nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

Greta and the aristocrat sail the high seas to save the planet.

Jimmy Garlic

Climate saint Greta Trunburg is settling sail for UN climate talks in New York to demand that governments socially engineer and tax the little people into oblivion to save the planet. Accompanied by her film maker father who lives vicariously through her, a filthy rich aristocrat from Monaco and some German bloke the trip will no doubt vastly increase the wattage of her halo before she lectures us all about impending climate Armageddon in New York. Hopefully snaps from the trip will make it into Hello! Magazine.

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

thelawman

It appears Greta has gone the wrong way!

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/greta-thunberg-appeals-for-help-after-travelling-the-wrong-way-11851305

PostWoke

The_Conductor wrote: »

Idealism is all well and good- however, it has a cost associated with it

Would you say this cost is more or less than complete environmental collapse?

The_Conductor wrote: »

Gretta is selling a message in irrefutable, easily digestible chunks, that appeals to the masses.

Ah shure aren't you smarter than everyone else just like your mammy always said.

weldoninhio

Dickerty wrote: »

Except she won't be, she'll go even further.

What exactly is your issue with her? All she does in this clip is repeat predictions he said or statements he made so he can confirm. Or do you not like that a liberal is making Big Oil look bad? Like they need the help...

She will be out on her arse. Her constituents have cottoned on that she doesn't give a rats about them and wants to push her own national profile. She won't be re-elected.

KyussB

Have you looked at rents and property prices lately? Everyone is already paying a massively inflated cost of living - and it's entirely down to economic/political manipulation, to exploit the population - nothing to do with material concerns like climate change.

Policies like the Green New Deal work to eliminate those exploitative rent-seeking costs placed upon society - and provide decent well paid work for anyone who wants it, working to implement policies/projects fighting climate change, while at it - that means maintaining a good standard of living for everyone, and making it way more affordable - especially compared to the exploitative present.

If enough government resources worldwide were put into the right R&D programs and infrastructure projects, I think there is a fair chance of achieving a Closed Carbon Cycle economy relatively quickly, while maintaiing/expanding current standards of living - there is a lot of low-hanging-fruit out there, in terms of technology for renewable energy generation and storage (without overreliance on rare earths), and carbon sequestration combined with reproducing it as usable fuel again.

We pretty much are barely doing anything, right now. The difference between what the private sector is doing now, compared to what governments worldwide could be doing with exponentially greater ability to command resources, is enormous.

The_Conductor

Dickerty wrote: »

Except she won't be, she'll go even further.

What exactly is your issue with her? All she does in this clip is repeat predictions he said or statements he made so he can confirm. Or do you not like that a liberal is making Big Oil look bad? Like they need the help...

She appeals to a particular constituency- in the same manner that Gretta does (albeit, Gretta has a broader appeal- but it encapsulates the same cohort).

The bigger issue is a complete and utter disillusionment with the current global leadership- and out of this disillusionment, a grasping for someone, anyone, who is willing to stand up, to put themselves on a pedestal, and who seems to represent the ideals that most people aspire towards (despite the simple fact that they may not be willing to put their hands where their mouths are).

Idealism is all well and good- however, it has a cost associated with it- and the failure to acknowledge that there is a cost and it must be bourne both by individuals and corporate bodies- tarnishes the feel good message that people are so happy to buy into.

Gretta is selling a message in irrefutable, easily digestible chunks, that appeals to the masses. She is very conveniently selling this message in a black and white manner- with little acknowledgement that the world isn't black and white- its a series of compromises, and its this complete lack of acknowledgement of this basis tenet of life, how by choosing A we give up on choosing B, or accept that B is vastly more expensive than had we not chosen A- is unfortunately selling snake oil to the masses.

The fact that we are causing untold damage to the environment, to our health- and to the future well being of the planet- is irrefutable. Its a very easy message to sell- because you'd want to be a complete conartist to try and deny it. The difficult bit is drilling down into the implications and costs of how to remediate the damage we are causing. A complete lack of looking at the bigger picture- is simply irresponsible- and indeed- focusing on the little things- while noble, is also naïve.

If Gretta's message does not bear fruit- and there is no indication that it will, as most people are only too happy to pay platitudes to her message, but not cold hard cash, the reason it will fail- is precisely because its naïve and not thought out properly.

The entire global political system is based on playing off one constituency against another- alongside a healthy dose of self preservation for politicians whenever any one constituency risks the game of consensus, and it is only a game.

Nothing short of a seachange- a global seachange, will bear fruit- and it will involve some foul medicine for the masses that they are not being prepared for.

Will people still be willing to protest when there is an actual cost spelled out to them?

