Pa ElGrande wrote: » Not in Ireland being surrounded by water with prevailing south-west winds means we have a damp climate with poor drying conditions. Even with several years of air drying it is almost impossible to achieve moisture content below 25%. Good luck building your eco-home with native Irish timber you have to kiln dry it if you want to house to last a lifetime. Irish softwood timber is not very good quality compared with that sourced from Sweden, Russia or Canada.
In 2017, the World Bank released a little-noticed report that offered the first comprehensive look at this question. It models the increase in material extraction that would be required to build enough solar and wind utilities to produce an annual output of about 7 terawatts of electricity by 2050. That’s enough to power roughly half of the global economy. By doubling the World Bank figures, we can estimate what it will take to get all the way to zero emissions—and the results are staggering: 34 million metric tons of copper, 40 million tons of lead, 50 million tons of zinc, 162 million tons of aluminum, and no less than 4.8 billion tons of iron. In some cases, the transition to renewables will require a massive increase over existing levels of extraction. For neodymium—an essential element in wind turbines—extraction will need to rise by nearly 35 percent over current levels. Higher-end estimates reported by the World Bank suggest it could double. The same is true of silver, which is critical to solar panels. Silver extraction will go up 38 percent and perhaps as much as 105 percent. Demand for indium, also essential to solar technology, will more than triple and could end up skyrocketing by 920 percent. And then there are all the batteries we’re going to need for power storage. To keep energy flowing when the sun isn’t shining and the wind isn’t blowing will require enormous batteries at the grid level. This means 40 million tons of lithium—an eye-watering 2,700 percent increase over current levels of extraction. That’s just for electricity. We also need to think about vehicles. This year, a group of leading British scientists submitted a letter to the U.K. Committee on Climate Change outlining their concerns about the ecological impact of electric cars. They agree, of course, that we need to end the sale and use of combustion engines. But they pointed out that unless consumption habits change, replacing the world’s projected fleet of 2 billion vehicles is going to require an explosive increase in mining: Global annual extraction of neodymium and dysprosium will go up by another 70 percent, annual extraction of copper will need to more than double, and cobalt will need to increase by a factor of almost four—all for the entire period from now to 2050. The problem here is not that we’re going to run out of key minerals—although that may indeed become a concern. The real issue is that this will exacerbate an already existing crisis of overextraction. Mining has become one of the biggest single drivers of deforestation, ecosystem collapse, and biodiversity loss around the world. Ecologists estimate that even at present rates of global material use, we are overshooting sustainable levels by 82 percent.source
European standards for structural timber also specify an upper limit of 20% moisture content for ’dry graded‘ timber in order for it to receive a defined strength grading. Drier timber also provides a more receptive substrate for gluing and is lighter to transport. Timber's durability and environmental resistance can be further enhanced by thermal and chemical treatments ... There are many methods of removing moisture from timber including air, solvent, microwave and supercritical CO2 drying, but the most common in the sawn softwood industry is convective or condensing kiln drying. Convective drying, although enalthough energy and equipment intensive, offers the most accelerated means of drying dimensional timber for market. The ‘kiln’ is defined as an enclosed structure, typically 30–100 m3, that provides controlled heating, air circulation, humidification and ventilation. Heating is achieved by indirect (steam, hot water, thermal liquid, electricity) or direct means (gas/oil burner). It is common for convective kilns to enclose overhead or side fans that circulate warm or dehumidified air through and around an open stack of sawn timber. Equipment factors which can affect efficiency of softwood drying include standards of kiln thermal insulation and the modulation of fan speed speeds during different stages of the drying cycle.
KyussB wrote: » You can air-dry wood, with no added carbon release/cost, and if in a rush you can also renewably power kiln-dryed wood - zero carbon cost.
batgoat wrote: » Plenty do, you pretty clearly made no effort to differentiate it from something that you wrote. Also it's not a great sign when you're sourcing from a libertarian think tank that infamously opposes child labour laws.
Blueshoe wrote: » Answer I didn't pass it off as something I wrote. I said I googled it. Who the f is going to bother writing that much for a boards post
batgoat wrote: » Question, why did you just try to pass that off as something that you wrote?https://mises.org/wire/4-reasons-why-socialism-fails
Blueshoe wrote: » I googled it while having a poo. Socialism is poo Socialism fails because it suffers from four fundamental design defects.
KyussB wrote: » EV = Electric Vehicle - i.e. electrically powered industrial vehicle, like a lumber truck...This is an EV:https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/all-hail-edumper-largest-ev-worldDon't be so wilfully thick.
kyussB wrote: Soil disturbance and tree offcuts...that amounts to **** all carbon, and overall still amounts to likely 90+% of the carbon sequestered from the atmosphere, staying sequestered.
Trees and woodlands play an important role in the removal of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere. Through the biochemical process of photosynthesis carbon dioxide is taken in by trees and stored as carbon in the trunk, branches, leaves and roots. Carbon is also stored in the soil and indeed this is a major sink for carbon in the forest. Decay of the organic material eventually releases the CO2 back to the atmosphere
jackboy wrote: » Neither do you. Looking for 0% emissions in 12 years is an extreme position.
gozunda wrote: » Could you stop for once peppering your rants with expletives like "shit". It makes your comments at best unreadable. You what lol? A script? All from that from my personal knowledge of forestry and timber production. If you dont like facts - then tough. If you are in doubt - please show from where my 'script' is derived. Your the one who brought up the bs of using EVs to transport timber - no one else. I showed how your suggestion was pure imagination. Perhaps you are imagining you could stick a tree in a Nissan Leaf or similar Again you know veryblittle about timber production. Construction grade timber is nearly all kiln dried. Check your local building Mechant if you dont believe anyone. All the unusable material removed from felled trees can accounts up to between 30 - 50 of a tree by volume. Again carbon is lost at all stages of timber processing
KyussB wrote: » You don't speak for most people, let alone the majority of scientists.
jackboy wrote: » Most of us do not want to get to 0% in 12 years. Only a small number of people want this and almost no scientists.
