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Now ye're talking - to a teacher in Dubai

Boards.ie: Niamh

Our next guest is an Irish teacher currently working in Dubai in the United Arab Emirates (UAE). She is here to answer questions about teaching in the UAE and the differences between teaching there and in Ireland.
Given that moving to the Middle East for a few years is something a number of Irish people do in various careers, I'm sure there will be lots of questions.

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I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Mistynight wrote: »

Interesting thread. Thanks for taking the time.
Two quesions:

Would adding a second subject make it easier to find realistic hours at home?

Do you notice the vast inequality in Dubai or is it something that is evident? It’s always put me off the idea of travelling/working there.

Like others have said, the salary seems lower than I would have expected. But it makes sense given the number of teachers heading over annually. Having accommodation taken care of is definitely a huge perk.

Hi, no problem!

It would really depend on the subject, and the part of the country. I have looked into adding another subject, but I can't get a straight answer from the Teaching Council about the modules I'd need to complete (despite multiple emails), and I couldn't take the chance on picking modules on Open University, only to be told by the Teaching Council that they're not going to accept it. It would cost a few grand to add a second subject, and I couldn't commit to that kind of money without having a module list from the Teaching Council in writing.
Funnily enough, my degree used to have an option to take on a second subject, but they took that option away after I was already a good way through my degree. Accordingly to the head of my degree, the Teaching Council told them that "Music teachers didn't need a second subject, because we'd easily get full-time hours if we included all the choirs, concerts and musicals" we also do. The Teaching Council refused to hear otherwise, even though their statement was absolute bull!

In terms of inequality, the rich are very rich over here, and you can see that with some of the shops and yachts that you can see.
There's no homelessness in Dubai - if you don't have a job, or a means to support yourself, you're repatriated back to your country of origin.
Personally I don't think it's that obvious in Dubai, but I tend to stay within my own expat groups, so I'm with people in the same income bracket as me, if that makes sense?
Salaries are higher in "premium" schools. My school is cheaper. The inclusion of accommodation in my package is definitely a huge perk.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

I'm not a teacher but have been involved in school admin so I'll answer on that basis.

Yes it would make it much easier to get hours. Music is one of the worst single subjects to have.

An Irish school that has one class of music for each year group maxes at 13 or 14 hours for a music teacher.

Thats not a full time job. There are very few Irish schools that would have multiple music classes in a year group.

There's massive demands for maths, sciences and languages but massive oversupply for music and some other subjects.

Off the top of my head I will refer to a large Irish secondary school that has 2 teachers who teach music. Both have another subject they use that gives most of their hours. There is another teacher employed by the school that is qualified to teach music but doesn't have any music hours.

I've already responded to a bit of this in my previous post, so please see above.
Yes, it is very difficult to get full time hours with only Music in Ireland, but not impossible. Usually you need to go to a private school to get full hours, although there are some public schools that would have full time hours for music. Unfortunately I also happen to know a lot of the teachers that have those jobs, so I also know that those jobs are unlikely to ever be honestly advertised.
There's the arguement that there's two types of Musicians - the analytical and maths-y ones, and the more linguistic and literary ones. I'm the latter, and I would never inflict myself on a maths or science class.
Music teachers usually get given CSPE and/or SPHE to boost their hours.
I find it interesting that the only place I seem to have an issue with getting any sort of decent hours is in Ireland though. I've walked straight into full-time jobs in Music teaching once I've left the country!

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

vriesmays wrote: »

That's not even the average wage in Ireland. She could have stayed and got a better job in a different area but those who can do while those who can't teach.

I make it a personal policy to not feed the trolls.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

As far as I'm aware English and History are two of the most oversubscribed. Can be very difficult getting work with them.

English and History are massively oversubscribed.
They're (unfortunately), also the two subjects I'd be most interested in adding to my original degree.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

Yeah I think Irish in particular and all the other languages are in big demand. But I think if the terms (eg lack of hours and lack of permanent position) aren't good enough teachers will keep going to the Middle East.

