nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

Negative vaping publicity

Guffy

I'm surprised there has been no discussion here about all of the recent negative reports on vaping. Reports coming out if the US with a lot of severe illnesses/death directly attributed to vaping.

Myself, i haven't seen anything concrete tbh. Seems like scare mongering to me but just from a cursory glance.

Has anyone else looked into this in more depth

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

bladespin

Definitely a concerted media effort to vilify vaping at the moment, hatchet stories all round, just asking for some minister to step in and save the children now.

This manipulation would make you sicker than smoking ever could.

conjon

youcancallmeal wrote: »

I'm finding it hard to understand why a surgeon would make claims like this with no real evidence to back it up. Surely if he had some inside track he could publish a medical paper and get world wide acclaim

My thoughts when I saw this yesterday was where's his funding coming from. A complete hatchet job

Captcha

bladespin wrote: »

Definitely a concerted media effort to vilify vaping at the moment, hatchet stories all round, just asking for some minister to step in and save the children now.

This manipulation would make you sicker than smoking ever could.

How is such information and hyperbole enabled?

The people making these claims to ban vaping etc need to be held to account when things get verified. At least on social media and the internet, the hyperbole propagators in positions with merit need to be called out...

bladespin

Captcha wrote: »

How is such information and hyperbole enabled?

The people making these claims to ban vaping etc need to be held to account when things get verified. At least on social media and the internet, the hyperbole propagators in positions with merit need to be called out...

As usual it's down to saying something without actually stating any facts, US vaping related deaths (where there's absolutely 0 regulation for liquids etc) are their whipping sticks - though funnily none here or in the UK?, apparently 6 people have died from vaping related illnesses so far (no proof that vaping actually killed any though), leaving out the fact that about 40k have dies so far from smoking related illnesses (links proven).

Also, Mr. UL seems to be a particularly ignorant type considering I have never witnessed any advertising for vaping aimed at children and the young??? I've been vaping years, what have I missed lol.

[Deleted User]

Dr. Sultan Sherif wrote:

Upon obtaining his medical degree from the Ain Shams University in 1987, he was first specialized in general and vascular surgery. Following completion of a master degree in surgery in 1991, he then worked solely in vascular surgery.

Dr. Sultan Sherif wrote:

.. Prof Sherif Sultan is widely regarded as the best vascular surgeon in Ireland boasting 30 years vascular experience

Boasting is right. He obtained his masters of Surgery in 1991 and has worked in Vascular surgery ever since. 2019 minus 1991 is 28 years experience. Not 30.

corkie

Dr Bill V1.5 wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/groups/450591418445468/

For anyone on Facebook, here's a group that you might be interested in joining.

Tom from NNA Ireland was on Newstalk lunchtime, second speaker.

[newstalk] Should vaping be banned in public places?

At present the states are legalizing marijuana and attempting to ban flavored eliquid or in some, devices as well like India.

Disclaimer: - I'm middle age man, who enjoys vaping flavors (i.e. 'NY Cheesecake' & 'Bubblegum Blast'). I'm not affiliated with any store or review site.

Captcha

corkie wrote: »

Tom from NNA Ireland was on Newstalk lunchtime, second speaker.

[newstalk] Should vaping be banned in public places?

At present the states are legalizing marijuana and attempting to ban flavored eliquid or in some, devices as well like India.

Disclaimer: - I'm middle age man, who enjoys vaping flavors (i.e. 'NY Cheesecake' & 'Bubblegum Blast'). I'm not affiliated with any store or review site.

Firstly marijuana is not a term that should be used to name cannabis. Secondly, cannabis is safe for adults, maybe even good for you in general.

The cannabis cartridges bought on the street created by criminals due to prohibition still being a thing is many states and the history of black markets means that criminals make THC type carts with dangerous mixtures such as vitamin E acetate or other unknown substances. It is naieve and just as dangerous to take a negative stance on cannabis as it is to vaping, probably worse, given how cannabis is saving so many lives. Look at Ava Twomney in Cork and her very brave mother.

Captcha

Having learned nothing more than a century after the start of Prohibition and after decades of the war on drug's utter and complete failure, the federal government has decided to turn legal vaping into enemy No. 1.

So what if the Sackler family walks free while 130 Americans die of opioid overdoses per day? The nanny state has an axe to grind with your vapes.

