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M7 - Naas/Newbridge Bypass Upgrade [Junction 9a now open]

JupiterKid

Following on from the suggestion of a poster, this thread has been set up to discuss the need for widening the M7.

The section of the M7 IMO in immediate need (really a backlog need) for widening is the section from the Maudlins Interchange at Naas to the M9 interchange - basically the original 1983 Naas Bypass and half of the 1993 Newbridge Bypass. Is this likely to proceed in the near future?

Would the central median be wide enough for widening to D3M here? I'm pretty sure it is wide enough on the Newbridge bypass section but I'm not so sure in the case of the Naas Bypass.

Also, what bridges will need to be demolished and rebuilt? Or would it be more practical to drop the hard shoulder through the existing bridges?

What about the proposal a few years back to build a new junction at on the Naas Bypass at Osberstown? Will it still go ahead?

In the longer term, does anyone see a need to widen the M7 to the N7/M8 junction?

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riddlinrussell

antietam1 wrote: »

Left Kildare retail outlet at 3.45 pm last Friday and drove to Red cow with no delays.
Was I just lucky? or early?

An inbound journey shortly before outbound rush hour?

You were both early and going against the tide.

Tomrota

riddlinrussell wrote: »

I've heard from JJ.Kavanagh drivers that the company is planning to roll out leap integration in the next year, They were also complaining about their timetabling (apparently this is set by TFI?) The Naas to Dublin bus is scheduled to arrive in Naas at 33 minutes past the hour, while the Bus Eireann arrives at 30 minutes past the hour...

Is completion of the Bypass still scheduled for March?

And yet the Bus Eireann is empty and the JJ is full because it costs about 400€ to get anywhere on that bus lmao.

That’s good that they’re gonna integrate with the LEAP. It seems to bizarre boarding a bus and paying with cash in 2019. It should be done away with on all routes. These buses take so long at bus stops sometimes.

antietam1

riddlinrussell wrote: »

An inbound journey shortly before outbound rush hour?

You were both early and going against the tide.

Reason I asked was I did not see a lot of traffic on the other side, so just early then.

riddlinrussell

Tomrota wrote: »

And yet the Bus Eireann is empty and the JJ is full because it costs about 400€ to get anywhere on that bus lmao.

That’s good that they’re gonna integrate with the LEAP. It seems to bizarre boarding a bus and paying with cash in 2019. It should be done away with on all routes. These buses take so long at bus stops sometimes.

I think the greater issue is if TFI are setting timetables they are essentially ending up with an hourly service running two buses instead of a half hourly service with the exact same resources.

Apparently the reason they hadn't done it yet was that the card readers are incredibly expensive.

MaceFace

Tomrota wrote: »

With no integration with LEAP caps and LEAP 90 discount, that is ineffective. Also JJ kavanagh charge ridiculously high fares (3€ from one side of Naas to the other, seriously? You can get from Bray to IKEA for 2.50€). Most people will have to get a second bus or train when they reach the city. So you’d have to pay for parking, pay the high fare, and then pay for another fare. Cheaper to drive.

In order for public transport to work it has to be considerably faster or considerably cheaper than driving, and in most effective circumstances both. The entire N7 corridor doesn’t have either of those benefits, and nobody will leave their cars until its provided by the government.

Put a 5€ toll on the N7 tomorrow and you’d see car numbers won’t drop because there are NO alternatives. People would just pay it. I despise people who suggest tolling the N7 and M50. It we had a public transport network like Amsterdam, actually, if we had one like ANY other EU capital, it would be fine to put a toll on the roads. But we don’t, and never will, because politicians don’t care about it.

There is a high capacity route along the N7 where you can get from Sallins/Naas to Heuston in under 30 mins. Regular commuters can avail of taxsavers tickets. For about €5 per workday, you have unlimited use of train and Dart, including parking in Sallins station.

I do question if you have experience in intercity/town commuting in the big European cities. It's great when you are in the city or most suburbs, but from towns 30kms or more away from a city?