Dickerty

weldoninhio wrote: »

I can't take anything AOC says seriously. Roll on the next election when she is out on her ass.

Except she won't be, she'll go even further.

What exactly is your issue with her? All she does in this clip is repeat predictions he said or statements he made so he can confirm. Or do you not like that a liberal is making Big Oil look bad? Like they need the help...

KyussB

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Buy your own subscription to the Koch information network. :rolleyes:

You can also get information from the Irish Climate Science Forum.

Well the ICSF would be a good recommendation then - seeing as the institution was inaugerated by hosting the Koch-funded Cato linked climate denier, Richard Lindzen.

Do you view funding by the Koch's as discreditable in any way?

Professor Moriarty

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Are you implying that Paddy is not credible?

No. I'm stating that you are unable to make a credible argument.

Tell me how

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Are you implying that Paddy is not credible?

Are you suggesting Paddy is the source, or is it those he is interviewing?

Firing up a 1 Hr 44 minute video and suggesting people review before questioning the participants is nonsensical.

Pa ElGrande

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

No, I'm not watching a youtube video. Please set out your argument in your own words and feel free to quote any credible sources.

Are you implying that Paddy is not credible?

Professor Moriarty

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

I doubt you interested in their papers you might like to get some more background on them and an introduction to their work in a recent interview with them on Paddy Holohan's No Shame Podcast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ94yX0BC2g

No, I'm not watching a youtube video. Please set out your argument in your own words and feel free to quote any credible sources.

Pa ElGrande

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

I'm not sure what your point is? Who are those people? Why are you linking to them? What have they said that you find important?

I doubt you interested in their papers you might like to get some more background on them and an introduction to their work in a recent interview with them on Paddy Holohan's No Shame Podcast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ94yX0BC2g

Professor Moriarty

jimgoose wrote: »

Not exactly relevant to "climate change science"? The man is an engineer, FFS - a real one!

Yeah. And one of the "Connellys" is a teacher. A real teacher!

Professor Moriarty

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Why not? There is no such thing as a climate science degree, the subject touches on almost every discipline of science, which is most useful for getting grants to support your work.

Have you met the Connellys yet? They have a few papers on the subject if you would like to take the time to read and critique them. Greta says we should listen to the scientists.

I'm not sure what your point is? Who are those people? Why are you linking to them? What have they said that you find important?

jimgoose

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

So he has a degree in electrical engineering. Not exactly relevant to climate change science. What about the other people he talks about? "Irish scientists, engineers and other professions". Who are they?

Not exactly relevant to "climate change science"? The man is an engineer, FFS - a real one!

Pa ElGrande

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

So he has a degree in electrical engineering. Not exactly relevant to climate change science. What about the other people he talks about? "Irish scientists, engineers and other professions". Who are they?

Why not? There is no such thing as a climate science degree, the subject touches on almost every discipline of science, which is most useful for getting grants to support your work.

Have you met the Connellys yet? They have a few papers on the subject if you would like to take the time to read and critique them. Greta says we should listen to the scientists.

Professor Moriarty

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Look up his employment history - Cement Roadstone Holdings. Why would that matter you ask? But so what - well those carbon credits hit the bottom line and work their way into the cost of your new house or pavement outside your house.

So he has a degree in electrical engineering. Not exactly relevant to climate change science. What about the other people he talks about? "Irish scientists, engineers and other professions". Who are they?

Pa ElGrande

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

That website is very short on information. Who is Jim O'Brien? What are his qualifications apart from being a self-employed PR consultant. Who are the other people involved in ICSF?

Look up his employment history - Cement Roadstone Holdings. Why would that matter you ask? But so what - well those carbon credits hit the bottom line and work their way into the cost of your new house or pavement outside your house.

Pa ElGrande

blueshade wrote: »

I find Greta's parents a bizarre pair. They seem to take no responsibility for their children's problems, they seem to have a kind of weird mix of detachment from their illnesses on the one hand and on the other hand seem happy to exploit their children for financial gain. The kids have had their personal data sold in their mother's book, which now has Greta's photo on the cover, well...Greata is going to sell more copies than her mother. She claims that when Greta was 9 or so she decided to become vegan and declared that the family weren't going to fly anymore because of her fears about the environment. What parent allows than nonsense and feeds their child's paranoia? The parents are awful, they've exploited Greta and now they're doing the same with their other daughter. The parents are hoping to launch their other daughters singing career off the back of Greta's fame.