The Trump administration's push to all but ban vaping from the legal market isn't quite a war on e-cigarettes. That would imply that it's the nicotine pods that are causing a curious strain of lung problems in vapers when, in all likelihood, it's illegal THC-laced pods from the black market that are responsible. Naturally, both parties have joined forces to push the legal vape pods to the black market and make it just as easy as before to buy the illegal ones that might just kill you.

Your resistance, legally speaking, is futile. Despite Juul's best efforts to fit in with Washington sycophants and bend the knee to our regulatory overlords, the Food and Drug Administration, the White House, and now the bloviating big government on both sides of the political aisle aren't budging in their misdirected ire. However, your market power is not.

It's time to vote with your dollars and prepare for the worst. Go to your local 7-Eleven, or even better yet, your neighborhood mom and pop vape shop and stock up on Juul pods.

Today, protesters are expected to shut down the streets of D.C. to stick it to climate change. It won't really accomplish anything aside from enraging those of us with jobs to get to and perhaps exacerbate greenhouse gas emissions by bringing traffic to a standstill, but I have to appreciate the passion. As the great Dylan Thomas once instructed, rage against the dying of the light. Or the certainty of death caused by climate change. Or the certainty of Beltway authoritarians banning your Juul pods.

So go ahead and pick up some Juul pods, and maybe a case of White Claw while you're at it, and say goodbye to summer and yet another receding free market as you take a hit of a product that almost certainly won't kill one half of its lifelong users.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/go-stock-up-on-juul-pods

corkie

Some favorable publishing!

[ASH][PDF] Use of e-cigarettes (vaporisers) among adults in Great Britain

Picked up by SkyNews: -

Vaping in the UK continues to grow as fears about safety increase
More than half the people using e-cigarettes are ex-smokers who have used vaping to help quit.

rob316

The market is as good as gone in the US anyway, Massachusetts just put a 4 month ban on every vaping product.
Bar one decent article I read in the Washington Post none of the media are reading between the lines here, this is an American problem. The symptom of a totally unregulated market.

[Deleted User]

Someone on from the Asthma Society of ireland calling for a ban on vaping products to save the children and save the asthmatics. Every day the world becomes more Nanny statesque.

My primary worry is that my safe, regulated vape juice will be pushed underground and instead of making it safe, it will then become detrimental to my health.

Shinobollo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Someone on from the Asthma Society of ireland calling for a ban on vaping products to save the children and save the asthmatics. Every day the world becomes more Nanny statesque.

My primary worry is that my safe, regulated vape juice will be pushed underground and instead of making it safe, it will then become detrimental to my health.

Pure ****e. A number of contributors to this forum have stated that their asthma was alleviated by switching to vaping

partyguinness

Deleted User wrote: »

Boasting is right. He obtained his masters of Surgery in 1991 and has worked in Vascular surgery ever since. 2019 minus 1991 is 28 years experience. Not 30.

Read it again and slowly this time.

From 1987, he worked in general and vascular surgery. He then specialised in vascular from 1991. That equates to 32 years in vascular- which BTW is higher number than 30.

partyguinness

youcancallmeal wrote: »

I'm finding it hard to understand why a surgeon would make claims like this with no real evidence to back it up. Surely if he had some inside track he could publish a medical paper and get world wide acclaim

Oh I dunno because maybe he is a surgeon and with all sorts of medical qualifications and first hand experience. Medical papers and studies take years to compile after peer review.

I guessing that jumping 500ft off a cliff is bad for my health but without 'real evidence' and a peer reviewed medical paper I am not buying it.

But I'm sure you know better.

[Deleted User]

partyguinness wrote: »

Read it again and slowly this time.

Your condescending style is a welcome addition to this thread.

I guessing that jumping 500ft off a cliff is bad for my health but without 'real evidence' and a peer reviewed medical paper I am not buying it.

But I'm sure you know better.

More solid gold analysis. Thank you so much for your contribution.

Dr Bill V1.5

partyguinness wrote: »

Oh I dunno because maybe he is a surgeon and with all sorts of medical qualifications and first hand experience. Medical papers and studies take years to compile after peer review.

I guessing that jumping 500ft off a cliff is bad for my health but without 'real evidence' and a peer reviewed medical paper I am not buying it.

But I'm sure you know better.