Tomrota

MaceFace wrote: »

There is a high capacity route along the N7 where you can get from Sallins/Naas to Heuston in under 30 mins. Regular commuters can avail of taxsavers tickets. For about €5 per workday, you have unlimited use of train and Dart, including parking in Sallins station.

I do question if you have experience in intercity/town commuting in the big European cities. It's great when you are in the city or most suburbs, but from towns 30kms or more away from a city?

Have you ever used Sallins and seen the parking situation? Yup, that’s not a situation you should see in one of the wealthier European countries. And Sallins to Heuston? What use is that to someone who wants to go to Sandyford, Citywest, or basically anywhere outside the city centre? Even from Heuston you have to take a Luas to get anywhere. My complaint isn’t just about traffic on the N7, it’s the entire system. Imagine having all DART lines constructed, metro north, metro west, and so much more if the government actually ever gave a toss.

As for your other comment, I don’t see what your point is? Are you saying we should continue to sit on the N7 and further every single day and not even think about providing alternatives for where all there cars are magically coming from? If thousands of people are commuting from said place every single day, public transport should be provided. If the government want people to switch from cars to public transport, it has to be even more aggressive. Ever hear of supply induced demand?

Commuting is generally so much easier in many European countries, lots of which are much poorer than Ireland. Find me a commuter town in Europe that still uses diesel trains to get around the city. Let’s take a commute from a commuter town similar in size to Naas - Durango which is the same distance from the city centre of Bilbao as Naas is to Dublin. You can take a look for yourself how much more effective public transport is there, I’m not going to go into detail.

Sorry this is such a long post and kinda off topic but I don’t accept the premise that effective public transport isn’t possible for the city, it’s suburbs, and it’s commuter towns. They all work hand in hand together and if a comprehensive system is designed that makes EVERYONES commutes faster and easier, people will start to switch from their cars. If you blocked off the M1, N7, N4, N3, M11 one morning, you would see the M50 and Dublin’s roads clear and free of traffic. You see Dublin has one of the worst amounts of traffic in Europe according to the independent, and there’s a reason for that- it’s not because of the great job the government is doing.

I don’t get why some people are so against providing transport where 1000’s of car journeys are being made. I want everyone to have the option of using it, not just for easier accessibility, but for mental health and climate change among so many other reasons. In many countries, it is much quicker and cheaper to use transport. Can’t say the same for this country. We could be a model city for public transport, the Dublin-Area shouldn’t be that hard to get around it’s not that big. Can we not do better than Spain? Are we just so exceptional we should continue to do all our travelling in cars?

MaceFace

Tomrota wrote: »

Have you ever used Sallins ... (SNIP)What use is that to someone who wants to go to Sandyford, Citywest, or basically anywhere outside the city centre? (SNIP) travelling in cars?

Firstly, apols for snipping your post, but it was rather long and I was hoping you would bring up this point. A lot of the posts in this thread talk about having 4 tracks to Kildare or P&R around Naas or beyond, but the real problem for most people is exactly this - arriving in Heuston is fine if you work around there or maybe directly in the city center, but terrible if you work anywhere else as it means train, Luas/bus and Dart/bus/walk.
I've done Sallins to Blackrock for 4 years - walk, train, luas, dart, walk, every single day. I know how horrible it is and it simply does not work for parents.
So, building more capacity along the N7 won't help the majority of people because we need an extensive high speed, high frequency Dublin transport system. That is something completely different. Everyone wants it but no one wants to pay the price of suffer the disruption.
That HAS to be central to any solution and more capacity into Heuston is just fluff.

pad199207

Absolute disaster outbound tonight. Cars broken down blocking lanes, cars on fire too.

spacetweek

I’ve removed off topic posts about driver behaviour and stopping distances. Please keep this thread to construction updates. Next two events are opening of Junctions 9A and 10 in early Dec.

BuzzFish

http://www.kildare.ie/CountyCouncil/PressReleasesAdverts/TemporaryRoadWorksSpeedLimitOrderM9M7N7.html

Confirmed, back to 120 on the 9th as temporary restrictions will lift then 😀

Other than a Facebook post from local councillor still no official confirmation of J9a opening next friday published. Surely it will though.

