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The glorious 12th

realdanbreen

I see where there is a gigantic pile of pallets stacked up in an estate in Portadown which the fire service regard as a 'serious health and safety risk'. Apparently 30+ firms have been approached to remove/dismantle it but nobody will touch it. One things for certain if that was some years ago in a nationalist area the British army would be steaming in like a flash to dismantle it and anything else that was in its way.

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blanch152

Matt Barrett wrote: »

It's a farce compounded by a faux democracy, which only in recent times has any semblance of legitimacy, albeit on stolen occupied land.

How is the GFA a farce? That is the current constitutional status quo voted on by everyone on this island.

blanch152

_blaaz wrote: »

The constutional staus quo expresses a desire for reunification??

To express support in the present constitional situation surely means you support reunification??(either that or you just taking p1ss :pac: )

The territorial claim in the Constitution of Ireland was replaced with an aspiration for unification of the people. I have absolutely no issue with that.

citytillidie

downcow wrote: »

More spin. It was agreed by all including the fire brigade both before and after this bonfire that it met all safety requirements re distance etc. I was an unfortunate chance situation where embers were blown an unexpected direction/distance

.....and of course its a number of years ago

2016 is only 3 years ago, only reason more does not happen is the fire brigade have to board up places along with protect them before bonfire's

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

Francie, Catch yourself on. If you are now saying there was no campaign to drive protestants out then you really out of touch. Your statement just reminds me that Gerry was never in the IRA and doesn't have a beard

The conflict/war was not against Protestant, my wife understood that, as do the many protestants still living here.

The conflict/war was with the British and Loyalists.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

How is the GFA a farce? That is the current constitutional status quo voted on by everyone on this island.

It's not. Never said it was. Try just posting an assertion rather than twisting things, for the craic like.
It's a reasonable agreement, as best the people could achieve dealing with the faux N.I. portion of the Irish province of Ulster.

_blaaz

blanch152 wrote: »

How is the GFA a farce? That is the current constitutional status quo voted on by everyone on this island.

The constitutional status quo is to seek reuniifcation....you cant support this and oppose reunification

No matter how much you try to claim.the constitution,you simply dont (nothing wrong with this,just dont delude yourself)

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Francie also said he never voted and does not vote for Sinn Fein, yet he has close to 20,000 posts defending them and their position, so I would take a lot of what he says with a pinch of salt.

Is there even a mention of SF in most of this thread.

Your problem janfebmar is that like the British soldier on Bloody Sunday, you think all those in favour of Irish Unity are all shinners and are in the 'RA.

Funny stuff.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Is there even a mention of SF in most of this thread.

Your problem janfebmar is that like the British soldier on Bloody Sunday, you think all those in favour of Irish Unity are all shinners and are in the 'RA.

Funny stuff.

I have to concede he was a little inaccurate.

Only about half of your 20,000 posts are defending SF, the rest are attacking various demonised groupings such as partitionists and unionists.

_blaaz

blanch152 wrote: »

I have to concede he was a little inaccurate.

Only about half of your 20,000 posts are defending SF, the rest are attacking various demonised groupings such as partitionists and unionists.

Whole lot of play the man,not the ball going on here

Yous lot been called out for bullying others on thread already....pure toxic atmosphere your attempting to foster imo....to get thread and discussion shut down

Junkyard Tom

downcow wrote: »

Francie, Catch yourself on. If you are now saying there was no campaign to drive protestants out then you really out of touch. Your statement just reminds me that Gerry was never in the IRA and doesn't have a beard

Ye lads have an awful like for conflating Protestant with UDR/RUC. Ye tend to leave out that during the Troubles they were assisting Unionist killers who stalked the Catholic communities and targeted them for murder.

MaryJane's oft trotted-out 'ethnic cleansing' of Protestants during the War Of Independence (WoI) has been exposed as nonsense time-and-again yet she clings to that story like a child with its teddy.

As one Protestant minister said when acting as a Referee for compensation that was being paid after the WoI:

'every Protestant house was visited not because they were Protestant but because every Protestant had and has a liking for the Union Jack'

Reverend W. A. MacDougall, the Church of Ireland

The truth is always more complex than a sound-bite.