No one is claiming to 'know better' but what vapers would like to know are the facts in relation to any claim being made that vaping is as bad,worse or better than smoking. After all, for most vapers, it was a personal choice to switch from smoking to vaping in order to reduce the health risks associated with smoking, the data available re vaping as a means of smoking cessation has always been positive.

https://www.nhs.uk/smokefree/help-and-advice/e-cigarettes

Jumping off a 500ft cliff is something you'll do once in your life so a medical paper won't really be of benefit to you, however, people have been vaping many years with very little negative feedback so it's only proper that if an expert in this area has some definitive information then pass it on.

partyguinness

Dr Bill V1.5 wrote: »

No one is claiming to 'know better' but what vapers would like to know are the facts in relation to any claim being made that vaping is as bad,worse or better than smoking. After all, for most vapers, it was a personal choice to switch from smoking to vaping in order to reduce the health risks associated with smoking, the data available re vaping as a means of smoking cessation has always been positive.

https://www.nhs.uk/smokefree/help-and-advice/e-cigarettes

Jumping off a 500ft cliff is something you'll do once in your life so a medical paper won't really be of benefit to you, however, people have been vaping many years with very little negative feedback so it's only proper that if an expert in this area has some definitive information then pass it on.

I might survive. Who knows right?

It is not unreasonable to conclude that swapping one set of chemicals for another and pumping it into your lungs on a daily basis is still going to be bad for you whatever way you want to spin it. So really you are only talking in terms of badness e.g. cigarettes have more chemicals and crap so they should be worse for you. The bar is pretty low.

I guess a lot of budding entrepreneurs have jumped on the vaping bandwagon with new shops, leases etc and it is in their interest to be somewhat dismissal of any negative publicity. Dress it up as concern for the lack of empirical evidence if you like.

partyguinness

Deleted User wrote: »

Your condescending style is a welcome addition to this thread.

More solid gold analysis. Thank you so much for your contribution.

A surgeon spoke out against vaping and the best response you can come up with is that he only has 28 years vascular rather than 30 ergo he cannot be taken serious.

My post was condescending in tone because that is what your juvenile post deserved.

Anyway, I am out of here. I do not wish to derail your thread.

The Nal

The main ingredients in most vaping oils are propylene glycol which is totally harmless and vegetable glycerin which is used in ice cream and toothpaste.

If theres something dodgy on the label, dont smoke it.

Dr Bill V1.5

partyguinness wrote: »

I might survive. Who knows right?

It is not unreasonable to conclude that swapping one set of chemicals for another and pumping it into your lungs on a daily basis is still going to be bad for you whatever way you want to spin it. So really you are only talking in terms of badness e.g. cigarettes have more chemicals and crap so they should be worse for you. The bar is pretty low.

I guess a lot of budding entrepreneurs have jumped on the vaping bandwagon with new shops, leases etc and it is in their interest to be somewhat dismissal of any negative publicity. Dress it up as concern for the lack of empirical evidence if you like.

Haha, you seem to have attempted to jump on the wagon here and missed the step. It's obvious from your basic knowledge posts that you know very little on the subject of vaping, it's intended use by the 200k or so vapers in Ireland and the majority of members in this forum, I see from your following post that your 'outa here' so I won't bother trying to educate you, pity really, or maybe you're like the good doctor we discussed earlier, make assumptions, drop a few badly re searched statements and..... disappear.

corkie

The Nal wrote: »

The main ingredients in most vaping oils are propylene glycol which is totally harmless and vegetable glycerin which is used in ice cream and toothpaste.

If theres something dodgy on the label, dont smoke it.

I will correct you there, there is NO OILS in eliquid (legal TPD in EU or FDA (Federal Death Agency) approved in US).

Just because they are manufactured/extract from oils, doesn't make them oils.

I have also made the mistake of calling them oils.

Easy test get a shot glass of water and drop vegetable oil into it, and compare with doing the same with eliquid. eliquid will just dissolve in it, where as oils will bubble or float to the top.

partyguinness

Dr Bill V1.5 wrote: »

Haha, you seem to have attempted to jump on the wagon here and missed the step. It's obvious from your basic knowledge posts that you know very little on the subject of vaping, it's intended use by the 200k or so vapers in Ireland and the majority of members in this forum, I see from your following post that your 'outa here' so I won't bother trying to educate you, pity really, or maybe you're like the good doctor we discussed earlier, make assumptions, drop a few badly re searched statements and..... disappear.

