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How to get some self respect

LegacyUser

I'm looking for a bit of advice on how to get some self respect with a guy. Who I desperately fancy and who is using words of not interested and actions (not sexual) of someone who is. Also early 40s here, just inexperienced.

I've known him many many years we got together while on holidays last summer and a few times after that but since Christmas we've been "just friends". But not, we spent the summer together (both off), where except for the sleeping together (because he doesn't want a relationship), we were/are practically in relationship including planning for future things.

I brought it to a head and he again used the words. I'm not interested. Great, so now I know for sure. But he's almost straight back to where we were. Caring messages, phone calls for hours, inviting me to dinner etc. He's hiding behind, they are just actions of a friend, however he knows how I feel and all my friends have validated his actions are not those of just a friend.

It feels nice, really nice, but it's not healthy. I guess I'm being used for attention. (Yes I get I've been using him for that too but I want more and that's not on offer).

So.... please don't say. Just stop. The added problem is he is a family friend. I will forever see him, I want to remain civil if not friendly to him. I enjoy his company, we clearly get on, I'd just like to dial it down a little.

I've tried creating a bit of distance but I'm still getting messages and calls. If I don't respond I feel rude.

I can't change him but I can change my reaction and interaction.

So what do I do. How do I with my interactions with him create some boundaries?

I'd still like to go to dinner, but maybe every few months not once a week. I'd still like to chat every month or so, not twice a week.

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rainbowtrout

Lostinlove wrote: »

I don't understand how there can be no other endgame. I almost jest, cause it's almost like a bad movie, but you do see stories of things working out with odd and strange beginnings. Is it just cause it's so rare that the hurt is the only end game?

Because you would like to believe that this is a fairytale or Hollywood ending and he will see the error of his ways and declare undying love for you and now sees how short sighted in missing that the love of his life was in front of him all the time??? Nope, not gonna happen. It's played out exactly as everyone predicted. No one can tell you to accept it and move on, you have to be willing to do it as well.

Mind Hunter 85

Hi

Op I identify with a lot about what you're saying. You question why he tries so hard to keep in contact with you. Maybe that deep down he values you. Sadly he doesn't. I had a similar situation like another poster pointed out. He may be lost , he may be struggling in some ways in life, he may not know what he wants but he knows it's not you.
I'm guessing you can't see that as you are in what I call 'the deep' you're emotionally invested. You won't see clearly until you go 'no contact' with him for months in my opinion.

In my own case, 2 months of no contact with a guy who didnt want a relationship but I had allowed myself to be used for nearly a year and a half. I thought he must feel something deep down but I was kidding myself.
I projected how I felt onto him.

There are three things that can happen

1. you and he continue the 'arrangement' the way things are defined by HIS wants and needs and that might go on for many more months or years or maybe indefinetely, no one knows.
But you won't get what you want a relationship and to be valued the way you value and care for him.

2. He eventually tires of you or finds someone new and he leaves you dumped except you haven't been dumped as you werent in a 'relationship' thats cold I know but its a strong possiblity.

3. You realise that you deserve better and walk away, you're already realising this but you doubt, as you don't want to let go of hope. Hope is precious its also painful.

I had to let go of hope to disconnect, no signs, physical affection or emotional connection in the moment mean that he secretly he wants to be with you.

Whether it's an intentional game or not doesn't matter.
If he 'knew' that he also felt something could happen with you in the future he would have told you.
The excuses such as 'I dont want to be in a relationship now' may be true,
but they keep things where they are, as in comfortable for him,as you think it's not you thats the issue, it's him and there is a tiny glimmer of HOPE .

He get's you without the commitment and this means in his heart he knows you're not someone he would consider spending his life with or investing in a relationship.

Blow out the candle on this hope for what could be.
It will be painful, in my case a lot of tears and they still come and go, but it will set you free.
When you let go, I guarantee you will feel better after a few months you will have taken back the power and hold he has over you and your life, hopes and dreams.
Maybe he didnt ask for it but by giving it still exists.

leggo

Lostinlove wrote: »

I don't understand how there can be no other endgame. I almost jest, cause it's almost like a bad movie, but you do see stories of things working out with odd and strange beginnings. Is it just cause it's so rare that the hurt is the only end game?