FrancieBrady

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Ye lads have an awful like for conflating Protestant with UDR/RUC. Ye tend to leave out that during the Troubles they were assisting Unionist killers who stalked the Catholic communities and targeted them for murder.

MaryJane's oft trotted-out 'ethnic cleansing' of Protestants during the War Of Independence (WoI) has been exposed as nonsense time-and-again yet she clings to that story like a child with its teddy.

As one Protestant minister said when acting as a Referee for compensation that was being paid after the WoI:
'every Protestant house was visited not because they were Protestant but because every Protestant had and has a liking for the Union Jack'

Reverend W. A. MacDougall, the Church of Ireland

The truth as always more complex than a sound-bite.

If you were a Protestant in the Border communities and you were not connected to the security apparatus of the state then you had no more to fear than anybody else.
If the IRA were targeting people specifically because they were protestant and wanted to ethnically cleanse the area then they made a pitifully poor job of it.

_blaaz

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If the IRA were targeting people specifically because they were protestant and wanted to ethnically cleanse the area then they made a pitifully poor job of it.

I always feel people who.claimed this and refuse to.acknowlege/gloss over the amount who were in security services are deliberately misleading and at best dishonest posting

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Your problem janfebmar is that like the British soldier on Bloody Sunday, you think all those in favour of Irish Unity are all shinners and are in the 'RA.
.

So you know the thoughts of the British soldier on Bloody Sunday now, do you? You got inside the mind of some young frightened working class lad from England who was faced with hundreds of rioters throwing missiles at him, and many of whom probably wanted him dead like the other 2 security force people were killed in Derry only 2 days previously?

And as regards your second point, you are wrong yet again. I do NOT think all those in favour of Irish unity are all sinners and in the IRA. I have lived here for many decades in the Republic and I understand and respect the democratic wishes of the average FG, FF, Labour etc voter.

James Brown

janfebmar wrote: »

So you know the thoughts of the British soldier on Bloody Sunday now, do you? You got inside the mind of some young frightened working class lad from England who was faced with hundreds of rioters throwing missiles at him, and many of whom probably wanted him dead like the other 2 security force people were killed in Derry only 2 days previously?

And as regards your second point, you are wrong yet again. I do NOT think all those in favour of Irish unity are all sinners and in the IRA. I have lived here for many decades in the Republic and I understand and respect the democratic wishes of the average FG, FF, Labour etc voter.

A lone scared working class soldier, salt of the earth type, under attack by hundreds of rioters? Get up the yard. Is that why Cameron apologised and the Paras were investigated. Did you tell the British to recant the apology?

FrancieBrady

Matt Barrett wrote: »

A lone scared working class soldier, salt of the earth type, under attack by hundreds of rioters? Get up the yard. Is that why Cameron apologised and the Paras were investigated. Did you tell the British to recant the apology?

I think, on sincere reflection, that jamfebmar is actually gutted with the outcome of the Bloody Sunday inquiry. She is entitled to her opinion but I just wish she could be honest about it.

janfebmar

Matt Barrett wrote: »

A lone scared working class soldier, salt of the earth type, under attack by hundreds of rioters? Get up the yard.

I did not say he was lone and I did not say he was salt of the earth type either. If you look at the well known photo from the Irish times , before the shooting started, of the soldiers sheltering beside jeeps and large quantities of rocks, stones etc on the road which were thrown by the rioters ( also in the photo), you can deduce that the reports of rioters and missiles and petrol bombs were perhaps true? That still does not excuse the soldiers actions.

James Brown

janfebmar wrote: »

I did not say he was lone and I did not say he was salt of the earth type either. If you look at the well known photo from the Irish times , before the shooting started, of the soldiers sheltering beside jeeps and large quantities of rocks, stones etc on the road which were thrown by the rioters ( also in the photo), you can deduce that the reports of rioters and missiles and petrol bombs were perhaps true? That still does not excuse the soldiers actions.

While answering to a post saying you know not everyone who wants a UI is SF or supporting the IRA you make it about the 'RA. Good deflection :rolleyes:

You do know you're talking about bloody sunday in detail now right? Just so you are aware. Are you one of the lads bangs on about bringing up historical arguments? FYI bloody sunday was a poor choice to try garner British sympathy.

janfebmar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The conflict/war was not against Protestant,

Yeah, the black prods in Claudy, Le Mons, Enniskillen, Darkley, Kingsmill etc etc were not killed because they were prods.

