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The future of RTE Radio 1 LW

The Cush

Announced this morning - http://www.rte.ie/about/en/press-office/press-releases/2014/0923/645685-rte-radio-1-moves-from-longwave-transmission/

http://www.rte.ie/radio1/static/2014/0821/638554-stay-tuned/
http://static.rasset.ie/documents/radio1/rte-radio-1-staytuned.pdf

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TAFKAlawhec

FSO_Polonez wrote: »

Even in North America AM is on the decline. In Canada, radio stations are, in their words, "flipping" from AM to FM on an almost weekly basis. The only place in a 1st world country where AM makes sense anymore is the likes of Australia, which is so vast that tens of thousands of FM transmitters would not be viable, as opposed to AM where only a handful of transmitters can cover huge distances. Added to that, Australia is, after all, located in a very remote part of the world to the extent that interference from foreign stations is not really an issue, even at night.

Even in Australia, MW/AM is in general decline. While the ABC local stations and some of the metropolitan commercial talk stations still score well with listener ratings, it is otherwise a largely forgotten band compared to FM. Several of the "heritage" stations in regional & rural Australia already have or are planning to switch to FM, only a very few such stations like 2WEB in Bourke, NSW (585 KHz) and 4KZ in Innisfail, QLD (531 KHz) continue to emphasise their MW presence as they otherwise serve quite large geographical areas based in small (often remote) towns. But these are the exceptions. Otherwise most MW stations these days in Australia except those mentioned above largely consist of horse racing info by the local TAB, sports programming, specialist non-English language broadcasting, radio reading for the blind and one or two "gold" music stations - but outside the state capitals those gold stations are heavily networked with a local breakfast show only.

Mickey Mike

Since LW 252 returned I noticed a signal improvement, is this true or only my imagination. AM is definitely on the decline, the future of radio is FM and nothing else.

Johnboy1951

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

"We had a massive power cut that lasted 2 hours" Terry Prone on Newstalk Fri 25 Oct. Awwww the poor thing. Hope she never has to live in the real world.

I wonder what 'massive' means in this context?
The whole country?; the whole city?; half the city?; a big section of the city?; their building?; her studio?

I had not heard of any massive power cut that was newsworthy.

.... or maybe she could not charge her iPad .....

Gerry Wicklow

"We had a massive power cut that lasted 2 hours" Terry Prone on Newstalk Fri 25 Oct. Awwww the poor thing. Hope she never has to live in the real world.

[Deleted User]

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

The internet may not go down but local access to it is very vulnerable, especially in rural Ireland. My mobile coverage goes at the first hint of wind. If a tree took out my landline... goodbye internet.

The internet is a web of connections but the companies that host them can and do go down, we only have to look at the recent outage of internet radios , the service that internet radios connected to to list the stations rather than inputting the ip address and port manually, imagine how long that would take ? but it caused a lot of problems world wide , this is why I say we shouldn't have all our eggs in the cloud, our our heads............

This service is a bit like DNS, DNS is by the way now in control of the UN since Obama decided to give them control the idiot and absolute clown of a man.

Basically DNS is what they call the keys to the internet and those who control DNS control the internet which is partly true, without DNS you have to type the IP address of every site manually and port.

Anyway, too much of our lives, services etc all going to the cloud and it's a disaster waiting to happen and because many people here believe the internet and all that makes it work is indestructible and can never fail has created a system where even thinking about a backup plan seems unnecessary and inconceivable.

[Deleted User]

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

I often wondered why they don't put apartments or greenhouses at data centres. Use all that waste hot air. Then again, I suggested the same for the Dáil and no one took up the idea

It would be difficult to harness the waste heat.

Sam Russell

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

I often wondered why they don't put apartments or greenhouses at data centres. Use all that waste hot air. Then again, I suggested the same for the Dáil and no one took up the idea

The trouble with the Dail is that they blow hot and cold alternately. It would be so unreliable.