The reason it’s the only endgame in play is because he’s telling you all this, you’re just choosing not to listen in favour of what you want to happen.

punisher5112

Op
You are well worth more then this....

What a fool to let you go but he had a long time ago the way he treated you

Move on and go after someone that's looking for the same thing....

There really is plenty out therej.

qwerty13

I’m sorry, but he is in his backside as lost as you are.

He might not know what he wants, but he knows it’s not you, and will never be you. He’s told you that up front and repeatedly. I know I’m pointing out harsh reality, but bloody hell OP, do you need him to physically stamp on your heart before you believe what he has told you umpteen times?

You’re a handy friend who panders to him. The ‘girlfriend experience’ while he rejects you constantly, and you give him the friendship / listening / relationship space in your life.

He is behaving like a selfish plonker, but god you are so enabling him.

LegacyUser

leggo wrote: »

There’s no other endgame in-play here. Be careful.

I don't understand how there can be no other endgame. I almost jest, cause it's almost like a bad movie, but you do see stories of things working out with odd and strange beginnings. Is it just cause it's so rare that the hurt is the only end game?

LegacyUser

leggo wrote: »

OP you’ve seen the scenario that was described to you play out exactly as it was described it would. Keep in mind that was spelled out under the presumption that he’s not that into you and is just using you as a game/easy bit of attention on-demand.

So I’m going to fast forward a good bit to how this story ends if you don’t take control of it today:

He leaves you, out of nowhere, maybe ghosts you completely because he doesn’t respect you or think that much about you. Then you find out he’s with someone else and all of the “I don’t want anyone” scraps he was feeding you were lies to keep you hooked and thinking you could change him. And you’ve no recourse because he’s got what he wanted and now is done with you completely. There’s no more games to be played because he wants nothing from you anymore so it’s just you left, alone, having done nothing to deserve it but only watching as he goes and lives the life you wanted with him with someone else. Whether he deserves that or not is irrelevant, you find out life doesn’t work that way and will scream at yourself for not acting now when you had a measure of control over the situation.

It’s not flattering but it might open your eyes: years back my friends and I used to call girls who did that “**** me til you love me” girls. It’s a tale old as time and it ends with you getting seriously hurt. There’s no other endgame in-play here. Be careful.

I'd make one change to that story. I really believe he doesn't want anyone right now. I believe that is how he really feels. The story ends :

He leaves you, out of nowhere, you'll have one conversation where he dominates the conversation, gives a list of reasons including "but I've always told you". Then you find out he’s with someone else and all of the “I don’t want anyone” where what he was telling you because you weren't his one, and he didn't feel what he needed with you to make himself available. And you’ve no recourse because he’s got what he wanted and now is done with you completely. There’s no more games to be played because he wants nothing from you anymore so it’s just you left, alone, having done nothing to deserve it but only watching as he goes and lives the life you wanted with him with someone else. Whether he deserves that or not is irrelevant, you find out life doesn’t work that way and will scream at yourself for not acting now when you had a measure of control over the situation.

@bitofabind you've hit the nail on the head

Thank you all for reminding me. For being gentle with me. I KNOW but I don't want to. I really do believe that he's as lost as what I am. I really don't believe this is an intentional game but I know that doesn't change the advice nor the outcome.

Scarinae

Lostinlove wrote: »

Cons
1. he's just upped the game cause he can feel me pulling away
2. He used words again, "I'm not interested in being with anyone. I'm content on my own."

Listen to what he is telling you OP, he is telling you that you will never have a relationship with him.

You deserve someone who really wants to be with you!

rainbowtrout

Lostinlove wrote: »

Cons
1. he's just upped the game cause he can feel me pulling away
2. He used words again, "I'm not interested in being with anyone. I'm content on my own."

I'm going to continue communication on my terms. I will be in his presence again in 3 weeks for the weekend (in my house, so I can't not go). So I'll give it til mid October for him to be honest.

Just an addition. He told you exactly what he wants. He doesn't want you.

