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M7 - Naas/Newbridge Bypass Upgrade [Junction 9a now open]

JupiterKid

Following on from the suggestion of a poster, this thread has been set up to discuss the need for widening the M7.

The section of the M7 IMO in immediate need (really a backlog need) for widening is the section from the Maudlins Interchange at Naas to the M9 interchange - basically the original 1983 Naas Bypass and half of the 1993 Newbridge Bypass. Is this likely to proceed in the near future?

Would the central median be wide enough for widening to D3M here? I'm pretty sure it is wide enough on the Newbridge bypass section but I'm not so sure in the case of the Naas Bypass.

Also, what bridges will need to be demolished and rebuilt? Or would it be more practical to drop the hard shoulder through the existing bridges?

What about the proposal a few years back to build a new junction at on the Naas Bypass at Osberstown? Will it still go ahead?

In the longer term, does anyone see a need to widen the M7 to the N7/M8 junction?

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Darc19

WishUWereHere wrote: »

You are so right DolanBaker. I don't know if the driver was local or not, but He sure was lost. I'm not sure that these temporary orange signs ( with black writing ) suffice, but where they are positioned isn't the most obvious - standing up on the ground...no elevation. I just hope the man got to Naas safely!

I went through it today on the way back from Cork.

Signs are as good as you get. They are very clear. They are NOT temporary signs with black on orange.
The only temporary sign at that roundabout is a single sign on the approach from Naas.

But coming off the M7 northbound and heading to Naas is very clearly signed. There's also a universal no entry sign for those tempted to go down the off ramp.

The driver was simply a bad driver not paying attention.

road_high

Kevtherev1 wrote: »

The M7 Upgrade website has just posted the following traffic update.

This coming Sunday 8th Sept, the M9 southbound carriageway between Junction 11 (M7 split) and Junction 2 (Kilcullen) will be closed from 21.30 hrs through to 06.30hrs on Monday 9th Sep.Traffic will be diverted along the M7 westbound from Junction 11 to exit at Junction 12 (Newbridge) and then directed onto the R413 towards Kilcullen past the Curragh turning left at Kilcullen onto the R448 to rejoin the M9 at Junction 2.

This closure and diversion is necessary to carry out essential surfacing works as part of the M7 Upgrade. Motorists may experience some delays due to this closure and diversion and should make allowances when planning their journey.The Gardai will be in attendance during the closure to assist in maintaining traffic flows at certain locations.

Will this mean the M9 junctions will finally be “tied in”’ to the new road? Current temp set up is a pain in the arse

_Kaiser_

road_high wrote: »

Will this mean the M9 junctions will finally be “tied in”’ to the new road? Current temp set up is a pain in the arse

Actually, one thing I've noted since they reduced the M9-M7 merge to one lane is there's a lot less muppetry and collisions at that point. Prior to this there were regular incidents where cars merging shoot across the hatch markings in front of oncoming cars on the main-line, or jumping 3 lanes to get to the outside.

The free-flowing experience since the lanes were reduced has been very welcome.

[Deleted User]

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Actually, one thing I've noted since they reduced the M9-M7 merge to one lane is there's a lot less muppetry and collisions at that point. Prior to this there were regular incidents where cars merging shoot across the hatch markings in front of oncoming cars on the main-line, or jumping 3 lanes to get to the outside.

The free-flowing experience since the lanes were reduced has been very welcome.

Not very welcome to those of us stuck in tailbacks though is it ?

Perhaps the free flowing traffic is as a result of no tailbacks there now, ever think of this ?

The 3 lanes at Naas is great now but all it did was move the traffic up faster so it's backed up from Kill to newalands Cross now, hardly a great success at the end of the day.

Perhaps we should get foreign engineers to sort out our traffic congestion and build proper roads because we have proved time and time again that we are not able to do it.

Time Irish roads go up on stilts like other countries.

All that money spent to solve traffic around Naas to have it pushed further up.

JohnC.

Are you suggesting these foreign countries with their foreign engineers don’t also suffer from tailbacks?

[Deleted User]

JohnC. wrote: »

Are you suggesting these foreign countries with their foreign engineers don’t also suffer from tailbacks?