The one thing I can say I've noticed in Dubai, is that Irish teachers are everywhere - teaching Primary, Secondary Maths, Science, MFL, English, History, Geography, Business, Art, Music etc. We haven't all just moved over with the same subject, we're collectively teaching all of the subjects, and the one thing that keeps coming up, from everyone, is the lack of hours, jobs, and job security back home.
If sustainable long term employment, that's going to give us a decent standard of living, isn't achievable at home, then we have two situations.
We either:
1: Leave teaching altogether, and find a different type of employment in Ireland,
Or
2: Take our teaching degrees somewhere that will give us the hours, even if it does mean breaking our loved ones hearts (and our own) every time we have to go back to the airport to leave home again.
Most teachers I know have wanted to be teachers for years, and have done between 4-6 years worth of degrees to get there. By the time we're qualified, we've been studying nearly as long as it takes to get medical degree!
I've known that I wanted to be a teacher since I was 4 years old. I've known that I wanted to teach Music since I was 8 year old. By the time I was 12, I had the degree I wanted to do fully picked out. I genuinely couldn't imagine having to give it all up and doing something else, but that seems to be what I'd have to do in order to come home, and that shouldn't be the case.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

Thanks, I actually have never been to Abu Dhabi but my cousin taught there for several years and she enjoyed it. Think it could be a bit more conservative than Dubai but I'm not 100% sure.

Abu Dhabi would definitely be a bit more conservative than Dubai, but it wouldn't be the the most conservative Emirate, not by a long shot.
Dubai is definitely the least conservative of the Emirates!

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Quiet possibly. I was referring to foreign languages when I said languages. History was one I was thinking of when I said there's other subjects with over supply.

English definitely has a high supply but there's a high demand too. If you have a useful in demand second subject you will definitely get a lot of hours as an English teacher.

Too many mono subject English teachers though.

I get the point you're trying to make, but who gets to decide which subjects are "useful", and which ones aren't? Not everybody in the world wants to follow a STEM career path, and aren't we supposed to be focusing on STEAM and not STEM these days anyway?

CIARAN_BOYLE

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA wrote: »

I get the point you're trying to make, but who gets to decide which subjects are "useful", and which ones aren't? Not everybody in the world wants to follow a STEM career path, and aren't we supposed to be focusing on STEAM and not STEM these days anyway?

For me and for the purposes of this discussion useful is meant as in demand.

Actually to change the subject are there more monosubject teachers in your school than you would expect in a similar Irish school.

There was suggestions sometime ago that having more monosubject teachers would be a good thing for the Irish education system (eventually leading to raising requirements to teach that one subject).

To be honest the reason there's so few monosubject teachers in certain subjects is that there's too many dual subject teachers.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

For me and for the purposes of this discussion useful is meant as in demand.

Actually to change the subject are there more monosubject teachers in your school than you would expect in a similar Irish school.

There was suggestions sometime ago that having more monosubject teachers would be a good thing for the Irish education system (eventually leading to raising requirements to teach that one subject).
To be honest the reason there's so few monosubject teachers in certain subjects is that there's too many dual subject teachers.

Fair enough.
Apart from Primary school teachers (who obviously teach multiple subjects), every Secondary school teacher in my school teaches one subject only, irrespective of how many subjects they're qualified to teach. That seems to be the norm here, and it was the norm in the school I worked in when I was in the UK too.
It would definitely be interesting to see if there would be a change in the hours available in schools, and the types of contracts being given out, if all teachers in Secondary schools taught one subject only.

Dial Hard

I hate to sound like a pedantic twat, but is there any chance you'd post your replies below the text you're quoting? This is a really interesting thread but the way you're posting makes it quite difficult to follow because you're answering first and then quoting the question afterwards.

Thanks.

Agent Smith

Do you have a bedside locker?

Whats in your bedside locker?
Is there much of an Irish Diaspora there? Do you go to Embassy events?