And he has been honest, he's been honest all along, only you are not listening. They say insanity is repeating the same action over and over again and expecting different results. He will not change. Why wait until mid October, you're just giving yourself another 5 weeks of him dangling a carrot that you can never reach, when October comes, you will come up with another excuse to give him another chance. Meanwhile he will be delighted with himself that he can treat you like absolute shite and you keep coming back for more.

leggo

OP you’ve seen the scenario that was described to you play out exactly as it was described it would. Keep in mind that was spelled out under the presumption that he’s not that into you and is just using you as a game/easy bit of attention on-demand.

So I’m going to fast forward a good bit to how this story ends if you don’t take control of it today:

He leaves you, out of nowhere, maybe ghosts you completely because he doesn’t respect you or think that much about you. Then you find out he’s with someone else and all of the “I don’t want anyone” scraps he was feeding you were lies to keep you hooked and thinking you could change him. And you’ve no recourse because he’s got what he wanted and now is done with you completely. There’s no more games to be played because he wants nothing from you anymore so it’s just you left, alone, having done nothing to deserve it but only watching as he goes and lives the life you wanted with him with someone else. Whether he deserves that or not is irrelevant, you find out life doesn’t work that way and will scream at yourself for not acting now when you had a measure of control over the situation.

It’s not flattering but it might open your eyes: years back my friends and I used to call girls who did that “**** me til you love me” girls. It’s a tale old as time and it ends with you getting seriously hurt. There’s no other endgame in-play here. Be careful.

bitofabind

im tempted to say, OP stop being such a bloody eejit. But i can empathise with how hard this is.

So i'll ask two questions:
1. Have you been in a healthy committed long-term relationship before?
2. What is it that you actually want from a partner?

On 1, you say you're inexperienced so i'm thinking that's playing into this. Maybe you're operating out of a scarcity mindset, where you;'ve been single so long and this guy finally represents what you've always wanted, you've never felt this way before etc etc.
If you'd had a committed relationship before you'd probably recognise that this is absolutely not and never going to be one. This man can't give you what you need. Relationships involve SO MUCH MORE than chemistry and a connection. They require commitment, emotional availability, compatibility on values and what you both want. Both parties are required to be sufficiently interested in one another. All of those ingredients are vital to building a partnership with someone and he's lacking on most fronts. That's not going to change. He is who he is and you've let him away with it for long enough already.

2. Your wants and needs DO matter, op. maybe you're not used to verbalising them. it's really hard to verbalise them when you feel a deep attraction for someone you've known for years and you know they can't give you what you want. verbalising what you want and creating healthy boundaries means no longer having this person in your life, and that's not what you want.
but it's what you need. it really is. you've emotionally invested in this person and you can't get any of the things you want from any other man as long as it remains this way. you certainly will not get it from him.

Be brave and be honest with yourself. the world won't implode if this little frustrating dalliance you've been having comes to an end. it'll hurt for a while, you'll feel lonely and empty and sad and obsessed over him, but you'll get over that. you'll be one step closer to recognising your own needs and creating healthier relationships, which is the bigger picture stuff you need to focus on.

you're worth more than this.

Sittingpretty

If people keep showing you what they are, believe them.

He sounds like a total head Fvck.

And as someone else mentioned he's keeping you from any other opportunities to meet someone who is available.

miamee

I agree with everything rainnbowtrout has posted - you are waiting for him to be honest but he has already told you very plainly that he's not interested in a relationship with you. Believe him. You are not waiting for him to be honest, you are waiting for him to change his mind and it doesn't seem very likely that that will happen. It sucks but pulling back and not being in his company for a few weeks/months if possible will really do you the world of good and give you some perspective.

rainbowtrout

It’s Option A, it’s never Option B. He’s copped that you have sussed him. So he’s upped his game to reel you in and keep you dangling. He’s a nasty piece of work but it’s worked. You’re going to give him another chance. Once he senses things are back to normal he will be back to his normal self.

Pros
1. I know he's slow to make decisions. Painfully so. He also reiterated this a number of times today. I won't lie I'm hoping, this feels like his coming to the conclusion I want
2. This weekend felt real. I felt his heart open from the moment he walked in the door
3. He used a phrase half way through the weekend that was vague as hell but was almost the exact opposite of the phrasing of the words he'd used to say no a few weeks ago when I brought it to a head. It felt like a yes, but it was so vague

Yes everything is deliberately vague to keep you dangling. And if you dare challenge him on his words in a few weeks time, when you feel like crap about all this he will say 'I never said that, you misunderstood me' and it will be pushed back on you for being your fault, and you will forgive him because you don't want to lose him and he will say just enough to imply that you will if you don't accept things on his terms.