I'm sure they do with populations much, much larger than our tiny population and tiny Island !

pegasus1

sdanseo wrote: »

Simpler than that, every off ramp should have massive no entry signs. Most do but some don't.

nope... on the M9 junction 9 off ramps at the top there was only basic line through an arrow saying wrong way or similar.. I used to see many a tourist go down these off ramps, so going the wrong way on a motorway..most stopped themselves whilst on the ramp..
I informed a local Councillor to see about geting the European standard horizontal white line red background no entry signs installed, which has worked..haven't seen one mistake since..
Why is it us Irish seem to think themselves better at certain things

_Kaiser_

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Not very welcome to those of us stuck in tailbacks though is it ?

Perhaps the free flowing traffic is as a result of no tailbacks there now, ever think of this ?

Read my post again. The reason there's free flow on the mainline M7 is because merging traffic from the M9 has been slowed significantly. Not fun for anyone who can merge properly, but as I said there's a lot of drivers who cause regular issues at that point too because they can't.

The 3 lanes at Naas is great now but all it did was move the traffic up faster so it's backed up from Kill to newalands Cross now, hardly a great success at the end of the day.

Perhaps we should get foreign engineers to sort out our traffic congestion and build proper roads because we have proved time and time again that we are not able to do it.

Time Irish roads go up on stilts like other countries.

All that money spent to solve traffic around Naas to have it pushed further up.

This I tend to agree with for the most part, and equally I think we'll need to wait and see if the outbound issues move from Naas to the M9 split.

The only way around this in the long run is to significantly improve the rail options and create a motorway grade link between the M7 and the M4 around Naas South to Maynooth with a view to extending that as a full outer orbital to the M3 around Dunboyne and then M2 and M1, so that traffic not actually needing to go as far as the M50 could avoid it.

fullstop

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

That's what I was asking. Couldn't understand why it was there but as an n driver being caught doing 120 in a 60 would pretty **** you up. Frustrating

If it says 60, why the hell would you be doing 120?? Use a bit of common sense, even if you are going to break the limit.

[Deleted User]

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

This I tend to agree with for the most part, and equally I think we'll need to wait and see if the outbound issues move from Naas to the M9 split.

The only way around this in the long run is to significantly improve the rail options and create a motorway grade link between the M7 and the M4 around Naas South to Maynooth with a view to extending that as a full outer orbital to the M3 around Dunboyne and then M2 and M1, so that traffic not actually needing to go as far as the M50 could avoid it.

The real issue is public transport, I agree. But I don't think this will ever be solved here, no political will, they're only there for the Pension at the end of the day and couldn't care less about the interests of the Country.

Motorway link from M7 is useless if it excludes the M9 or N7, there are no links from most of the motorways to other motorways in this Country.

I'd say link to M3, M4, M1 would be better off coming from the N7.

But absolutely, the traffic heading North and South on the M50 coming from N7 needs to be removed before Newlands cross, how likely is this ever to happen ?

If today's traffic is anything to go by then I'll be back to taking back roads, very sad and all the millions that were spent !

I heard on KFM the other night raving about the success on the M7 Naas bypass, ignoring the fact it did nothing to improve overall traffic to Dublin at Peak times ! muppets !

MaceFace

Deleted User wrote: »

The real issue is public transport, I agree. But I don't think this will ever be solved here, no political will, they're only there for the Pension at the end of the day and couldn't care less about the interests of the Country.

Motorway link from M7 is useless if it excludes the M9 or N7, there are no links from most of the motorways to other motorways in this Country.

I'd say link to M3, M4, M1 would be better off coming from the N7.

But absolutely, the traffic heading North and South on the M50 coming from N7 needs to be removed before Newlands cross, how likely is this ever to happen ?

If today's traffic is anything to go by then I'll be back to taking back roads, very sad and all the millions that were spent !

I heard on KFM the other night raving about the success on the M7 Naas bypass, ignoring the fact it did nothing to improve overall traffic to Dublin at Peak times ! muppets !

You do realise what you are asking for here? You want the government to put in CPOs on a huge number of long settled communities. Not just forcing people out of their homes or off farms, but force others to live beside major roads that never had an intention of doing so. The realities is that will end up in the courts for a decade.

You also claimed the traffic is backed up to Kill from Newlands Cross. That's 10 miles, and backed up generally means stop start. Sorry, but I find that hard to believe on a normal day (without an accident), it is any where near that. Absolutely it is congested and very heavy, but backed up???