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Agent Smith wrote: »

Is there much of an Irish Diaspora there?

Yes, there's a few thousand Irish in the UAE, so there's a good diaspora

p15574

I think it's awful that we educate teachers only for them to have to leave due to lack of full-time permanent positions. But isn't a large part of this due to teachers going to Dubai etc in the first place? Meaning, teachers in permanent positions taking a leave of absence to go to the Middle East, preventing someone else getting that permanent position?

DaMorganator

How do you feel about supporting a regime with such a terrible human rights history?

Do you just not see it in your day-to-day life and or chose to ignore it?

I'm not having a go btw, just curious if Irish people moving to UAE and the middle east ever give this a thought.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

p15574 wrote: »

I think it's awful that we educate teachers only for them to have to leave due to lack of full-time permanent positions. But isn't a large part of this due to teachers going to Dubai etc in the first place? Meaning, teachers in permanent positions taking a leave of absence to go to the Middle East, preventing someone else getting that permanent position?

I agree, it is awful that we have to leave the country because of the lack of hours back home. Most of us would love to be able to go home, but the lack of job security is a big factor in preventing that. Unfortunately, this is something that is unlikely to change anytime soon.
As of 2015, teachers covering for those on career break also qualify for CIDs after two years (taken from the ASTI website). Once school's keep the same teacher covering a career break, if the hours are still there in their 3rd consecutive year, they will be made permanent.
I've never had permanency in Ireland, and I've never covered a career break, but as it stands, it is technically possible to be made permanent covering a career break.
One of the main issues there is that there are a lot of schools that are getting rid of teachers after a year or two years, in order to ensure that they won't have to give them CID in their third year.
There aren't as many teachers in the UAE on career break anymore, it's definitely more teachers that can't get hours back home.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Dial Hard wrote: »

I hate to sound like a pedantic twat, but is there any chance you'd post your replies below the text you're quoting? This is a really interesting thread but the way you're posting makes it quite difficult to follow because you're answering first and then quoting the question afterwards.

Thanks.

I'm replying to these on my phone, which has a mind of its own. I've gone back to edit them, if that helps!

[Deleted User]

Are there any distance online teaching opportunities in Dubai (i.e., reside in Ireland and teach online to students in Dubai)?

TCM

Do you pay income tax or other taxes?

Wexy86

What is the cost of living like? As in transport to/from work, electricity, WiFi, etc trying to see if the cost of living cancels out the free accommodation

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

DaMorganator wrote: »

How do you feel about supporting a regime with such a terrible human rights history?

Do you just not see it in your day-to-day life and or chose to ignore it?

I'm not having a go btw, just curious if Irish people moving to UAE and the middle east ever give this a thought.

Honestly, if we're looking at the Middle East in general, or some of the other countries that Irish teachers are working in, the UAE definitely isn't the worst of them.

I've kind of touched on this in a few of my other posts, but I genuinely haven't seen it here. I think the fact that Saudi, Qatar and Iran are all pretty much next door might be leading people to make some presumptions about the UAE in general, that I haven't found to be true. I'm able to live pretty much the same life as I did in the UK and back home in Ireland, except for the temperature difference!
The locals are usually content to just let the westerners away at it, once nobody is being deliberately offensive in front of them. Everyone I've met in the Middle East seems to like the Irish, so we're obviously doing something right as an expat community!
I was expecting it to be a bit more conservative and strict when I originally moved over, but I haven't found that to be the case at all!
Admittedly, I really only mix with mostly westerners outside of school (it's not deliberate on my part, it's just the way things seem to have worked out for me here), so I don't know if it's different for different groups or nationalities.

The UAE named 2017 the Year of Giving, and 2019 The Year of Tolerance, and had different initiatives for improving the standard of living for everyone (local and foreign), so there has been a bit of a push by the royal family/government towards improving things in general. Most of the locals I've met have been really lovely people. The younger generations coming up are definitely more conscious of being tolerant and accepting of others.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Black Swan wrote: »

Are there any distance online teaching opportunities in Dubai (i.e., reside in Ireland and teach online to students in Dubai)?