Dunno. They area show business couple who have to pay the bills like the rest of us and that life means travelling between venues and having to drag the children along with you. Someone with Gretas condition does benefit from having a stable and defined environment and unfortunately the mother appears to have neglected her daughters at a time in their lives when they could have done with her support. Obviously with hindsight the Aspergers diagnosis could have been made earlier and to be fair its not the parents fault most parents will not know about the condition and how to deal with it. The interesting consequence is that Greta managed to bind her mother to the kitchen and prevent her flying away and that's not a bad outcome from Gretas or her sisters point of view being able to command their mothers attention.

Professor Moriarty

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Buy your own subscription to the Koch information network. :rolleyes:

You can also get information from the Irish Climate Science Forum.

That website is very short on information. Who is Jim O'Brien? What are his qualifications apart from being a self-employed PR consultant. Who are the other people involved in ICSF?

Pa ElGrande

KyussB wrote: »

. . .
Again: Where, exactly, did you come across that? Was it linked from a site you read? (which?) Linked in a news feed or mailing list? Did you Google it out, yourself?
. . .

Buy your own subscription to the Koch information network. :rolleyes:

You can also get information from the Irish Climate Science Forum.

blueshade

I find Greta's parents a bizarre pair. They seem to take no responsibility for their children's problems, they seem to have a kind of weird mix of detachment from their illnesses on the one hand and on the other hand seem happy to exploit their children for financial gain. The kids have had their personal data sold in their mother's book, which now has Greta's photo on the cover, well...Greata is going to sell more copies than her mother. She claims that when Greta was 9 or so she decided to become vegan and declared that the family weren't going to fly anymore because of her fears about the environment. What parent allows than nonsense and feeds their child's paranoia? The parents are awful, they've exploited Greta and now they're doing the same with their other daughter. The parents are hoping to launch their other daughters singing career off the back of Greta's fame.

gozunda

KyussB wrote: »

The same Ulrike Stockmann who runs a Libertarian think tank which regularly works alongside Koch funded think tanks like Cato - writing in a publication known for denialism regarding the leading human role in tipping climate change - right...

Again: Where, exactly, did you come across that? Was it linked from a site you read? (which?) Linked in a news feed or mailing list? Did you Google it out, yourself?

Mikael Jalving is just an xenophobic hack, who has it in for Muslim's - no surprise that everyone you cite is far to the right, most often economically when not politically.

Oh ffs not again ...

KyussB

The same Ulrike Stockmann who runs a Libertarian think tank which regularly works alongside Koch funded think tanks like Cato - writing in a publication known for denialism regarding the leading human role in tipping climate change - right...

Again: Where, exactly, did you come across that? Was it linked from a site you read? (which?) Linked in a news feed or mailing list? Did you Google it out, yourself?

Mikael Jalving is just an xenophobic hack, who has it in for Muslim's - no surprise that everyone you cite is far to the right, most often economically when not politically.

Pa ElGrande

mzungu wrote: »

The above creates a narrative around the girl that is based off hearsay and a few random opinions taken from various hatchet job pieces. That does not make it true.

The reviews of the mothers book by independent commentators in different countries seem to reach much the same ends and one that is not favourable to the parents rather than deal with their problems they have externalised them.

According to Mikael Jalving, the book is a story of "poor" Greta Thunberg.

The book is presented as a 'climate book', but in addition to missing data and scientific information about the climate, Mikael Jalving believes it is a book about a family in disintegration.

»The book contains a story of failure. On the surface, the book is about a sick society where we are drowning in pollution and materialism, lies and deception. But the mother, who is also the author, is blind to the illnesses of her daughters, ”says Mikael Jalving.

google translate. (original in Danish)

Pa ElGrande

The Thunberg-Ernmans: An infinitely sad family story (original article in German)

Malena Ernman is a successful opera singer, member of the Royal Swedish Academy, and has represented Sweden at the 2009 Eurovision Song Contest. Her husband Svante Thunberg is an actor, and after the birth of their daughter Greta (2003) and Beata (2005) he stayed with the children, while Ernman pursued her career. Her engagements took her to Berlin, Paris, Vienna, Amsterdam or Barcelona. Every few months a new city, the family accompanied her: „Our everyday life was incomparable, our everyday life was just wonderful,“ writes Ernman.

But Greta is in fifth grade and suddenly she is not feeling well anymore. She refuses to eat, cries all day and is depressed. Irritatingly, this change is abruptly presented to the reader in just one paragraph, as if it were a consistent development. Instead, you’d like to ask if everything went so well by then. On the other hand, Malena Ernman’s farewell to the opera is less closely described because she now decides to take a shorter career. On November 2, 2014 she gives her last opera performance in Sweden; This evening is described on at least five pages - including a theatrical fainting spell by Ernman. Typical opera diva? In the following, when she explains the collapse of her two children, she maintains this peculiar tone, vacillating between stage drama and a strange serenity.

google translate

The article is written by Ulrike Stockmann and is based on Greta Thunberg’s mother, Malena Ernman book "Scenes from the Heart", which describes Greta’s past life and her path to becoming an environmental activist but that's only a superficial story when it come to this family's drama. One point Stockmann picks up on is parental neglect and how the mother deflects from this.

