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How is a man supposed to find a woman in the 21st century

jimjangles

I've tried online dating sites and they're absolutely useless.
I'm not ugly but it would seem by my terrible lack of popularity that I don't have the looks for online dating.
Whatever they're looking for online it's not me.
Also I have no kind of a social life anymore.
Also I'm 37 and I'm a man.
So if online dating doesn't work and I have no social life and I live in the midlands seems things aren't really going to work out too good for me for finding someone ever.
I should probably just forget about it.

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Cryptopagan

FTA69 wrote: »

Nobody is saying that, it isn't a choice between the pub and sports alone. People are stressing self-improvement as a means to get confident. You can go to the gym, you can make better dietary choices and dress better. There are websites galore that can help you with advice on that if you can be arsed making the change.

AS for hobbies, doing literally any activity that puts you in contact with people - language learning, reading groups etc etc will be beneficial.

Of course there are people with reasons that make any of the above impossible, but for the vast majority of people they're just stuck in a rut and need to push themselves out of it.

Getting out there and joining classes and all the rest is way less effective than people imagine, especially nowadays when most singletons are on apps and don’t need to take up a hobby or group activity to find potential dates.

Cryptopagan

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I agree a lot with this.

Previously the weird and unstable people were pretty much hidden from society. Now they're online. None of my "normal" friends (I'm only relatively normal) use boards or reddit or anything like that.

This is why I don't believe the idea that when people go online they're more extreme or less polite. I think what's actually happening is the people who regularly post online are not regular folk.

I went to a boards event (you were there Wibbs) and it was an eye opener for me. I'm being sincere: I had never met people like that before. Wibbs - you were the most normal person there, and I think you'd agree you're like me - "relatively normal".

I also think social media has exposed problems with our education systems. There are many people who can only think in a black and white way (Trump is Hitler! Trump is the best ever!) and a lot of people who cannot think in a non-emotional way. We need to fix this.

It is true this is the best society we've ever had. I see so much talk about Nazis and white supremacists. But if you were to gather all the Nazis and white supremacists in Ireland, you'd probably have 12 people.

In what way were they not normal?

OMM 0000

Cryptopagan wrote: »

In what way were they not normal?

Emotional problems / severe social anxiety.

It changed my opinion of what the internet is.

Note I'm used to being around people who are a little odd (working in software development 20+ years) so it's not like I live in some social butterfly bubble.

Tuco88

Eh I'm sorry but....

The sorta people I met who classed themselves as "Normal" was usually far from the so called "Norm"

In a room full if so called "not normal" folk, you classed yourself and Wibbs as the only normal folk?

What actually went on in this meet up may I ask?ðŸ˜ just curious....

Wanderer2010

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Emotional problems / severe social anxiety.

It changed my opinion of what the internet is.

Note I'm used to being around people who are a little odd (working in software development 20+ years) so it's not like I live in some social butterfly bubble.

Wow, you judged people as having emotional issues and social anxiety based on one meeting? Are you a psychologist? What if people didn't want to meet you again based on your being a dcik head or up your own ar%se? This analysis of people around you works both ways. Im sure there are 2 sides to your story. Id certainly never like to meet you based on your instant put-down of people you only met once...theres something very off about that.

OMM 0000

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Wow, you judged people as having emotional issues and social anxiety based on one meeting? Are you a psychologist? What if people didn't want to meet you again based on your being a dcik head or up your own ar%se? This analysis of people around you works both ways. Im sure there are 2 sides to your story. Id certainly never like to meet you based on your instant put-down of people you only met once...theres something very off about that.

Yeah they were that weird. As I said, I had never met people like that before.

Obviously I don't care you don't want to meet me.

Mister Vain

Cryptopagan wrote: »

Getting out there and joining classes and all the rest is way less effective than people imagine, especially nowadays when most singletons are on apps and don’t need to take up a hobby or group activity to find potential dates.

That's actually a good point. I have hobbies which allow me to meet plenty of people, but it never leads to anything romantically. The only way I could see that happening is if the group/activity organised a night out and then things could develop once there's alcohol involved, as that is still very much the backbone of Irish romance. But as far as hobbies go, it wouldn't exactly be the norm here to start asking people out on dates. As you say, there are apps for that now.

Wanderer2010

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Yeah they were that weird. As I said, I had never met people like that before.

Obviously I don't care you don't want to meet me.

