OwlsZat wrote: » Better question how does jet fuel on the 110th floor cause molten steel on the 1st to 90th floors. It doesn't. There was quite clearly thermite planted in the building. It's been published.
King Mob wrote: » How do explosions cause molten steel?
OwlsZat wrote: » The debris is visible blowing out the side of the building. You can look up any video on youtube and see it instantaneously. No further proof needed thats it. Silent my hole. There is montages of witness accounts recalling the series of explosions. There is also freely available video of the supposed super heated steel burning away after the collapse. The whole lot is a giant ball of steaming manure. How people can be so slow to realise? The whole plan in on record dreamed up when the Cuba crisis was ongoing and false flag attacks were Americas go to maneuver.
Overheal wrote: » Not just silent, we’ve seen the argument here that these alleged charges were silent, but also loud, surgical but also so explosive it hurled office furniture blocks away from the site. No consistent countertheory has emerged.
Overheal wrote: » Well, the towers fell because two jumbo jets crashed into them. I’m assuming, since 2010, the guest lecturer’s academic argument hasn’t made it through peer review.
Dohnjoe wrote: » Indeed, was just clarifying the likely source of the explosions. The reported explosions themselves happened sporadically throughout the day, which isn't consistent with any controlled demolition. Also, many conspiracy theorists support the idea of silent explosives, which is obviously contradictory
Spencerfreeman wrote: » I'm not disputing any of that. I just was suggesting that, taken in isolation, the first part could be used to suggest organised explosions. That why I included the information of the collapse beginning on the 67th floor before the general collapse. Which could lead, in my crazy mind, to an even collapse of the floors above. I could probably find that witness statement if anyone demands it. LOL I could accuse you of leaving it out on purpose!
Dohnjoe wrote: » A burning building creates a lot of explosions, gas canisters going off, transformers blowing, lifts falling down shafts, generators, car tires blowing, etc. There are even theories that the super-heated aluminium in the WTC tower (from the plane° when melted, pooled and seeped down through cracks in the buildings, could have caused small explosions as it hit water storage
Spencerfreeman wrote: » I read most of the eyewitness accounts. This one has bits for both sides of the argument. WORLD TRADE CENTER TASK FORCE INTERVIEW FIREFIGHTER RICHARD BANACISKI Interview Date: December 6, 2001 In relation to the first tower to collapse; "We were there I don't know, maybe 10, 15 minutes and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions. Everybody just said run and we all turned around and we ran into the parking garage because that's basically where we were. Running forward would be running towards it. Not thinking that this building is coming down."
Cheerful Spring2 wrote: » They're all liars and nobody should believe the US government's view about this attack
Cheerful Spring2 wrote: » You have forgotten we have a picture of a yellow/red liquid river. Least you agree he said it was a river of steel- so that's molten steel. He then changed his mind and said nobody saw it? How you go from claiming it was river of steel to claiming nobody saw anything His bascially ignored a story he told a group of people at Stanford university.
Dohnjoe wrote: » Bingo. And no. He said he saw a river of steel flowing. I saw footage of molten steel coming out of one of the buildings on the day of the attacks. It turns out it wasn't molten steel. Therefore I stand corrected. And so does he. Simple. Lots of people see and hear things that later turn out to be wrong. I heard what I thought was a large explosion the other day, it wasn't. But a truther would claim that I did hear an explosion, and that I later changed my story under pressure. I can't be trusted. I am flipflopping. I am not credible. How else do you think they get people to believe 911 was a conspiracy, without actually saying what the conspiracy is
Cheerful Spring2 wrote: » Leslie flip-flopping for years. He told a group in 2002 he saw a river of Molten steel at WTC site ( there a video of it) then in 2006 claimed it never happened on radio interview and said nobody saw it. He was obviously spoken to shut up about his experience.
Overheal wrote: » Called it DJ
Dohnjoe wrote: » Observe - this man will be attacked in order to discredit him
The Nal wrote: » So reading back, "they" took all the steel from WT7, without anyone noticing, and moved it to a different country? Am I reading this correctly?
Requests for the steel must also be approved by Judge Alvin K. Hellerstein of Federal District Court, who is overseeing wrongful death lawsuits stemming from the attacks. While the steel is considered potential evidence in those cases, tests on the steel were completed in 2005. The judge has since granted all requests and has given no indication he will do otherwise for the pending ones.