Unfortunately you will be back here in a few weeks, nothing will have changed and you will be looking for new advice which won’t be different from what you were given already. And communication is not on your terms, it's on his terms, you think it's on your terms. If it was truly on your terms, there would be no communication.

LegacyUser

leggo wrote: »

. Then re-frame your actions towards him with this in mind. Keep in mind, if you let it it’ll likely kickstart a battle back-and-forth where he’ll promise you whatever you want short-term to keep you there, but that solution WILL be temporary and you’ll find yourself back in the same spot if you go with it.

So cut ties, block him if you have to, don’t worry too much about the family friend situation (if you’re ever together at a function you can just ignore him and chat to others) and move on. For as bad as you may feel accepting this, when you act on it you’ll feel really good and strong on the other side.

I had already started pulling back before I posted and really took on board everything that's been said. I'd reframed my thinking, I either wasn't responding or responding on my terms. It felt great.

I was not expecting that me pulling back would cause him to rush in as much as he has and immediately start that battle you described.

I was in his company this weekend, it was wonderful, I won't lie, I got all the attention, it was different though. It felt very real and very caring. It was super charged though and it ended with him trying to kiss me when he left. I pulled away. (No drink involved)

Everything that felt good is gone though. I'm angry and upset.

I knew reading back would help and what you said stuck in my mind. He will do anything to keep me there.

Pros
1. I know he's slow to make decisions. Painfully so. He also reiterated this a number of times today. I won't lie I'm hoping, this feels like his coming to the conclusion I want

2. This weekend felt real. I felt his heart open from the moment he walked in the door
3. He used a phrase half way through the weekend that was vague as hell but was almost the exact opposite of the phrasing of the words he'd used to say no a few weeks ago when I brought it to a head. It felt like a yes, but it was so vague

Cons
1. he's just upped the game cause he can feel me pulling away
2. He used words again, "I'm not interested in being with anyone. I'm content on my own."

While he was saying this I was screeching to myself " you're not alone, I'm the mug supporting and filling that hole, " he probably feels content cause he's got a fake girlfriend in me.

So if I'm objective.
Option A. It's more of the same behaviour but with the kickstart battle as suggested would happen. What a duck
Option B he is changing his mind and coming to the realisation that I'm wonderful and I am the girl for him *swoon*.

Well why are his words and actions still mixed? Why is he not being honest with me and/or himself. What a duck

Conclusion:. What a duck

But I still want to give option B a chance.

I'm going to continue communication on my terms. I will be in his presence again in 3 weeks for the weekend (in my house, so I can't not go). So I'll give it til mid October for him to be honest.

There's self esteem issues here too. I can recognise this. I'm going to use this time to start addressing them too.

lainey_d_123

Daisy78 wrote: »

This is what your situation boils down to, you are keeping your heart closed to other men who will want something more. This guy is denying you that opportunity. What use is breadcrumbs when you really want the whole cake?!

We’ve all been there, held out for someone hoping that something will change, either their heart or circumstances or whatever. You should be angry over his behavior towards you. The truth is he would drop contact in the morning if he met a woman he really wanted, why would you tolerate that. The only way to deal with this is to cut all contact, no response to text messages, phone calls, etc. Forget about appearing rude, he deserves nothing less at this stage. Resist the temptation to respond, even if it is to say you are taking a step back. That is still communication and he will see it as a green light to keep texting you. You need to find something or someone else (even platonically) to occupy your time, so you don’t give this loser space in your head. He will stop eventually but you need to set the tone and that means a break in contact.

This is really the main thing. The guy I was seeing had all sorts of excuses and reasons as to why he couldn't just call me his girlfriend. He kept using my anxiety and stress as one of the reasons, when the main cause of my anxiety and stress was having such an insecure, unstable 'relationship'. He berated me for wanting 'more and more' from him for asking things like when I'd ever meet his friends and family after nearly a year of dating and several years of knowing each other. I don't know if these people do this on purpose or they really are so arrogant and selfish that they genuinely believe their own bull**** and feel no guilt about wasting months on end of someone's life while they're getting their own needs met.