"Burnt-out humans on a burned-out planet"

In general, she does not seem to be aware of the essentials of not wanting to get to the heart of her problems. She describes herself as a social phobist, who barely survives a premiere party and after appearances in Stockholm flees the theater „even in front of the spectators“ and wears her clothes on a bicycle. But that makes them „immensely effective“. This permanent beauty of things that are not beautiful, but stressful, Ernman stands in the recognition of their own person, but also the nature of their children in the way. On the one hand, she fights against the fact that others stamp their daughters for their diagnoses. On the other hand, she stylizes these handicaps in the next moment to „super powers“. Not once in the book does she question herself or her husband as a parent. Blame are always the others - the school, the society, the health system. Or climate change.

„Because we were ****ty. I was ****ty. Svante was ****ty. The kids were ****ty. The planet was ****ty. Even the dog was ****ty ", it goes on. A projection of your own misfortune on the whole globe. The perfect excuse so that Malena Ernman does not have to face any in-house causative research for her misery.

URL="https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.achgut.com%2Fartikel%2Fdie_thunberg_ernmans_eine_unendlich_traurige_familiengeschichte"]google translate[/URL

At the end she reaches a similar conclusion to yesterdays post that climate change gives Malena Ernman and her family the opportunity to ignore their own internal problems and externalise it, the rationale being the planet is sick therefore the Thunbergs are sick.

KyussB

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

Here is an interesting idea put forward by E. Michael Jones in the above interview with the Swedish based Red ICE TV, that Gretas obsession with climate is the neutral ground that bonds the Thunberg family. He posits that Greta went through puberty at the time her mothers fame has reached its zenith, confused and having no attention from her mother she starts to starve herself which causes a crisis in the family and ultimately brings the mothers career to a halt, both sisters manifest much the same behaviour which ultimately ties the mother to the kitchen to cook their food in a certain way and prevents her from flying away. He also spins it in the context of Swedens social programs like the Million Program, sex education, feminism and disestablishment of the Lutheran Church and further posits the idea that the climate doom cult is a substitute for God, because if there is no God, there is only man and if climate change is natural, then man does not control it and we are doomed.

Where the fuck do you find these people? Here is a choice quote from that guy, blaming the Jews for the holocaust:

Messianic politics has been a recipe for disaster… and the Nazi attempt to exterminate the Jews was a reaction to Jewish Messianism (in the form of Bolshevism) every bit as much as the Chmielnicki pogroms flowed from the excesses of the Jewish tax farmers in the Ukraine.

mzungu

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

There have been several instances of that behaviour observed from her. She is the daughter of an actor and her mother is also in show business so she has training and support from her parents to handle public exposure. She also has a cameraman, journalists accompany her and a public relations team organise her itinerary. She is not a random girl who went on strike, she was picked for the role by her parents and Ingmar Rentzhog months in advance. The review of the mothers book by a Danish journalist who can understand the language is telling about the conditions she grew up in and why "climate change" has become an obsession for her. I have linked to it some time back.

Bottom line there is nothing about Greta campaign that is spontaneous, the people behind her like "Fridays for future" have been developing this since 2015 and have used several young girls over the years, none took off until Greta. Greta may be an innocent in all this, but the people in the backroom are mercenaries.

The above creates a narrative around the girl that is based off hearsay and a few random opinions taken from various hatchet job pieces. That does not make it true.

You mention above about spontaneity, I don't think anybody would claim that it was spontaneous. Climate issues have been in and out of the news for nearly four decades or more at this point and recent weather patterns have moved it front and centre the past few years. I think the momentum that has been gathered elsewhere is what is behind her popularity. There is no perfect recipe for making a globally recognised activist, if there was, everybody would be doing it. As always, being in the right place at the right time and having oodles of luck are usually how these things work.

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

imagine anyone doing that! my gawd!

Listen to the scientists.

[Deleted User]

Tell me how wrote: »

No. It isn't interesting.
It is an attempt by someone to shoehorn a current affairs topic in to some sort of story which reflects their 'unique' views.
It suggests occurrences of which there is no evidence for outside of conjecture.
It would be classed as fake news only it isn't news.

imagine anyone doing that! my gawd!