As far as I'm aware, there aren't any opportunities like that. A lot of teachers already in Dubai tutor children outside of school, so there wouldn't really be a market for it.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

TCM wrote: »

Do you pay income tax or other taxes?

We don't pay income tax in Dubai, but there is a flat rate of 5% VAT on everything, which was introduced a few years ago.

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Wexy86 wrote: »

What is the cost of living like? As in transport to/from work, electricity, WiFi, etc trying to see if the cost of living cancels out the free accommodation

Dubai is an expensive city to live in.
Taxis in general are much cheaper in Dubai than in Ireland.
You can also fill a tank of petrol in your car for approx. €20 over here.
The cost of renting a car can range anywhere from about €300+ per month. You could buy a car second hand, which in the long run would be cheaper, but it's not something I plan to do at the moment.

The cost of WiFi is eyewateringly expensive, significantly more so than back home.
There are only two companies in Dubai that provide internet for your home (Du and Etisalat), and they are both publicly owned, so they have the monopoly on things.
You can also only buy a package from the company that is installed on your building, so that removes any need for competition among the companies.
I pay €90 a month for my internet package. It also comes with a phone line and a TV box, but I don't use either. However, they won't give me a package for just WiFi, so this is the cheapest one I can get.

My electricity depends on how much air conditioning I use. When I don't use very much, my electricity/sewage/municipality charge is around €85 per month, but in the last few months it's been more than double that, as it's been too hot to not have the air conditioning on pretty much constantly.

finisklin

Hiya,

great AMA by the way.

What do you do in your spare time? You referred that you don't really drink so that reduces pub time perhaps.

Have you taken up any new hobbies or developed new skills?

Do you wait to buy your clothes when you go home (Pennys, Dunnes etc.) to save cash or splash out in the dubai mall?

Is your friend network Irish or are there different nationalities in it?

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

finisklin wrote: »

Hiya,

great AMA by the way.

What do you do in your spare time? You referred that you don't really drink so that reduces pub time perhaps.

Have you taken up any new hobbies or developed new skills?

Do you wait to buy your clothes when you go home (Pennys, Dunnes etc.) to save cash or splash out in the dubai mall?

Is your friend network Irish or are there different nationalities in it?

Hi, thanks!

I'd go out for a few drinks, or the odd Dubai Brunch, but it's not something I'd do every weekend.
I tried joining a GAA group last year, to meet more Irish people, and learn a new skill (I never played it at home), but I'm not sporty, and am horrendously uncoordinated, so that didn't work out too well... I'm not sure yet whether I'll go back this year.
It took a while to stop feeling like I had to go out brunching and drinking all weekend every weekend, like the people I met when I first moved over.
I joined a group for quizzes and games nights, so I'd do them at least once a week now. I've made some good friends from there.
I also go to the mall and/or cinema, but that wouldn't be every weekend.
There's a pool in my complex, so I would spend time there as well. Sometimes I go to the beach.

I bought most of my things while I was at home for the Summer, as it works out cheaper.
I'd order the odd few bits online for back home home, and my parents would bring them out if they're visiting.
Dubai has a lot of the shops that we have at home (H&M, M&S, Zara, Next etc.).
I wouldn't splash out at Dubai Mall if I can avoid it. Some of the prices there can be crazy! However, you can get some good deals during the sale periods.
Penney's would make an absolute killing if they opened a store here!

When I first moved over, my friend network was all Irish, as I hung around with the people from my school that had been on my flight. However, I wasn't as much of a partier or as sporty as they were, so I wouldn't hang out with them any more. There wasn't any animosity between us, we just floated in different directions. We're all perfectly civil towards eachother when we bump into each other.
I'm in a bit more of a mixed group now. Off the top of my head, my friends group are a mix of Irish, British, American, Canadian and Serbian. I'm probably forgetting a few of them, so I hope they don't end up seeing this!

