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The glorious 12th

realdanbreen

I see where there is a gigantic pile of pallets stacked up in an estate in Portadown which the fire service regard as a 'serious health and safety risk'. Apparently 30+ firms have been approached to remove/dismantle it but nobody will touch it. One things for certain if that was some years ago in a nationalist area the British army would be steaming in like a flash to dismantle it and anything else that was in its way.

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Ush1

Is that Eddie Maiden??

ChikiChiki

timthumbni wrote: »

Just to clarify that the bonfires on the 11th (or 10th nights in one case) are not normally anything to do with the OO. Also the majority of people who will attend the 12th parades today will not have attended the bonfires the night before.

Burning flags is silly on either side though not going to ruin my day either. It has to be remembered that for many here the Irish tricolour is and was associated with the IRA. Sure you still have people on here who still blab on about the union flag as the butchers apron etc. They shouldn’t be burned but in the grand scheme of things and certainly compared to the murder of a journalist recently it’s no biggie.

Regarding the 12th parades themselves they are fun family day outs. Now for those who are anti unionist or don’t like the sight of union flags, NI red hands etc etc then it’s obviously not going to be your bag. Like I wouldn’t feel comfortable going to st paddy’s day in Belfast for example. But that’s life. I just don’t go. The disruption is very temporary so wouldn’t bother me.

The parades in the country especially are very gentle affairs. Hard to get offended by an accordion band of young girls. (Well, unless you are a Tyrone gaa player by the looks of it)

The keyboard republican circle jerk of anti unionism on here is a sight to read sometimes. Some highlights include suggesting sterilisation and others calling in the army. I’m sure the 12th July and the 11th November are their most fun times of the year. Probably buy a new keyboard for each date.

Anyway I can hear pipe bands in the distance. (The horror.... the horror)

Ban all parades. People across all sides up north need to grow up and stop acting like petulant children. Parades only serve to provoke tensions. They have no place in a progressive NI.

munsterlegend

DrPhilG wrote: »

It's an odd time of the year...

I'm born and bred in Donegal, 80s child so remember the tail end of the troubles, mildly Prod background, lived in Derry for a few years, work in Derry the last 20 and even married a "mucker".

I have no time for the terrorists or their sympathisers on either side. But I've always found that the loons on the Unionist side were worse than those on the Nationalist side. Just a more venomous bitter sort.

Take the Derry murals for example. The Bogside murals are for the most part a quite poignant look back at the oppression of the past (mostly, not all of course). Then on the other side of the river you have lovely images like this:

I've been to Belfast probably close to 100 times and driven through it quite often. I've always felt uncomfortable driving through the Unionist areas than the Nationalist ones, even when I had a northern reg car.

It's bizarre how it brings the bigot out of normal people. I have deleted a few Facebook friends over the years, you know the sort of typical Facebook friend, not that close in real life but you chat to them at work and end up adding them etc. But normal decent people going about their lives.

Then you see them on the 12th posting pictures of your flag ablaze on a bonfire without seeming to have a notion of how offensive that is.

Yeah I walked down both the shankill and the falls and have to say while both are not great the shankill far more menacing. Also someone would need to do a spellcheck at the loyalist memorials, littered with spelling mistakes!

ChikiChiki

Omackeral wrote: »

When the Confederate Flag isn't seen as the most controversial one, you've an issue.

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

It's pure facism.

More often than not it's pure idiocy as well.

Despite flying an actual Swastika, they fly the Israeli flag too. Absolute knuckle-dragging troglodytes.

Can any of our resident unionists explain why a swastika would be flown alongside the union jack?

DrPhilG

It's an odd time of the year...

I'm born and bred in Donegal, 80s child so remember the tail end of the troubles, mildly Prod background, lived in Derry for a few years, work in Derry the last 20 and even married a "mucker".

I have no time for the terrorists or their sympathisers on either side. But I've always found that the loons on the Unionist side were worse than those on the Nationalist side. Just a more venomous bitter sort.