Maybe you were the weird one? That's possibly what they were thinking about you. Certainly your assessment of other people based on one meeting is very odd. Id bet even that Wibbles guy/gal probably thinks you are the weird one. :P

[Deleted User]

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Maybe you were the weird one? That's possibly what they were thinking about you. Certainly your assessment of other people based on one meeting is very odd. Id bet even that Wibbles guy/gal probably thinks you are the weird one. :P

If the people he met there were unlike any he meets in his daily life then its fair to say he has a point I think.

[Deleted User]

I find the attitude funny of "girls are put off by gaming waahh waah" Girls were always put off by hobbies involving spending many hours a day inside on a very narrow interest. In general this has always been true but there are exceptions.

You have to excite a woman. Telling her you spent 25 hours straight playing GTA 4 isn't going to do it for her, just as her telling you she watched 25 hours of Love Island with her girlfriends isnt going to impress you either. If you don't have anything genuinely exciting in your life then you need to take a hard look at yourself.

I have always been a Star Trek fan. This never formed part of my chat up routine for obvious reasons.

KikiLaRue

chuchuchu wrote: »

In the context of dating, social media has definitely given women unrealistic expectations of men, and of themselves. Dating apps like Tinder have brought out the worst part of hypergamy in women, where women have access to choose from all the guys in her city, and naturally shes going to choose the best she can get, these minority of guys in turn have seemingly endless access to women and can afford to act like assholes. I know a guy who bangs a new girl from Tinder every few days, your average Joe will struggle just to get any interaction leading to a date. I think that's the biggest difference here, from people who are giving dating advice based on pre social media era.

This is pure Jordan Peterson BS.

There is a myriad of choice for women on the apps ONLY if they are on there purely for sex, which very few women are.

It’s not our fault there are so many men out there who’d get up on a crack in the wall.

For women who would like to actually date, it’s slim pickings.

KikiLaRue

Cryptopagan wrote: »

Getting out there and joining classes and all the rest is way less effective than people imagine, especially nowadays when most singletons are on apps and don’t need to take up a hobby or group activity to find potential dates.

I think the more hobbies you have, the more often you get out of the house, the more likely you are to meet someone. Partly it’s about widening your social circle but to a greater extent I think it’s about having an interesting life that would be attractive to someone else.

Wibbs

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I went to a boards event (you were there Wibbs) and it was an eye opener for me. I'm being sincere: I had never met people like that before. Wibbs - you were the most normal person there, and I think you'd agree you're like me - "relatively normal".

Ah here, if I'm relatively normal we're fcuked.

I went to a few Boards beers over the years and frankly I expected to find a bunch of weirdos the first time I went to one. In fact when I got to the pub I specifically sought out the group that looked the most likely to be pulling the skeleton outa themselves over the latest toy from Star Trek and the latest Linux distro. And as it turned out it wasn't the Boards crowd(I think they were a chess club or something? Not as eventful as the lad at another beers faced with the same dilemma as me who ended up chatting with a bunch of middle aged swingers...). When I found the boards crowd I was pleasantly surprised by the majority TBH. And that was a mods beers.. Other sub forum beers were even more "normal" Beer guts for example. The Ladies Lounge was an entirely different setup again and again "normal". Sure you had some more "nerdy" folks(who were sound enough too), but it was a mixed bunch. I haven't been to one in nigh on eight years so I dunno how they evolved.

It is true this is the best society we've ever had. I see so much talk about Nazis and white supremacists. But if you were to gather all the Nazis and white supremacists in Ireland, you'd probably have 12 people.

Aye, ditto for whatever flavour of right left, shake it all about rad fems too.

The_Brood wrote: »

Open and inclusive for everyone? Or just some? Not everyone is brilliant at sports or into the pub scene. And those people are treated as freaks and leppers by society. Is that inclusive? People's "I'm better than you attitude" in this thread. Is that inclusive?

Yeah and they were always around and in the past almost completely isolated. Near zero outlets at all. Looking back to my teens I can now see there were lads around who were almost invisible. Their peers would maybe have given them a second thought but rarely. Today those same people have a voice, they can express themselves, even if it's only on the interwebs. Hell I was a carer for donkey's years and luckily I have a cadre of actual friends who were around on a daily basis, but the interwebs was another point of some "social" contact that certainly helped(hence my post count and typing speed.

In other circumstances I would have almost certainly lost interest early on). If I had been without my friends it would have been about the only one. So I have some idea on this score.

