imagine being able to run the renewables 24/7 and having somewhere to store excess wind energy generated throughout the night!

slave1

ELM327 wrote: »

I said it years ago, I don't know why we don't use storage to balance out demand.

Economics, too expensive to install versus importing/exporting I'd have to imagine

September1

Water John wrote: »

Wonder what EirGrid would pay for such? Think there is planning for one in the midlands.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/planning-permission-granted-for-controversial-energy-plant-in-roscommon-935133.html

ELM327

Water John wrote: »

I would suspect such storage would initially be used to stabilise the network. To kick in at sudden demand to maintain the frequency near 50 Hz.
Wonder what EirGrid would pay for such? Think there is planning for one in the midlands.
The original one was the 100Mw Elon Musk built in Australia in 100 days. The network was blacking out.

I said it years ago, I don't know why we don't use storage to balance out demand.

Water John

I would suspect such storage would initially be used to stabilise the network. To kick in at sudden demand to maintain the frequency near 50 Hz.
Wonder what EirGrid would pay for such? Think there is planning for one in the midlands.
The original one was the 100Mw Elon Musk built in Australia in 100 days. The network was blacking out.

McGiver

unkel wrote:

Near where? They were deploying them in the USA during Thanksgiving afaik

Let's say this corner of Europe

unkel

Near where? They were deploying them in the USA during Thanksgiving afaik

McGiver

samih wrote:

Or a bank of battery storage charged at off peak to cater for the peak.

Is anything like that deployed anywhere near?

unkel

KCross wrote: »

alot more Tesla's hitting the streets over the last year.

Tesla Model 3 is now even the best selling car in Ireland

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

Yes and yes
Ionity is 8 quid flat fee
Tesla at 29c-33c per kWh is almost 3 times as much

I guess it depends on how much of a topup you need then. If you need anything more than 30kWh you would go to Ionity.

I also thought that that €8 flat charge from Ionity was mooted as an introductory thing and they were to change it. Any sign of that happening?

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

Dont they have to pay for Ionity too though?
Is Ionity cheaper than Tesla SC?

Yes and yes
Ionity is 8 quid flat fee
Tesla at 29c-33c per kWh is almost 3 times as much

KCross

redcup342 wrote: »

It's a bit stupid right now that the Ionity Chargers over here in Germany are full of Tesla Model 3s but the Tesla chargers are hardly used because they have to pay 33 cent / kwh when a person in a vehicle with a smaller battery would happily pay that if they didn't have to wait.

Dont they have to pay for Ionity too though?
Is Ionity cheaper than Tesla SC?

redcup342

unkel wrote: »

Obviously he shouldn't sell it at a loss.

I'd be happy to have the choice to charge my slow charging Ioniq at a CCS supercharger for whatever rate (per kWh and per minute) that Tesla makes a decent profit on me. Surely a win-win situation for all?

Of course if there are bottlenecks like Kettleman supercharger at Thanksgiving, Tesla owners will get priority, and lowly "third parties" like myself in my Ioniq (and other plebs in their Porsches, Mercedes, Jaguars and Audis) will have to wait until all Teslas are fully charged :pac:

But being serious, if Tesla have the capacity, why not sell at a profit?

Would make sense if Tesla just charged a Membership fee and a Guest / Roaming fee, then give "Lifetime Membership" with their Vehicles.

It's a bit stupid right now that the Ionity Chargers over here in Germany are full of Tesla Model 3s but the Tesla chargers are hardly used because they have to pay 33 cent / kwh when a person in a vehicle with a smaller battery would happily pay that if they didn't have to wait.

KCross

MJohnston wrote: »

But they're never going to pay for what has already been built...

If I remember correctly, the way it was being negotiated with some OEM's was that it would be $x per car that the OEM manufactures. What that x was we dont know, but that would seem like a reasonable approach.

So, the new OEM wouldnt be paying specifically or directly for past expenditure but would be paying a pro-rata amount for every car they want to give access to the Tesla SC network so they are in effect paying for past and future expenditure and maintenance of the network.

No, there's basically zero chance Tesla would have planned their supercharger network with any kind of expectation of financial assistance from other OEMs.

Largely agree with what you're saying there. I think their plan was to build it on their own dollar and make it part of their business model that doesnt require others to join, but if another OEM wants to capitalise on Tesla's asset then thats OK too.... show me the money!