Take the Derry murals for example. The Bogside murals are for the most part a quite poignant look back at the oppression of the past (mostly, not all of course). Then on the other side of the river you have lovely images like this:

I've been to Belfast probably close to 100 times and driven through it quite often. I've always felt uncomfortable driving through the Unionist areas than the Nationalist ones, even when I had a northern reg car.

It's bizarre how it brings the bigot out of normal people. I have deleted a few Facebook friends over the years, you know the sort of typical Facebook friend, not that close in real life but you chat to them at work and end up adding them etc. But normal decent people going about their lives.

Then you see them on the 12th posting pictures of your flag ablaze on a bonfire without seeming to have a notion of how offensive that is.

cgcsb

It hasn't made the BBC headlines, you have to go into the NI section.

munsterlegend

citytillidie wrote: »

All until they can’t get what they want and march in areas they are not welcome then it turns far from a family day out.

If they OO are not part of the 11th why have they appealed before for tyres not to be burned at them?

They are all tied together.

Sure you had mervyn the head of that sectarian orange order speaking with Jamie Bryson( a notorious individual) about the bonfire at the leisure centre. The orange order use loyalists when it suits to promote their cause and have done for years. Look at billy wright on the garvaghy all those years ago.

Edgware

I was often in Belfast for concerts etc at the Waterfront and Odyssey. I have done all the tourist stuff as well with no problem.But come the marching season high in July the atmosphere along the Antrim Rd etc definetely changes.
I can understand their loyalty and allegiance to the Crown ( which wont be returned by Boris and co when it suits them). Having done the tour of Flanders and the Somme I can understand the commemmoration of the war dead from Ulster which included thousands of Catholics from areas such as West Belfast, Tyrone, Armagh etc. The loyalists dont recognise this fact at all

I just cant understand their need for triumphalism and insulting of the Irish state that buys their agricultural produce, supports their tourism industry etc.
Then of course we will have the British Open coming up. Will they take down their Soldier F banners then?

Franz Von Peppercorn II

An intelligent alien visiting earth would find it so odd that woke Britannia is ok with this, or that it gets so little coverage.

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

https://twitter.com/stevenmdunne/status/1149617590576111616

'Family days out' tourism will go through the roof!

citytillidie

PSNI to investigate themselves over the possibility of the names of the contractors to remove the bonfire being leaked is he biggest joke ever should be another police force

https://twitter.com/bbcmarksimpson/status/1149599971605241858?s=21

Police have no power to remove trespassers

https://twitter.com/bbcmarksimpson/status/1149609777527324672?s=21

Let’s see what August brings

[Deleted User]

https://twitter.com/stevenmdunne/status/1149617590576111616

cgcsb

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

We're not really into the whole pageantry parade thing ..its not really us.

Even on st pats we stuff our parades with drag queens and horses.

These 12th marches are dull, dour affairs with drunk oul lads walking, tatoo test subjects playing ****e music and vans with flegs on them. The colour and artistry and costumes you get at paddies day are class, no comparison.

cgcsb

timthumbni wrote: »

Where did you see this? The police will use discretion in these areas and not just on the 12th July. Ffs the holylands on st paddy’s day is like a scene from day of the dead only on buckfast. Loads of Tyrone culchie students singing songs about the ra. Taking after their County players obviously.

This law is broken regularly, especially in holiday towns etc. I regularly meet cops going past whilst I have a beer in hand. The police in general don’t mind unless you are acting the dick. But I suspect that you know that.

In saying that I wonder does my orange collarette perhaps give me some kind of immunity. You might be on to something here.

You can see all the plastic cups and bags of bukie on all the videos and the police doing nothing. You've a weird obsession with Tyrone GAA singing come out you black and tans, like why would that bother you?

Gimme A Pound

timthumbni wrote: »

Just to clarify that the bonfires on the 11th (or 10th nights in one case) are not normally anything to do with the OO. Also the majority of people who will attend the 12th parades today will not have attended the bonfires the night before.