Sometimes showing a little bit of understanding for people different to you is better than acting like you can "fix them" with that one bit of genious advice you have. Unless you've walked in people's shoes you'll never know the effects of social exclusion. But the worst is people pretending that they know what its like because at one point they felt lonely but got over it, as if thats remotely the same thing.

If someone is living in the boonies and/or has crippling social anxiety, or are Aspies then I can fully understand it. There is help available for the last two at least and Ive known a few people who overcame that kinda thing to a large degree. They'll never be the life and soul, but they're much happier and less isolated.

And I agree with you that platitudes like "just be yourself" are a crock of poo. If being yourself worked they wouldn't be in that position. "Be more confident" is another crock. "What's for you won't go by you" makes my teeth itch with its magical thinking.

OMM 0000

This is going to be my last comment on this particular topic.

In fairness Wibbs, you me and two others left the beers together because it was too weird...

Roughly 10 years ago.

Tell me how

FTA69 wrote: »

Jesus Christ this thread is hard reading. Women are “money grabbing wh*res”, “there’s no good women left”, “a woman will simply marry you and take half of your stuff”, “women can’t hold a conversation” etc etc etc.

Mother of God is it any wonder that women don’t want anything to do with these sort of fellas? There’s some people on this thread just give off a hum of seething resentment and dislike of women in general, why the f*ck would anyone be attracted to that?

Women aren’t these malicious creatures out to do over ‘decent guys’ (many of the people commenting here sound far from decent) like. Honestly, if you’re that much of an angry bitter loser you’re better off being single.

Also MGTOW? Avoid getting sucked down that rabbit hole, absolutely mental carry on.

And they're the posts which haven't been deleted...

It went batsh*t crazy for a while there on Saturday.

ArchXStanton

Church on Tuesday wrote: »

Came across this video a while back and I think it's fairly relevant to the debate regarding social media and how we are, ironically, more lonely then ever before. Lots of other interesting takes contained as well. Well worth a watch:

It's all about the Doomer generation now maannn!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaz4jdlqhSk

Zorya

OMM 0000 wrote: »

This is going to be my last comment on this particular topic.

In fairness Wibbs, you me and two others left the beers together because it was too weird...

Roughly 10 years ago.

Maybe you left with a not-weird person impersonating Wibbs...dun dun duuunnn

Wibbs

OMM 0000 wrote: »

This is going to be my last comment on this particular topic.

In fairness Wibbs, you me and two others left the beers together because it was too weird...

Roughly 10 years ago.

Ohhhh yeah, I think I have a memory rattling around on that score. IIRC it wasn't one of the regular large scale beers. But I was likely a fair few ales in so...

Church on Tuesday

Tell me how wrote: »

And they're the posts which haven't been deleted...

It went batsh*t crazy for a while there on Saturday.

T'was an Incel takeover for a while alright.

nyarlothothep

I really hate the way people put a timer on things, like if you don't have a relationship at 37 you'll never find one, that's a lousy comment to make for people who are truly lonely (doesn't apply to me before someone jumps in). Secondly, I wouldn't waste a second's thought telling someone where to go if they were going to judge others based on their hobbies even if they included shock/horror gaming! Seriously, be yourself, don't conform to the group, there's a serious fcking problem with this in Ireland and elsewhere.

[Deleted User]

KikiLaRue wrote: »

This is pure Jordan Peterson BS.

Is this cause I said 'hypergamy'. It is a real concept you know!

KikiLaRue wrote: »

There is a myriad of choice for women on the apps ONLY if they are on there purely for sex, which very few women are.

Yes I was talking really about dating apps, I think it has expanded women's choice of dating from her social circle, to pretty much to a city wide level. They are studies that show that the top 80 percent of women choose the top 20 percent of men on dating apps because they deem the other 80 percent to not be good enough. The reason they are there maybe for hookups, casual dating, serious dating. Anyway they seem to be choosing the same minority of guys. Obviously those men have characteristics that women are attracted to, and will usually make their decision to date them based on that. If they knew the guy was a player beforehand, they probably wouldn't. Anyway the point is dating apps facilitate this to happen. Where as if a girl was dating in her social circle she would behave alot different.

KikiLaRue wrote: »

It’s not our fault there are so many men out there who’d get up on a crack in the wall.

In this comment I think you meant, its not women's fault why so many men are so desperate on dating apps chasing after women. Well in this comment I actually do agree with you and think that movements like MGTOW are very good for men. And will give men back their dignity and self esteem. Because lets face it women dont really need men nowadays, I think thats the bottom line.