Gloomtastic!

I see the teaching union rabble are rousing again over here threatening strike action, ‘demanding’ this and that but never ‘giving’ anything. Are there teaching unions over there?

I'm a teacher in Dubai, AMA

Gloomtastic! wrote: »

I see the teaching union rabble are rousing again over here threatening strike action, ‘demanding’ this and that but never ‘giving’ anything. Are there teaching unions over there?

Which one? There are three teaching unions - the INTO, ASTI, & TUI. If the unions actually banded together on the main issues and then went looking for a better deal on behalf of teachers, then I might be more inclined to believe that anything would actually happen. But usually they end up breaking ranks, and nobody gets a decent deal out of it. They just keep been bending over backwards for the Dept. of Education and Teaching Council to do whatever they want.

I very much resent the tone of "oh the teachers are at it 'demanding' things". It comes across as "why don't they just shut up and put up with it. They should be grateful that we even pay them at all". Not the first time I've heard that actual sentence either.
Teachers give more than enough as it is. Terms & conditions, pay, job security, and funding for schools have been decimated over the last decade. It's about bloody time we actually get something back for all that we've had to give and conceed!
And that's not me being 'entitled'. We know when we go into teaching that we're never going to be rich. But we are highly qualified professionals, who are treated worse than dog sh*t by a lot of the public. We can't plan for our futures because most of us don't know if we'll even have a job next year. A lot of us still live at home with our parents (if we're lucky enough), because we can't afford to rent (never mind the pipe dream of applying for a mortgage!). I don't think it's unreasonable to want to be able to move into somewhere of our own and not spend the rest of our lives living with our parents! I don't think it's unreasonable to want to be comfortable, and not be constantly stressed and worried about how we're going to afford to pay our bills, or what we're going to do if an unexpected expense comes up. I don't think it's unreasonable to want fair remuneration for the work we do. It's not a 9-4 job. Most teachers are in school an hour before school starts, and and hour or two after school ends. We take work home with us every night (school holidays included) so that the students aren't left waiting for work back. We come into school during midterms and dedicate hours after school to give extra classes to exam years. I don't think it's unfair for us to want to be able to afford to heat the school in the depths of Winter, to have smaller class sizes so that we can focus more on each individual student, and to have the funds from the Dept. of Education so that we can have up to date resources to actually teach the kids in the first place!
The Teaching unions give/conceed more than anyone should have to, to the Dept. of Education and Teaching Council. It's about time that some of the "demands" as you've phrased them, are actually met. But I won't hold my breath.
No teacher wants to miss class time with their students if it's unavoidable, but it seems that the only time anyone actually starts listening is when parents are going to be inconvenienced by school closures. Not that teachers ever get much support for wanting decent conditions for themselves and their students. Usually it's just used as another stick to beat us with.
Funnily enough, everybody (rightly) supports the nurses when they strike for better conditions, but the very idea of teachers striking for better conditions is met by a lot of people with nothing short of absolute rage. People seem to forget that we all had the same CAO form.

No, there are no teaching unions in the UAE.

finisklin

Hi again,

I have been to Dubai before and it strikes me as a completely different reality to probably anywhere else in the world.

The opulence of the hotels, food, cars and luxury available is so far removed from anything I have experienced previous.

How do you stay grounded because it's just not real or couched in any Irish or perhaps western world reality?

Also, for those within your group that are saving, how much would they expect to put away every month/year? 60-70% of their income?

For those saving for a house or whatever when they move back home, how committed are they? Or do they let their hair down and go nuts in the dubai mall every pay day?

cloudatlas

Dubai isn't a place I'd like to go I find their obsession with money and tacky trinkets vulgar, their treatment of poor migrant workers reprehensible, their refusal of options for citizenship insular, and I just view these places Qatar included as just desolate backward, conservative sand pits. If all else failed what career would you choose outside of teaching?

BorneTobyWilde

Do you ever wine and dine with billionaires? Would you marry a Guy From Dubai, a local/