spacetweek wrote: » There's so little progress on this project that I only check in on this thread every few months, but my word is it depressing. I'm worried that DART expansion is due to begin by 2021, but also Metrolink. This town ain't big enough for the both of those projects to be underway simultaneously, I'd wager.
LeinsterDub wrote: » Aren't they just calling the order they've made for sufficient rolling stock for the current DART as the start of the expansion?
spacetweek wrote: » OK, maybe, but I thought major moves were due to start on DART in 2021. But by that year there'll probably be a mild recession. And Metrolink trying to get in on the act.
Zebra3 wrote: » One could argue that ML has already been broken into two phases....
MJohnston wrote: » You can't break up the work on Metrolink, but it can certainly be phased in terms of cost over many years. Which is really the important bit.
Last Stop wrote: » DART expansion can be broken down into several smaller projects and delivered on a phased basis. Unfortunately Metrolink cannot. The way the have tendered the works, it looks like it’s broken up based on the lines with the Maynooth line first, then the Kildare line etc. The Maynooth line can also be further broken down into smaller parts such as level crossing removal and then electrification. Given the significant works Metrolink have at Glasnevin, I’d imagine Irish Rail will be holding off electrification until after those works are substantially complete. They will also want to coincide the electrification with the deliver of the new EMUs So you could look at the following phasing starting in 2021: Phase 1: Maynooth level crossing removal Phase 2: Heuston 4 tracking Phase 3: Kildare line electrification Phase 4: Maynooth line electrification Each of these phases could take 18 months or longer so the budget can be well spread.
DoctorPan wrote: » Maynooth Electrification & associated works is the first phase, tender closed Monday.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » The Maynooth electrification and Kildare line electrification can and shouldbbe progressed as standalone projects. Assuming that the Maynooth line is electrified to Glasnevin Junction and tracks there rearranged as part of Metrolink Enabling Works, each can progress entirely independent of the other. Both need to be progressed in tandem and not worry about phasing. In terms of the Maynooth line, electrification is the priority. Level crossing removal can come later and will be easier to get through if the roads are closed for longer periods due to increased train frequency.
Last Stop wrote: » Electrifying to Glasnevin junction first would have zero benefit. 1) you couldn’t run EMU trains on it as the last stop would be Broomsbridge and the real demand even with LCC is Maynooth to Connolly 2) you mightn’t have any EMUs to run on it as the order will take several years to deliver. Removing the level crossings allows for increased frequencies and improved safety. Delaying it until after electrification would add complications and risk to the construction as you now have HV wires in the way when lifting in bridge beams for example. The works at Glasnevin will need careful coordination. The Metrolink station will have to be constructed, the new DART platforms, are the Irish Rail tracks even at the same level there? If not they will have to be regraded. Metrolink will start construction in 2021. Since it’s tunnelling from Northwood, the first station to be constructed will be Ballymun. Glasnevin will be 4th on the list. I’d imagine it will get priority but you’re still talking 2 years for station construction and it would be very foolish to spend any money on DART at that location before that. So you’re talking about 2023 at the earliest before any electrification works can realistically begin so it would make the most sense to remove the level crossings first.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » Glasnevin Junction and the new Glasnevin station requires substantial alterations and realignments to allow for the Metrolink station construction. This work could include the civil works for electrical infrastructure (ducting, earthing, bases for overhead cable supports, etc). The cabling is straightforward if the infrastructure is there to receive it. My point is that this section is the interdependency between the Maynooth and Kildare line electrifications. If enabling works are done here, either can proceed without waiting for the other. The issue with having something as a first phase is that if it gets held up, everything is held up. Everything needs to proceed in tandem with interdependencies done separately so that one hold up doesn't stop other works. It is inevitable that issues will arise to delay some sections but this should not delay everything else. Level crossing removal on the Maynooth line is likely to be a significant source of delays, if this delays electrification of the line then the Kildare line gets delayed because it shares the Maynooth line from Glasnevin south. Both electrifications should plough on regardless of the other. Upping the frequency on the Maynooth line before the level crossings are removed will make the locals get realistic about the removal, opposing everything won't be an option.
Last Stop wrote: » This would mean that either any EMUs you order would be sitting idle for a number of years until electrification
Last Stop wrote: » Electrifying to Glasnevin junction first would have zero benefit.
CatInABox wrote: » Glasnevin Junction works include redoing the junction west of the station first, allowing trains from both lines to use the docklands line. The Drumcondra line is to be removed while station works are ongoing, with it to be regraded as construction is finished. This means that the Docklands line can remain operational during Metrolink Construction. I wouldn't be surprised to see the line electrified during this time, what with it being worked on anyway. There will obviously be some disruption during construction, ranging from minor to major. I'd imagine no weekend running for one.
GerardKeating wrote: » It would if the Kildare route (and Pheonix Park tunnell) was done at the same time.
Last Stop wrote: » What makes you think that the level crossings will have delays?
Last Stop wrote: » But why would you do that?
Pete_Cavan wrote: » They have been trying to get rid of them for years but all attempts have been met up significant opposition from locals and Councillors. Nothing has changed and going again we require drawn out consultation and planning processes plus possible legal challenges. Getting planning approval for the level crossing removals will be longest process in this, having everything hinging on it will mean nothing happens for a long time. At least if the level crossings are closed for longer, the locals are incentivised to engage in finding a solution and alienate the noisy few who will shout down every solution offered.
GerardKeating wrote: » Let the trains from Kildare into Connolly?
Last Stop wrote: » The level crossing removal will form part of the DART Expansion railway order.
Pete_Cavan wrote: » The Maynooth and Kildare lines electrifications will have separate consultant appointments and I'm pretty sure they entail separate Railway Order applications. Tying the whole lot together and have it all dependant on level crossing closures is a recipe for getting nothing done. DART Expansion is the overarching name for this be it will contain multiple separate elements, these need to be able to progress independently of each other to ensure as much as possible gets done in the shortest time possible.
Zebra3 wrote: » Can’t understand why the one between Leixlip and Maynooth wasn’t closed years ago.