"This Road Works Speed Limit Order will apply from Sunday, 1 December 2019 to Sunday, 8 December"

Stan27

Have to say going southbound has been a real success.

[Deleted User]

Stan27 wrote: »

Have to say going southbound has been a real success.

Except when there's crashes or cars on fire like last week when it was as bad as it ever was during the major works.

Even with the three lanes it's significantly worse driving south now compared to 5 years ago. What will it be like in 5 more?

[Deleted User]

Deleted User wrote: »

Even with the three lanes it's significantly worse driving south now compared to 5 years ago. What will it be like in 5 more?

If the expected recession hits hard it will be quiet and freeflowing.

thebiglad

Deleted User wrote: »

Even with the three lanes it's significantly worse driving south now compared to 5 years ago. What will it be like in 5 more?

Well what would it be like without the additonal lane capacity - at least they have done something...

Be well and win

M7 website is saying its 120 kph from Monday 9th

BuzzFish

BuzzFish wrote: »

http://www.kildare.ie/CountyCouncil/PressReleasesAdverts/TemporaryRoadWorksSpeedLimitOrderM9M7N7.html
Other than a Facebook post from local councillor still no official confirmation of J9a opening next friday published. Surely it will though.

I raised a signage error with the contractor and at the same time asked about J9a. They have stated in their reply:

"In relation to Junction 9a, please be advised this is not scheduled to open this weekend. This is scheduled to open with the rest of the Sallins Bypass in Spring 2020. I understand there are a number of facebook and other social media posts suggesting otherwise, however these posts are incorrect."

Its a complete farce that they not open this. The traffic coming out of Naas to the "bundle of sticks" is crazy at the moment. J9a will remove this immediately.

antietam1

Would l love to join the m7 at Allenwood Kildare, instead I turn left just before Allen and come on to the m7 at exit/entry 10.

harr

BuzzFish wrote: »

I raised a signage error with the contractor and at the same time asked about J9a. They have stated in their reply:

"In relation to Junction 9a, please be advised this is not scheduled to open this weekend. This is scheduled to open with the rest of the Sallins Bypass in Spring 2020. I understand there are a number of facebook and other social media posts suggesting otherwise, however these posts are incorrect."

Its a complete farce that they not open this. The traffic coming out of Naas to the "bundle of sticks" is crazy at the moment. J9a will remove this immediately.

Madness not to open this when it looks completely done or almost done ... traffic around the bundle of sticks last weekend was a nightmare and again today the traffic is all over the place on the two half done roundabout before bundle of sticks. A lot cars don’t know where they are going. Saw two minor accidents on that approach to Naas in the last 4 days.

Tomrota

BuzzFish wrote: »

I raised a signage error with the contractor and at the same time asked about J9a. They have stated in their reply:

"In relation to Junction 9a, please be advised this is not scheduled to open this weekend. This is scheduled to open with the rest of the Sallins Bypass in Spring 2020. I understand there are a number of facebook and other social media posts suggesting otherwise, however these posts are incorrect."

Its a complete farce that they not open this. The traffic coming out of Naas to the "bundle of sticks" is crazy at the moment. J9a will remove this immediately.

So in other words our quality of life has to suffer until March cause reasons unknown to anyone.

road_high

BuzzFish wrote: »

I raised a signage error with the contractor and at the same time asked about J9a. They have stated in their reply:

"In relation to Junction 9a, please be advised this is not scheduled to open this weekend. This is scheduled to open with the rest of the Sallins Bypass in Spring 2020. I understand there are a number of facebook and other social media posts suggesting otherwise, however these posts are incorrect."

Its a complete farce that they not open this. The traffic coming out of Naas to the "bundle of sticks" is crazy at the moment. J9a will remove this immediately.