Gerry Wicklow

Deleted User wrote: »

Cramped, on the contrary, the size of Data Centres and their power consumption is mind boggling, particularly the power consumption, all this talk about closing AM stations to save power, it just makes me laugh, Data Centres are exploding and they consume many, many MW's more power than even the strongest AM station , granted the number of services provided is vastly greater and we are only at the early stages, already there is vastly more than most people are aware controlled by data centres and the list is rapidly growing, some day will come when everything is controlled in some form in some data centre.

I often wondered why they don't put apartments or greenhouses at data centres. Use all that waste hot air. Then again, I suggested the same for the Dáil and no one took up the idea

Gerry Wicklow

The internet may not go down but local access to it is very vulnerable, especially in rural Ireland. My mobile coverage goes at the first hint of wind. If a tree took out my landline... goodbye internet.

[Deleted User]

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

That brings up an image of Mad_Lad beavering away inside some server, inside a server farm, located somewhere remote and cold.

Do you find it crampred in there?

Cramped, on the contrary, the size of Data Centres and their power consumption is mind boggling, particularly the power consumption, all this talk about closing AM stations to save power, it just makes me laugh, Data Centres are exploding and they consume many, many MW's more power than even the strongest AM station , granted the number of services provided is vastly greater and we are only at the early stages, already there is vastly more than most people are aware controlled by data centres and the list is rapidly growing, some day will come when everything is controlled in some form in some data centre.

Johnboy1951

The internet can't go into chaos ? really ? well, I work in the cloud and I can't even begin to tell People how fragile it is

That brings up an image of Mad_Lad beavering away inside some server, inside a server farm, located somewhere remote and cold.

Do you find it crampred in there?

[Deleted User]

Indeed lets put everything on the internet and we'll see how that pans out in the event of a internet outage, or some kind of natural disaster. Or there's no electricity and the cell network goes down which can happen in the country.

The internet can't go into chaos ? really ? well, I work in the cloud and I can't even begin to tell People how fragile it is and that's not even the "internet" but the cloud but there's more and more reliance and dependence on the cloud and we're in the very early stages of the cloud.

Don't kid yourselves that digital is robust, it's far from robust, far, far far........and it's becoming more and more controlled and censored.

FSO_Polonez

L1011 has hit the nail on the head. DRM was over before it began.

NRK Finnmark is the latest casualty on the slow demise of LW. It will be closing in December. I'm surprised that Eur1, RMC & RTL are still going at all.

The decline of AM in the UK too seems to have stepped up a gear. LoveSport handed back their AM licence a couple of months back, Heritage Radio has gone over to FM. TalkSport want to close MW transmitters. So even where audio fidelity is not important MW isn't wanted anymore seemingly.

UK university stations are abandoning their LPAM frequencies at a rate of knots. Personally I'm surprised that this hasn't happened ages ago. After all, when did you last see someone of about 19/20 walking along while tuning in a transistor radio? Probably not in at least 2 decades.

Even in North America AM is on the decline. In Canada, radio stations are, in their words, "flipping" from AM to FM on an almost weekly basis. The only place in a 1st world country where AM makes sense anymore is the likes of Australia, which is so vast that tens of thousands of FM transmitters would not be viable, as opposed to AM where only a handful of transmitters can cover huge distances. Added to that, Australia is, after all, located in a very remote part of the world to the extent that interference from foreign stations is not really an issue, even at night.

I agree that there are some of the advantages of AM. Yes, very simple, immune from government censorship, TXs & RXs can be very easily be improvised by anyone with basic electrical engineering knowledge. But as a remotely mainstream means of broadcasting? Let's face it, AM is fckd.

I say this as someone who loved to spend each evening after school listening to the old Bush radio in its lovely timber cabinet, surfing the MW/LW/SW & trawler band dials. Those were the best of days. But the world has moved on now & so too has technology & how we get our information...

L1011

The beginning was over a decade ago. DRM on LW/SW/MW is dead. The primary need for the long distance broadcasting that it was designed for has ceased.

It isn't even popular enough to be an anorak format. If it has ANY life, its on VHF Band II ("FM")

[Deleted User]

It's only the beginning for DRM, they can't ignore the efficiency benefits, Remember my CNR screenshot above ?, I was able to receive it clear as a bell and with only 1 or 2 second breakups , with only 30 Kw of power that is astounding , however, conditions would not allow that every night but the potential is huge.