And yes, so far the M7 upgrade is a massive success. Last Friday, travelling at 4pm from the M50 to Naas, there was heavy traffic as far as the Poitin Stil and just beyond, but after that it opened up and I could travel at or about the speed limit all the way to the Naas North exit. There didn't seem any sign of the traffic slowing even after that. That is a massive improvement to anyone going westbound.
When the Naas North eastbound entrance is completely opened, it should also be a big improvement in that rather than having a short merge onto the N7 as before, you now have an auxiliary lane between Naas North and Johnstown. That's fantastic.

It really bugs me, and it has riddled this thread that people are just looking for reasons to complain and belittle the great progress. Some people will never be happy.

SoupyNorman

Deleted User wrote: »

...
If today's traffic is anything to go by then I'll be back to taking back roads, very sad and all the millions that were spent !...

You can spend millions and or billions and still driver stupidity will prevail.

Traffic was bad this morning because of a crash, once again in the right hand land. Morons speeding, tail gating in wet conditions. When I see bad traffic like that I am relieved that it was a man-made issue and not a fundamental issue of the road layout of traffic volume.

The N7 widening is a success, driver behavior is another challenge entirely.

Darc19

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The 3 lanes at Naas is great now but all it did was move the traffic up faster so it's backed up from Kill to newalands

All that money spent to solve traffic around Naas to have it pushed further up.

The M7 upgrade has never been about getting traffic to Dublin quicker. That has been stated several times by TII and reiterated a couple of weeks ago by their head, Sean O'brien.

They even stated that there would be more tailbacks closer to Dublin.

However the huge benefit for Dublin commuters is on the journey home, and looking at how freely traffic moved last Friday afternoon, you'd have to accept that.

Thousands of motorists work in Naas and Newbridge and it is a godsend to them. Also the third lane that allows for free flow movement from M9 has meant a safer road and five weeks of zero accidents which has to be a record.

Then you have the thousands using sallins which is almost a permanent traffic blacks pot and then Naas itself. Again thousands of motorists daily going through it.

The upgrade cost to 3 Lanes was about €55m (saw the figure last week, but can't find it now)

The overall scheme will cost €120m including the Osberstown junction and sallins bypass which will sort the sallins issue and assist greatly on relieving Naas of congestion.

[Deleted User]

MaceFace wrote: »

It really bugs me, and it has riddled this thread that people are just looking for reasons to complain and belittle the great progress. Some people will never be happy.

I'll stop complaining when I can either take proper public transport or I don't have to take back roads to avoid the N7.

The traffic this morning was crawling and stopping from Kill to where I turned off at Kingswood.

I don't find that progress !

Mantis Toboggan

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll stop complaining when I can either take proper public transport or I don't have to take back roads to avoid the N7.

The traffic this morning was crawling and stopping from Kill to where I turned off at Kingswood.

I don't find that progress !

Reality is we're not far off needing 4 lanes like the M50.

[Deleted User]

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

Reality is we're not far off needing 4 lanes like the M50.

M50 is majority 3 lanes is it not ?

no room for 4 lanes on the N7 I don't think and if there were the slip roads would need to be upgraded, proper exits and on ramps, up on big concrete stilts, etc.

tom1ie

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

Reality is we're not far off needing 4 lanes like the M50.

Ah for gods sake, let’s make it 5,6,7 lanes. :rolleyes:
Park and rides plus proper public transport is the only answer, not turning the whole country into a tarmaced car park!

[Deleted User]

Proper public transport needs to link up all the industrial estates.

SoupyNorman

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll stop complaining when I can either take proper public transport or I don't have to take back roads to avoid the N7.

The traffic this morning was crawling and stopping from Kill to where I turned off at Kingswood.

I don't find that progress !

I’ve used the N7 every day since all 3 lanes opened and in all these weeks I can count on one hand days where accidents have severely held me up.

I’d need many more hands to count all the days I flew into and home from the office. My commute is down to 40mins from 55mins-1hr…That is no exaggeration.

You seem to be talking one day in isolation thus throwing your toys out of the pram…sure ya may as well just stick to the back roads if you hate the N7 so much.

[Deleted User]

SoupyNorman wrote: »

I’ve used the N7 every day since all 3 lanes opened and in all these weeks I can count on one hand days where accidents have severely held me up.

I’d need many more hands to count all the days I flew into and home from the office. My commute is down to 40mins from 55mins-1hr…That is no exaggeration.