And does anyone really think the Sallins bypass will open in Spring 2020? Not from anyhting I've seen or heard at least or going by the glacial pace they did the mainline M7 widening.

road_high

Tomrota wrote: »

So in other words our quality of life has to suffer until March cause reasons unknown to anyone.

Be nice if they would explain exactly why rather than stating it just won't open.

jmkennedyie

road_high wrote: »

And does anyone really think the Sallins bypass will open in Spring 2020? Not from anyhting I've seen or heard at least or going by the glacial pace they did the mainline M7 widening.

Me. Most earthworks complete. Looks like surfacing started Clane end. All structures ~in place. The land for roundabout at Clane obviously is no longer an issue. And the bypass route is not one of the busiest commuter arteries into Dublin that has to be kept open. I saw April mentioned previously but Spring includes May so some wiggle room there for any Beasts from wherever.

There is a very significant Irish Water pipeline/treatment project Clane > Sallins > Osberstown just kicked off so that's going to add some complication/confusion. Looks like good coordination though so far - seems IW contractors have already laid pipes under the new bypass alignment by Lidl into Sallins.

Dissappointing if they don't open 9A this weekend. Lot's of mainline snagging completed recently and even the J9A trees have been planted in the last week or so.

road_high

Wonder if locals could contact local Kildare TDs and see what’s going on ?

emfifty

BuzzFish wrote: »

I raised a signage error with the contractor and at the same time asked about J9a. They have stated in their reply:

"In relation to Junction 9a, please be advised this is not scheduled to open this weekend. This is scheduled to open with the rest of the Sallins Bypass in Spring 2020. I understand there are a number of facebook and other social media posts suggesting otherwise, however these posts are incorrect."

Its a complete farce that they not open this. The traffic coming out of Naas to the "bundle of sticks" is crazy at the moment. J9a will remove this immediately.

What was the signage error you highlighted as I've sent in an email with a few snags myself?

emfifty

road_high wrote: »

Wonder if locals could contact local Kildare TDs and see what’s going on ?

So, as I understand it, Exit 9a will NOT open before Christmas but rather in Spring of 2020. This is the Siac/Colas position.
KCC road planners are in regular contact with the contractor and will meet later this week to get an update. Councillors are putting pressure on to have it open soon. So it's a battle of wills and like all things these days, the interchange will only open if it's safe to do so and not cause confusion re. motorists looking for the new Sallins exit vs the old one which has now been replaced with 'Johnstown' at exit 9.
It's not to say it can't be done with some proper 'temporary' signage and consistent temporary patching of destinations where required for a few months in order to get it open.

BuzzFish

emfifty wrote: »

What was the signage error you highlighted as I've sent in an email with a few snags myself?

Incorrect sign approaching millennium park roundabout from the Kerry Group side. Shows a slip left that was not constructed. Apparently it was in the original plans but not final ones, hence the confusion. New one ordered.

emfifty

BuzzFish wrote: »

Incorrect sign approaching millennium park roundabout from the Kerry Group side. Shows a slip left that was not constructed. Apparently it was in the original plans but not final ones, hence the confusion. New one ordered.

Good one. Missed that!
Though, the land space exists for free flow lanes to and from Mpark r/a so once the business park develops out fully as intended, the steam rollers will be back for the obvious modifications!

Darc19

M7 over pass at jct 10 closed overnight on Thursday.

I presume this is to finish off the roundabouts for full use.

This should take a lot of pressure off the bundle of sticks roundabout

Darc19

road_high wrote: »

And does anyone really think the Sallins bypass will open in Spring 2020? Not from anyhting I've seen or heard at least or going by the glacial pace they did the mainline M7 widening.

The M7 has been completed on time. Any official documents say end of 2019 for completion of mainline and spring 2020 for Sallins bypass.

The bypass doesn't have the health and safety aspects of a very busy road meters from the works.

antietam1

Darc19 wrote: »

M7 over pass at jct 10 closed overnight on Thursday.

I presume this is to finish off the roundabouts for full use.

This should take a lot of pressure off the bundle of sticks roundabout

Think the turn for Dublin was closed few weeks ago.