My situation resolved itself when he met someone else (and dumped me right in the middle of a personal crisis) and suddenly....he had no problem being the official boyfriend of a beautiful 23-year-old Russian (he's 38), introducing her to his family and putting photos of them together on Instagram. No problem paying for her to go on holiday with him. And he has no idea why I'm so furious and have stopped talking to him. He thinks I'm petty and should be happy for him. I don't know if it's narcissism or sociopathy or what but there seems to be no shortage of this type around.

Daisy78

Poolin wrote: »

He is stopping you from meeting someone else.
Just think this time next year you could be in a relationship with a man and madly in love and happy and making plans for the future.

He's wasted enough of your time don't let him waste anymore.

This is what your situation boils down to, you are keeping your heart closed to other men who will want something more. This guy is denying you that opportunity. What use is breadcrumbs when you really want the whole cake?!

We’ve all been there, held out for someone hoping that something will change, either their heart or circumstances or whatever. You should be angry over his behavior towards you. The truth is he would drop contact in the morning if he met a woman he really wanted, why would you tolerate that. The only way to deal with this is to cut all contact, no response to text messages, phone calls, etc. Forget about appearing rude, he deserves nothing less at this stage. Resist the temptation to respond, even if it is to say you are taking a step back. That is still communication and he will see it as a green light to keep texting you. You need to find something or someone else (even platonically) to occupy your time, so you don’t give this loser space in your head. He will stop eventually but you need to set the tone and that means a break in contact.

banoffe2

This guy sounds selfish, he wants all the benefits with no investment, start today by working on your self worth, its become an unhealthy habit that you need to work breaking, he sounds as if he isnt a good listener
Listen to yourself and every day you can say no to him you are winning and working on your self worth, edit his mobile to "Time waster" !!

leggo

How do you respect yourself? By being angry!

You’ve told this person how you feel, they’ve told you they’re not interested. You’ve asked for boundaries to respect this, they haven’t been respected but you’ve carried on anyway because you hope things will change somewhere down the line. This lad isn’t oblivious to all this, he didn’t just forget you have feelings for him trust me. He knows this and is carrying on with this for as long as you let him get away with it BECAUSE you have feelings for him. In other words he’s taking advantage of you. This isn’t a friend, friends care for each other and this guy doesn’t care a single bit for your struggles here.

I know that might be a bitter pill to swallow, but by posting here with that thread title you’re on the cusp of accepting it and need to hear it spelled out. So accept and process it. If it hurts and makes you sad, that’s alright, let that out. Then re-frame your actions towards him with this in mind. Keep in mind, if you let it it’ll likely kickstart a battle back-and-forth where he’ll promise you whatever you want short-term to keep you there, but that solution WILL be temporary and you’ll find yourself back in the same spot if you go with it. So cut ties, block him if you have to, don’t worry too much about the family friend situation (if you’re ever together at a function you can just ignore him and chat to others) and move on. For as bad as you may feel accepting this, when you act on it you’ll feel really good and strong on the other side.

It’s also worth asking yourself why you allowed this and being honest. Was it loneliness? Thinking he was the best you could get? That you didn’t deserve better treatment? I’m not asking you to answer here, just with yourself. But the same formula applies to this stage too: view the situation for what it is, accept the harsh truth (whatever it is), then take steps to fix that and you’ll feel great. It really is both that simple and that difficult. And once you get in the habit of being blunt with yourself and acting on it, you can just apply it to any situation and the pills you swallow aren’t even that bitter anymore because you know it leads to good things happening on the other side.

screamer

Seems like a case of not buying a cow when the milk is free. Stop giving him the physical side of things, he’s only interested in that.
Be honest tell him you’re actually looking for something for the long haul and as he’s not interested in that, you’re not interested in what he’s offering either. It’s not about self respect it’s about good life choices. Every day you waste with him is a day you could be happy with someone else. Time on this earth is precious don’t waste it on this guy.