Burning flags is silly on either side though not going to ruin my day either. It has to be remembered that for many here the Irish tricolour is and was associated with the IRA. Sure you still have people on here who still blab on about the union flag as the butchers apron etc. They shouldn’t be burned but in the grand scheme of things and certainly compared to the murder of a journalist recently it’s no biggie.

Regarding the 12th parades themselves they are fun family day outs. Now for those who are anti unionist or don’t like the sight of union flags, NI red hands etc etc then it’s obviously not going to be your bag. Like I wouldn’t feel comfortable going to st paddy’s day in Belfast for example. But that’s life. I just don’t go. The disruption is very temporary so wouldn’t bother me.

The parades in the country especially are very gentle affairs. Hard to get offended by an accordion band of young girls. (Well, unless you are a Tyrone gaa player by the looks of it)

The keyboard republican circle jerk of anti unionism on here is a sight to read sometimes. Some highlights include suggesting sterilisation and others calling in the army. I’m sure the 12th July and the 11th November are their most fun times of the year. Probably buy a new keyboard for each date.

Anyway I can hear pipe bands in the distance. (The horror.... the horror)

Instead of whatabouting and being passive aggressive, please bear in mind that it's an unpleasant, intimidatory situation for nationalists, and has painful connections for them. And nobody has to be a member of a republican circle jerk to understand this.

citytillidie

Dublin Spur wrote: »

It's all the fault of King James I - what a prick

The province is still ****ed up 400 years later

Yep as I say send them all down to the boyne let them commentate that battle no need to hold cities, towns and villages to ransom to get to march were they are not welcome and it would see a lot of the tension go away.

ILoveYourVibes

cgcsb wrote: »

I'd say for every nationalist flying flags, there's about 300 loyalists doing the same. Nationalist areas are much more low key, even the notorious Falls road only has a handful of permanent flags, mostly on memorials.

We're not really into the whole pageantry parade thing ..its not really us.

Even on st pats we stuff our parades with drag queens and horses.

arybvtcw0eolkf

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If that is in anyway a common or general experience of Belfast it is remarkable that it has a tourist business at all. We will weekend in Belfast and go there many times in the year for many many years, even during the conflict/war, and I have never been asked 'What are you doing here fella?'.

You are remarkable to have experienced the 'cliched' Belfast on your first trip. Well done fella!

Cheers, you're welcome.

Up the 'RA and all that rubbish

Strumms

Dublin Spur wrote: »

I go to Belfast for gigs - the city center is a nice friendly place
I think the suburbs are a different story though

Same, I found the city super friendly, hotels, bars, asking directions in the street.

cgcsb

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I know. Its because nationalists fly Palestinian flags or else nationalists fly Palestinian flags just because unionists fly Israeli flags.

The only thing that unites them is that both of those idiots hate jews and muslims if they are honest.

I'd say for every nationalist flying flags, there's about 300 loyalists doing the same. Nationalist areas are much more low key, even the notorious Falls road only has a handful of permanent flags, mostly on memorials.

Dublin Spur

It's all the fault of King James I - what a prick

The province is still ****ed up 400 years later

cgcsb

filbert the fox wrote: »

What chance of Mary Lou's all Ireland Government dealing with the Loyalist extremists? Presumably not by the previous method.

Mary Lou and SF will never be in government in a UI.

cgcsb

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

If they were any way serious about removing it at all, they'd have the army in doing it.

Maybe if direct rule is implemented after Oct, one of the very first things the Brits will do is outlaw hate organisations such as the orange order, and ban bonfires and such that incite religious intolerance or hatred.

Can you imagine the English tolerating the same craic going on around Bradford or Birmingham by Islamic extremists where they burned effigies, spreading their hatred and threatening and menacing everyone and anyone who tried to interfere?

That would be some irony.