LW 252 is DRM capable and I'm sure it wouldn't be difficult to upgrade to the latest standards they could quarter the power of 252. But that won't happen, it will be switched off as soon as possible.

Future radios will have at least MW that are DRM capable, I got one already made by Gospell.

The distances covered by a single transmitter also can't be ignored as it can greatly cut down on infrastructure required.

The only issue I have with DRM is the audio quality is deliberately and unnecessarily poor, the technology allows for far higher quality but 11 Kbps stream no matter what codec they use won't be great.

L1011

There was a decent amount of DRM+ kit on show at IBC in Amsterdam over the weekend

Absolutely none of it concerned with LW/MW/SW transmission anymore. All in to FM; primarily looking at it as a method to get additional stations in crowded cities where bands are full.

If DRM ever returns to use it won't be on high power LW transmitters blasting stations to many countries; it'll be as a cheaper setup than DAB, for smaller areas or tricky terrain.

Doblin

It's a pity 2rn don't put up some videos of the work, a lot of anoraks would be very interested to see it.

dxhound2005

For anyone interested Algeria will probably be a good signal even during the day. And Denmark on 243 should be easier to hear. It is only on for a short time every week, and I can't find a current schedule. Very good signal with me, when RTE is nulled. I heard them on Sunday mornings with religious services.

This video shows reception in England.

Oscarziggy

Link doesn't work anymore --- this one does.
https://www.rte.ie/aertel/desktopxhtml/169-10.html

Oscarziggy

Latest --
https://www.rte.ie/aertel/desktopxhtml/169-13.html

[Deleted User]

No crackling here at all, solid as a rock at nearly 50 db over !

When I was in Wales and up to Birmingham it was one of the strongest signals all over and sounded good in the Mitsubishi Outlander. 1 x Transmitter, it was great , I was impressed.

Listen to it on my SDR using external Whip antenna, the Bonito MA305, until I get the Megaloop back.

http://emeraldsdr1.ddns.net:8073

Or my other SDR using the Bonitp Megadipol

http://emeraldsdr.ddns.net:8074/

BBC R4 even belts in on my SDR's, Can pick up 198 Khz on portable radio also but obviously much stronger with external antenna.

I can receive it perfectly on a portable radio also.

Portsalon

Mickey Mike wrote: »

You must be kidding, it sounds awful, cracking and tearing is all I hear, don't know how people listen to it in the UK. Those were the days back when 500kw was used, it was fantastic, I really loved MW 567 when every radio had MW.

Thunderstorms? Worst time of the year for listening to AM, surely?

Mickey Mike

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think 252 sounds just fine, at least to me.

You must be kidding, it sounds awful, cracking and tearing is all I hear, don't know how people listen to it in the UK. Those were the days back when 500kw was used, it was fantastic, I really loved MW 567 when every radio had MW.

[Deleted User]

Mickey Mike wrote: »

Sounds better there than what it does now in Ireland, I think the transmitter must be fcuked all together, I just don't know anymore.

I think 252 sounds just fine, at least to me.

Mickey Mike

[Deleted User] wrote: »

LW 252 received in Michigan back in 2010. Probably when it was running full power ?

Sounds better there than what it does now in Ireland, I think the transmitter must be fcuked all together, I just don't know anymore.

[Deleted User]

LW 252 received in Michigan back in 2010. Probably when it was running full power ?

[Deleted User]

More DRM from CNR-1 China, 30 Kw in Stereo, unfortunately , due to a close CRI 500 Kw station I could not get a successful decode but DRM is seriously starting to impress me.

[Deleted User]

The DRM station on 9655 Khz isn't making it here tonight, not a hint, propagation is non existant on the 31 meter band tonight, that's the way it goes.

I can pick it up on this sdr here http://czsdr.proxy.kiwisdr.com:8073/

225LongWave

18:40
Moderator. Please delete ALL above links https://www.ean.ie/mp3/

225LongWave

https://www.savertelongwaveradio.com/listen/

@19.8kb/ps EEP AAC+ mono
sample Radlett, Hertfordshire
https://www.ean.ie/mp3/rte-drm-london-m25.mp3