KyussB wrote: » The thing that most exposes you as regurgitating a script here, is that you ignore how my fairly succinct post says to use EV transportation powered by renewable sources - in order to shit out a scenario that reverts back to fossil fuel based transport, in order to re-inflate the perception of its carbon cost. You can air-dry wood, with no added carbon release/cost, and if in a rush you can also renewably power kiln-dryed wood - zero carbon cost. Soil disturbance and tree offcuts...that amounts to fuck all carbon, and overall still amounts to likely 90+% of the carbon sequestered from the atmosphere, staying sequestered. It's immensely carbon-negative, done right.
There are many methods of removing moisture from timber including air, solvent, microwave and supercritical CO2 drying, but the most common in the sawn softwood industry is convective or condensing kiln drying. Convective drying, although energy and equipment intensive, offers the most accelerated means of drying dimensional timber for market. The ‘kiln’ is defined as an enclosed structure, typically 30–100 m3, that provides controlled heating, air circulation, humidification and ventilation. Heating is achieved by indirect (steam, hot water, thermal liquid, electricity) or direct means (gas/oil burner). It is common for convective kilns to enclose overhead or side fans that circulate warm or dehumidified air through and around an open stack of sawn timber. Equipment factors which can affect efficiency of softwood drying include standards of kiln thermal insulation and the modulation of fan speed speeds during different stages of the drying cycle.
KyussB wrote: » It took almost 20 years to drop from 100% to 80%, and we want to get to 0% in 11-12 years (then further shift into -x% thereafter) - that's far off the mark.
Blueshoe wrote: » We are doing just finehttps://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Greenhouse_gas_emission_statistics
Thelonious Monk wrote: » Why are people talking about socialism like it's a bad thing?
KyussB wrote: » No. We can eliminate emissions without needing to tax the fuck out of ourselves.
weldoninhio wrote: » But if we figure out climate change isn’t man made, and we only have 10/11 years according to St Greta, would we have to be taxed to the hilt in the short term to get the GND fantasy up and not running??
gozunda wrote: » You don't seem to know very much about commercial forestry, harvesting, transport or kiln drying in the manufacture of building grade and other timber and I don't mean that in a critical sense tbh. Either we plant trees to sequester carbon and leave then there or we cut them down and significant amounts of the carbon gets released back into the atmosphere. How does this happen? It's fairly simple tbh. Trees absorb CO2 to make tissue and turn the gas into root and branch, leaf and bark, trunk and fruit / seed. When trees are felled - all the branches and leaves and bark and roots are all stripped away and either burnt or start to decay releasing huge amounts of carbon back into the atmosphere. Transport and timber processing including kiln drying (using further energy) accelerates this process even further. The thing is - it's not even just the trees being cut - the removal of the forest cover during harvesting operations disturbs the surrounding soil and further contributes to the realease of even more carbon and from other ground vegetation. New trees have to be replanted - with more soil and ground cover disturbances. But the main problem is that it takes years for those trees to build up large stores of carbon which was released by the trees which were harvested. And so on it goes. The whole process of timber processing is neither carbon carbon neutral nor carbon 'negative'. The other big hole in this - is that transport including lorries are practically exclusively fossil fuel based due to the huge amounts of enegy required for haulage and the distances covered. Now there are some limited opportunities for transport by train or by floating down large waterways - but both of those are extremely restricted by reason of logistical issues. So in a zero carbon world large scale house building is fuked. It simply won't happen. I suppose we could live in wattle and daub huts like people in Ireland did in early times or even mud walled cabins common up to the last century. We're certainly not going to be living in what we accept as modern housing for sure. Cant wait tbh...
Pa ElGrande wrote: » The totalitarian socialists who use climate change hysteria to try and scare the population into acquiescing to totalitarian socialism (in other words the "Green New Deal") are deeply concerned about the contributions of cow farts to the greenhouse effect and global warming. That’s why various assorted NGOs like An Taisce are waging a war on beef. Lo and behold, a Swedish "behavioural scientist" has apparently discovered the answer to their dilemma: cannibalism i.e. replacing beef with cooked-up “meat” from dead bodies.Swedish Scientist Proposes Cannibalism to Fight Climate Change...
Swedish behavioural scientist Magnus Söderlund has suggested that eating other people after they die could be a means of combatting climate change. The scientist mentioned the possibility of cannibalism during a broadcast on Swedish television channel TV4 this week about a fair in Stockholm regarding “food of the future”. Söderlund is set to hold seminars at the event, entitled “Gastro Summit — about the future of food” where he intends to discuss the possibility of eating people in the name of cutting down greenhouse emissions. According to his research, the main problem with the idea is the widespread taboo of eating human flesh and said that conservative attitudes could make it hard to convince Swedes at large to take up the practice of cannibalism.source
Thelonious Monk wrote: » Yes but they're not the ones destroying and consuming everything, rich people are, the ones having less kids!
Blueshoe wrote: » We are barely at replacement rate in Ireland. Parts of Europe are below. Other parts of the world though. They pop them out for sport .
99problems1 wrote: » How about we all give up having more than one kid? Then we can all enjoy life as much as we can without more taxes burdening us on this short time on the planet.
KyussB wrote: » You don't understand how government finances work. The macroeconomics of GND style policies provide plentiful work and earnings for everyone, without requiring a massive tax burden on people.