Mate, seriously when you are a smoker or vaper you lose the high moral ground on education. Maybe you should 'educate' the vastly experienced medical surgeon and ask him to stop saying nasty things about the joys of vaping. We can't have ignoramuses like that in our hospitals.

The reason I was disappearing is to avoid the inevitable troll accusation and possible yellow card.

[Deleted User]

partyguinness wrote: »

Mate, seriously when you are a smoker or vaper you lose the high moral ground on education. Maybe you should 'educate' the vastly experienced medical surgeon and ask him to stop saying nasty things about the joys of vaping. We can't have ignoramuses like that in our hospitals.

The reason I was disappearing is to avoid the inevitable troll accusation and possible yellow card.

Mate when you say you're outta here and then come back to have the last word, you lose all credibility.

Dr Bill V1.5

partyguinness wrote: »

Mate, seriously when you are a smoker or vaper you lose the high moral ground on education. Maybe you should 'educate' the vastly experienced medical surgeon and ask him to stop saying nasty things about the joys of vaping. We can't have ignoramuses like that in our hospitals.

The reason I was disappearing is to avoid the inevitable troll accusation and possible yellow card.

'Mate'.... don't flatter yourself. If you're reason for leaving is fear of troll accusations then let me suggest that while you're away use some of that time to educate yourself on vaping and when/if you return then we can have a reasonably informed debate on the subject and your fear of troll accusations will be alleviated.

corkie

UK Media accurately reporting.

corkie

FDA enlists DEA in vaping probe, will prosecute sales of illicit e-cigarettes as a crime

At least they have started!? To look at the real problem, but should have been done allot sooner.

Watching some of the house hearings today. Got the conclusion that the FDA (Federal Death Agency) has no power to do anything about illicit/BM products. So just targeting what they do have power over (tobacco & vaping).

Ex-FDA chief Gottlieb blames outbreak of deadly vaping illness on illegal nicotine products

“It’s not clear that these acute lung injuries are being caused by the legally sold regulated products, which FDA does oversee the manufacture of,” Gottlieb said on Wednesday on “Squawk Box.” “It appears that many of these acute lung injuries are being driven by illegal products that have oils in them.”

Florida reports first vaping-related death
^^^ Death only reported today (or news breaking today)

The chart lists 27 reported cases of lung injury tied to vaping in Florida in 2019, and one death. It’s not clear when that death occurred, though the chart was last updated Tuesday.
....
The group responded with a statement first issued September 11. It says in part, "...the vast majority of the victims of these illnesses admitted to using illicit THC cartridges. Further, the investigation had been narrowed down to a specific brand on the black market..."

bladespin

partyguinness wrote: »

Maybe you should 'educate' the vastly experienced medical surgeon and ask him to stop saying nasty things about the joys of vaping. We can't have ignoramuses like that in our hospitals.

That's a very good suggestion though, in such a position of responsibility, he shouldn't be making unfounded remarks like that: either way, it would be just as bad if he had come out and said vaping was perfectly safe, he has no proof of anything, he really should just give his opinion, and be sure to clarify that it's a personal opinion, not a medical recommendation.

corkie

[cdc] THC Products May Play a Role in Outbreak of Lung Injury Associated with E-cigarette Use, or Vaping
Investigation ongoing, no single product linked to all cases, but patterns emerge
^^^ Published today Sept 27th

The latest findings from the investigation into lung injuries associated with e-cigarette use, or vaping, suggest THC products play a role in the outbreak. Most of the people (77%) in this outbreak reported using THC-containing products, or both THC-containing products and nicotine-containing products, according to a report published today in the CDC’s Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR).

Esel

corkie wrote: »

[cdc] THC Products May Play a Role in Outbreak of Lung Injury Associated with E-cigarette Use, or Vaping
Investigation ongoing, no single product linked to all cases, but patterns emerge
^^^ Published today Sept 27th

From that page:

"In addition, the report from Illinois and Wisconsin showed that nearly all THC-containing products reported were packaged, prefilled cartridges that were primarily acquired from informal sources such as friends, family members, illicit dealers, or off the street."

It appears that Vitamin E Acetate is implicated, as it is a common ingredient in these THC mixes.

So, probably not the THC itself.

TinCool

Oh dear
https://www.breakingnews.ie/ir...on-flavoured-vapes-953614.html

and with this going on at the same time

https://www.independent.ie/irish-ne...ng-into-unchartered-territories-38522454.html