Ursus Horribilis

So why are you afraid of never hearing from him again? It wouldn't be because you're hoping that he'll change his mind and realise the love of his life has been right under his nose all this time? I bet your heart skips a beat every time a text or call comes in from him.

He has told you that he's not interested. From his point of view, that's all he needs to do. If you're choosing to continue seeing him/having sex wit him, you're doing so with your eyes open. It's disingenuous of him to continue using you, knowing that you want more. But you are a willing participant in this.

It's time to accept that (a) there is no hope of a relationship with this man and (b) you cannot be friends with him. Maybe in the future you might be able to be friends again but that is not something for now.

rainbowtrout

Lostinlove wrote: »

If I asked him not to contact me, I'd never hear from him again. So, the blocker is I don't want to.

I don't think there's any middle ground here. If you continue to stay in (voluntary) contact, this situation will remain the exact same. If he wanted you as more than a friend it would have happened by now. If you continue to maintain contact of any type, you will examine every interaction and look for evidence that he might change his mind. He won't.

You said earlier that you have mutual friends, so it's not like you won't ever see him again, but it will be on more formal terms. He won't give you what you want.

beauf

You have to burn the bridges with this person. A clean break. No going back. Instead of falling back to the comfortable, you need a new adventure.

beauf

You are disrespecting yourself by keeping this going.

You need to end this chapter and cut all ties with this person. Only by doing this can you start the next chapter of your life. You've only one life you need to fill it doing the things you want to do.

Calypso Realm

JanisIain wrote: »

After a massive reality check one night with a good friend I made a conscious decision to not respond and even after a week I felt totally different, I felt like I'd taken the power back!

This exactly. I was going to suggest something similar.

In fact, OP I wouldn't bother 'announcing' my departure at all but just gradually fade away. If he questions your 'unavailability' I would just say you've been very busy, been away etc. Say nothing about the real reasons which involve him.

I can guarantee you'll feel sooo much better and he will respect you more. When someone says they're not interested, it is always better to walk away. If they have second thoughts, then it's a different matter and you can take it from there. BUT hanging around in the vain hope someone will change their minds (and they never do, trust me) is always futile!

joeguevara

Ok you realise that it is hurting you being in the current situation. Think if it this way....if someone was being horrible to you and it was bringing you down would you allow it to continue. Of course not. The only difference is instead of being horrible he is appearing to be nice. Still hurting you.

Now if you still want to be friends. Firstly you have to accept that it isnt going to develiop. Dont second guess wverybtouch, friendly hug, long phonecall. And will you be ok if he starts seeing someone else?

Why put yourself through all that? Friendships arent supposed to be difficult.

Anna2834

JanisIain put it very well, take back the power, don't allow him to control you. Put yourself first.

You will be so much better off without him and you will allow yourself to meet someone more suitable...it might take some time but you will thank yourself later.

I met my now fiancee 6 months later.

I do have one small regret though, I should have done it sooner and not be so nice about it.

JanisIain

This happened to me quite recently. It spanned on and off over 15 years! (We first met as teenagers) I've always been crazy about her

After a massive reality check one night with a good friend I made a conscious decision to not respond and even after a week I felt totally different, I felt like I'd taken the power back!

She is a total narcissist who has ignored me in the past when I was eager but saw her last week and she was really friendly and wanting to engage. I know she was missing the attention I gave her. It felt good and I dont regret a thing.

Take the power back!

LegacyUser

Thank you so much all for your kind words.

They are really helpful.
If I asked him not to contact me, I'd never hear from him again. So, the blocker is I don't want to.

However what you have all said here rings very true. I need to and must for my own sanity.
It'll be very helpful to come back and read over these comments when my resolve is not as strong.

Anna2834

I didn't realize there are so many of them out there....something similar happened to me about 5 years ago...it went on for about 1.5 years until I had the courage to put an end to it - by text. He is married now, goes to show he just wasn't that into me after all.

He is just looking for an ego boost (narcissist) from you and for as long as you provide that to him he will want you around, until he actually meets someone he does want to be with and he will drop you so fast you won't know what happened.

So please do this for your own dignity/self respect/mental health etc - break contact with this person gently and if you do happen to see him around a "hello/acknowledgment nod" will do just fine.

Trust me, I know all too well how hard it is. Good luck OP.