You seem to be talking one day in isolation thus throwing your toys out of the pram…sure ya may as well just stick to the back roads if you hate the N7 so much.

Are you mad ? I was coming off night shift on the 3rd 4th and 5th and the traffic heading north towards Dublin was the usual crap.

Heading South might make a difference but I don't see peak traffic on the way home when I finish at 8 PM.

But certainly, heading north is still a joke.

Tomrota

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'll stop complaining when I can either take proper public transport or I don't have to take back roads to avoid the N7.

The traffic this morning was crawling and stopping from Kill to where I turned off at Kingswood.

I don't find that progress !

The traffic toward Dublin will remain bad and continue to worsen as the government does nothing to improve public transport in Dublin and the greater Dublin Area, but there is no denying that going southbound on the N7 has been greatly improved and pretty free flowing.

The solution is not to add more lanes to M50 or N7, that will encourage more people to use cars. How about Metro north, metro west, dart underground, and other public transport initiatives? Rail, especially metro, is always extremely punctual, isn’t affected by traffic, cheaper, and extremely reliable.

The problem is how do you relieve the N7? Well, how do you get from Naas to Sandyford on public transport? How do you get from naas to Dublin airport logistics park? The system we have now is broken, fragmented, unreliable, and flawed. More metros, DART, and Luas will solve all of this.

Why would someone from naas take a 126 bus to Dublin which is unreliable, (very) expensive, have long waits, doesn’t allow for connections with Dublin bus, etc. when they can drive and compete their journey in a much shorter period?

[Deleted User]

How do I get from Carlow to Grangecastle business park ? lol

There's an unused railway station near the business park but even so I'd still have to get from there to work and back and the trains would have to work with my shifts and they wouldn't currently.

I took the train to Dublin one morning in May, it was absolutely jammers, people standing but it was on time. Got to Luas, people actually fell out of that as someone was pushing trying to get out, no thanks lol. That was the morning there was a fault on the Luas too and I had to wait 20 more mins.

Need to be able to get people Into Dublin too from the commuter areas.

tom1ie

Deleted User wrote: »

Proper public transport needs to link up all the industrial estates.

Agreed. Orbital routes with bus connects (if it’s ever built- which I highly doubt) are what’s required to allow proper pt integration.

Sam Russell

Mod: Can we get back on the M7 Upgrade please?.

Interesting as it is, discussion on public transport should be done on the appropriate thread.

Thank you

_Kaiser_

tom1ie wrote: »

Agreed. Orbital routes with bus connects (if it’s ever built- which I highly doubt) are what’s required to allow proper pt integration.

Won't happen. Big piece in the Indo today about how BC pits commuters against communities and how trees will be cut and gardens lost to make room for it.

Also reference that the orbital routes will be "at least" hourly so yea, great help!

Proper underground with beefing up of existing rail on the Kildare and Maynooth lines is what's needed, alongside massive P&R facilities at each main junction with the M50 (N7 already has it at the Red Cow but would need extending) linking it to the city centre via LUAS/underground and a congestion charge beyond that.

Will never happen though. They'll deliver something alright, but it'll be so watered down and ineffective that it'll likely make things worse!

[EDIT: Posted before I saw Sam's message.. feel free to move if needed]

Cazale

Did the m9 junction works complete as planned overnight?

Pablod

Cazale wrote: »

Did the m9 junction works complete as planned overnight?

No the inside lane had been moved onto the hard should with bollards along side of lane 1, didn't look like a while lot done (could he wring though)

It actually caused mayhem this evening around 6pm, traffic was tailed back a good 1km (if not more) to join the queue, and there was still dimwits pulling over from lane 3 closer to the exit and forcing their way in ...

road_high

I wish they’d just finish the tie in now. This is just arsing about

BuzzFish

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Time Irish roads go up on stilts like other countries.

Many case studies have shown these have been a terrible idea as they provide dark and unlit areas below which breed antisocial behaviour.

May solve traffic issues but ultimately cause more harm than good.

Stan27

North bound in traffic, I dont see a major difference.

Southbound, defo an improvement.

Would be cool to have the proposed road for naas Town to be built, and a 3rd lane from the split to maybe kildare Laois boarder (southbound).
Though public transport is really needed. Dublin needs to be sorted first as there is no point some one from naas getting a train for examplebut can't get to ballycoolin industrial estate.