KikiLaRue wrote: »

For women who would like to actually date, it’s slim pickings.

Well, I think you are best to give an insight on this. To say why the criteria for choosing a man is so high. Not just to say 'what' you want in a man but the reason 'why' behind it, and to see if it the reason is really necessary at all. I think it does make sense evolutionary for a woman to want to pick the best guy she can get. But the thing is usually that guy also has a ton of options, so there is a good chance he will only be around for a short time.

KikiLaRue

chuchuchu wrote: »

Is this cause I said 'hypergamy'. It is a real concept you know!

Yes I was talking really about dating apps, I think it has expanded women's choice of dating from her social circle, to pretty much to a city wide level. They are studies that show that the top 80 percent of women choose the top 20 percent of men on dating apps because they deem the other 80 percent to not be good enough. The reason they are there maybe for hookups, casual dating, serious dating. Anyway they seem to be choosing the same minority of guys. Obviously those men have characteristics that women are attracted to, and will usually make their decision to date them based on that. If they knew the guy was a player beforehand, they probably wouldn't. Anyway the point is dating apps facilitate this to happen. Where as if a girl was dating in her social circle she would behave alot different.

In this comment I think you meant, its not women's fault why so many men are so desperate on dating apps chasing after women. Well in this comment I actually do agree with you and think that movements like MGTOW are very good for men. And will give men back their dignity and self esteem. Because lets face it women dont really need men nowadays, I think thats the bottom line.

Well, I think you are best to give an insight on this. To say why the criteria for choosing a man is so high. Not just to say 'what' you want in a man but the reason 'why' behind it, and to see if it the reason is really necessary at all. I think it does make sense evolutionary for a woman to want to pick the best guy she can get. But the thing is usually that guy also has a ton of options, so there is a good chance he will only be around for a short time.

The exact same is true in reverse as regards the 80:20 thing - most men want women in the top 20% and disregard the others.

Same for apps expanding women’s social circles, they have expanded men’s social circles in exactly the same way. Why are you acting like it’s only true of women?

As for mgtow, I see a lot of men who chose to spend their 20s and most of their 30s playing the field panic when they get to 36/37 when there’s no one left to go on the beer with because everyone else settled down.

People act like the fear of ending up alone only effects women, it just hits us a few years earlier because of our biological clocks.

[Deleted User]

KikiLaRue wrote: »

The exact same is true in reverse as regards the 80:20 thing - most men want women in the top 20% and disregard the others.

From what I've read about these apps 80% of women will get messages from men.whereas 80% of men will get nothing at all.

ArchXStanton

[Deleted User] wrote: »

From what I've read about these apps 80% of women will get messages from men.whereas 80% of men will get nothing at all.

It's not a level playing field at all, same in reality, men have to approach and walk away with their confidence in tatters, they get to walk away with a nice big ego boost, it's a cosy little arrangement..

FTA69

MGTOW is absolutely a dodgy, women-hating philosophy and should be avoided at all costs. Creepy weird sh*t if I ever saw it.

Andrew00

Some people on here wondering why they're single and have no friends when they're stuck in front of a computer playing video games all day or giving out about Trump and the like online.

Same ones will go to comic conventions and that, how would any normal, decent looking woman want to get into a relationship with someone like that

FTA69

https://www.mgtow.com/quotes/

Here's the quotes section from MGTOW website.

"Most wh*res are honest women, most women are dishonest wh*res."

Lovely stuff, very positive indeed.

Patty Hearst

Deleted User wrote: »

From what I've read about these apps 80% of women will get messages from men.whereas 80% of men will get nothing at all.

Yes, Tinder data shows that 80% of Women compete for the top 20% of men while the bottom 80% of men will compete for women across the spectrum. So most men will have no luck on Tinder whereas almost all of the women will receive attention.

Junkyard Tom

FTA69 wrote: »

Here's the quotes section from MGTOW website.

When I was growing up 'men going their own way' would have conjured images of some fella heading off, building a log cabin in the wilderness, fishing for salmon, befriending a bear, teaching raccoons tricks etc.

Church on Tuesday

ArchXStanton wrote: »

It's not a level playing field at all, same in reality, men have to approach and walk away with their confidence in tatters, they get to walk away with a nice big ego boost, it's a cosy little arrangement..

Why on earth would your confidence be in tatters?

If you get chatting to a woman and she's not interested, who cares?