Come October, most English people will continue to say: "There's a 'Northern' Ireland??"

cgcsb

Omackeral wrote: »

The sheer size of this one. I don't know how they manage to get them built so high with work and everything to go to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjkdpuWsRU

So basically while working/middle class Catholic teenagers are going to school, doing summer courses in the Gealtacht, playing GAA, volunteering or travelling the protestant kids are doing this. It's a more primitive culture, based on pre-destination (the future has already been decided by god so nothing you can do now matters), academia and artistry are frowned upon. When you compare this culture to say, main stream Irish culture in terms of art, music, science, literature, folklore, language etc. it is clear that the loyalist culture has produced nothing at all of note and is ultimately backward looking, regressive and internationally irrelevant. Burning things is their sum of achievements.

timthumbni

cgcsb wrote: »

I see today the PSNI have also waved Northern Ireland's strict public drinking laws, funny that.

Where did you see this? The police will use discretion in these areas and not just on the 12th July. Ffs the holylands on st paddy’s day is like a scene from day of the dead only on buckfast. Loads of Tyrone culchie students singing songs about the ra. Taking after their County players obviously.

This law is broken regularly, especially in holiday towns etc. I regularly meet cops going past whilst I have a beer in hand. The police in general don’t mind unless you are acting the dick. But I suspect that you know that.

In saying that I wonder does my orange collarette perhaps give me some kind of immunity. You might be on to something here.

Strumms

Noveight wrote: »

Looking at tonight’s events on social media would reaffirm the idea that we are better off without the North for another few generations.

You’d rather they be a pain in the UK’s arse than ours.

Completely, I doubt too, the politicians, Gardai/Army wouldn’t want that either... the pain of having to deal with these attitudes.

Dublin Spur

I go to Belfast for gigs - the city center is a nice friendly place
I think the suburbs are a different story though

facehugger99

Giovanni Low Quintuplet wrote: »

I was in Belfast for the first time only last week, we'd intended staying three nights but couldn't wait to get out of the kip and checked out of the hotel and made a dash for the border on the second evening.

The flags didn't bother me, Union Jack and Parachute flags everywhere. Tbh their sh*t isn't mine and I let that crap go over my head.

Done the tourist thing and took the hop on, hop off tour bus and learned a few things, Belfast is a sh*t hole, that the Prince of Wales avenue to Stormont is called the 'POW's Avenue, that the people I met in the SF shop on the Falls Road (at the Bobby Sands mural) were lovely until I asked I mentioned I was taking the bus to the Shankill Road, then the lady looked at me like she wanted to knee cap me.

Got on the bus (great guides btw) and was going to get off on the Shankill when the guide advised me not to!.. You're from Dublin, they've orange fever this week. Its not safe for you.. Ok I stayed on the bus.

Mentioned this to the staff in the hotel, yea don't go near there with your Dublin accent. You'll find yourself in a lot of trouble.

Thinking they meant that people would just be rude to me I asked a taxi man, and even a doctor (I was up on a medical appointment) and told them I don't mind telling someone to fvck off if they're annoying me.

The doctor told me that I could be lucky and meet some lovely people on the Shankill but that I'd more likely meet someone who'd be very unpleasant or I might find a phone call would be made and a few lads would be down to sort us out!!.

Fvck that sh*t!.

Found it strange that in conversation everyone very soon let me know if they were Catholic or Protestant, weird to me because I coudn't give a sh*t.

The pubs were sh*t holes too, although Kellys Cellars serve the best stew I've ever had.

Worked there for years and never had anything similar happen to me than the numerous incidents you had in 2 days.

It sounds like you went looking for trouble though - the SF shop, Shankill - why FFS?

McMurphy

Great bunch of lads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwYFt1AUxHA

J Mysterio

Hector Savage wrote: »

Christ, such bigots, reminds me of that scene in Trainspotting 2.

Trainspotting 2 was completely forgettable other than that scene - absolutely hilarious.