Rodin

janfebmar wrote: »

Nobody is triumphalising now in those areas by naming childrens play parks after paramilitary terrorists, as happened in Newry. If there was a UI then who knows what would happen, I would say naming roads and parks after "patriots" would only be the start of it.

Queen's University has a hall named after a convicted terrorist and Cromwell, that infamous murderer has many places in Belfast named after him.
Goes both ways.

One man's terrorist....

FrancieBrady

janfebmar wrote: »

Yeah, the black prods in Claudy, Le Mons, Enniskillen, Darkley, Kingsmill etc etc were not killed because they were prods.

A fraction of the total number of people killed were killed in indefensible sectarian attacks. That is not a policy of ethnic cleansing jan.

Fantasy land stuff again. Many many protestants lived through the conflict/war along the border on both sides and are still here.

And nobody but the very dregs refer to them as 'black prods'.

RobMc59

Rodin wrote: »

janfebmar wrote: »

Nobody is triumphalising now in those areas by naming childrens play parks after paramilitary terrorists, as happened in Newry. If there was a UI then who knows what would happen, I would say naming roads and parks after "patriots" would only be the start of it.

Queen's University has a hall named after a convicted terrorist and Cromwell, that infamous murderer has many places in Belfast named after him.
Goes both ways.

One man's terrorist....

Regarding Cromwell,he didn't distinguish between Catholics and Protestants in the siege of Drogheda-he killed them all.

citytillidie

RobMc59 wrote: »

Regarding Cromwell,he didn't distinguish between Catholics and Protestants in the siege of Drogheda-he killed them all.

Hence why he is hated by most on this Island

FrancieBrady

citytillidie wrote: »

Hence why he is hated by most on this Island

You have Carson stuck up there too...the man who reintroduced the gun into Irish politics.

Unionism has had a 100 years to festoon the place with the hero's of their identity.

[Deleted User]

They have a statue of cromwell outside westminster,i wonder what would be said if there was a statue of hitler outside the reichstag

janfebmar

droidman123 wrote: »

i wonder what would be said if there was a statue of hitler outside the reichstag

They would probably say it matches the statue of Sean Russell ( the IRA Nazi collaborator ) in Dublin. Maybe the only statue to a Nazi collaborator in the world?

[Deleted User]

janfebmar wrote: »

They would probably say it matches the statue of Sean Russell ( the IRA Nazi collaborator ) in Dublin.

So in essence you agree that cromwell was a toerag,fair play to your honesty

FrancieBrady

droidman123 wrote: »

So in essence you agree that cromwell was a toerag,fair play to your honesty

Janfebmar might want to understand State Commemorations/Glorifications and non state ones.

Imreoir2

RobMc59 wrote: »

Regarding Cromwell,he didn't distinguish between Catholics and Protestants in the siege of Drogheda-he killed them all.

Given that the man was a radical puritan, I think he probably did discriminate.

Rodin

Cromwell did an awful lot worse than Ray McCreesh, and the name of the playpark was democratically chosen.

The terrorist who has a hall named after him at Queens is Nelson Mandela. Not a word about it.

All in the eye/mind of the perceiver...

[Deleted User]

janfebmar wrote: »

And then discriminating against non Irish language speakers when it comes to state jobs and entrance to most of the universities here, like happened last time. Francie is thinking some will be persuaded to " up tents" to use his phrase. He still has not condemned the previous Provo attempt to persuade protestants along the border to up tents during the troubles, for example by attacking the school bus Arlene was in as a kid, or attempting to murder her father on another occasion.

In his fantasy N I roads will be named after Patriots, everyone will learn the national anthem "as gaelige" and everyone will learn the correct version of history, and how the brave pira liberated our land.

Come off it, Jan.

I've made the point, in the past, that there is no discrimination against protestants or unionists, re. the Irish language. Its taught in schools here, for everyone.
So, now you decide to switch to "discrimination against non-Irish speakers".

If the option of learning the the language is available to everyone, how is it discrimination if someone chooses not to learn it?
Particularly since it is very much a part of our shared history.

Arlene's grandmother spoke Irish, for goodness sake! Now, all of a sudden, it's supposedly anathema to the British?
I wonder how the native Scots speakers feel about that?