To facilitate the search and clean-up of the World Trade Center collapse, the 1.45 million tons of debris were sent to Fresh Kills, an old landfill on Staten Island. Using rakes, sifting tables, and heavy equipment, workers spread out the debris and meticulously examined it for even the smallest pieces of evidence. The site was staffed by members of the FBI, FDNY, NYPD, and other government agencies. In all, 54,000 personal objects were recovered and 1,200 victims identified.
Newspapers and TV newscasts reported that the twin towers had been designed to withstand a collision with a Boeing 707. The events of September 11th show that this was indeed the case. "However, the World Trade Center was never designed for the massive explosions nor the intense jet fuel fires that came nexta key design omission," stated Eduardo Kausel, another M.I.T. professor of civil and environmental engineering and panel member. The towers collapsed only after the kerosene fuel fire compromised the integrity of their structural tubes: One WTC lasted for 105 minutes, whereas Two WTC remained standing for 47 minutes. "It was designed for the type of fire you'd expect in an office buildingpaper, desks, drapes," McNamara said. The aviation fuel fires that broke out burned at a much hotter temperature than the typical contents of an office. "At about 800 degrees Fahrenheit structural steel starts to lose its strength; at 1,500 degrees F, all bets are off as steel members become significantly weakened," he explained.
Others have pointed out the possibility that the aviation fuel fires burned sufficiently hot to melt and ignite the airliners' aluminum airframe structures. Aluminum, a pyrophoric metal, could have added to the conflagrations. Hot molten aluminum, suggests one well-informed correspondent, could have seeped down into the floor systems, doing significant damage. "Aluminum melts into burning 'goblet puddles' that would pool around depressions, [such as] beam joints, service openings in the floor, stair wells and so forth...The goblets are white hot, burning at an estimated 1800 degrees Celsius. At this temperature, the water of hydration in the concrete is vaporized and consumed by the aluminum. This evolves hydrogen gas that burns. Aluminum burning in concrete produces a calcium oxide/silicate slag covered by a white aluminum oxide ash, all of which serve to insulate and contain the aluminum puddle. This keeps the metal hot and burning. If you look at pictures of Iraqi aircraft destroyed in their concrete shelters [during the Persian Gulf war], you will notice a deep imprint of the burned aircraft on the concrete floor. Though the Boeing 767s airliners that hit the towers were somewhat larger than the Boeing 707 (maximum takeoff weights: 395,000 pounds versus 336,000 pounds) the structures were designed to resist, the planes carried a similarly sized fuel load as the older modelabout 24,000 gallons versus 23,000 gallons, according to Kausel. "Most certainly," he continued, "no building has or will resist this kind of fire." The sprinkler system, which was probably compromised, would have been are useless against this kind of fire, he said, adding, "The World Trade Center towers performed admirably; they stood long enough for the majority of the people to be successfully evacuated."
"There will never be a building that won't fall," Kausel noted. "The best we can do is to ensure that it will stand long enough for all the people to escape." Back when the WTC was built, no one seems to have anticipated the need to evacuate an entire large building at once. To do so successfully means boosting a building's structural redundancythe provision of additional means to assist system function. Panel members discussed providing improved fire protection for the structural elements, alternative load paths to stand in for damaged structures and fixing diaphragm floor beams more strongly to vertical members. Also mentioned was the idea of installing blast-resistant, energy-absorbing materials such as concrete-encased steel exterior columns and/or cavities (reinforced concrete cores) in future large structures that could help them survive or at least promote failure in certain slower, less deleterious sequences.
banie01 wrote: » I'd much rather consider Leslie E Robertson's opinion of what the Towers were designed to resist.
The two towers were the first structures outside of the military and nuclear industries designed to resist the impact of a jet airliner, the Boeing 707. It was assumed that the jetliner would be lost in the fog, seeking to land at JFK or at Newark. To the best of our knowledge, little was known about the effects of a fire from such an aircraft, and no designs were prepared for that circumstance. Indeed, at that time, no fireproofing systems were available to control the effects of such fires.
banie01 wrote: » But... But.... They did! Oh wait!
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