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Catholic Ireland dead? Mod Warning in Post #563

lbc2019

With that resounding 87% Yes in the exit poll for the divorce referendum surely that signifies the final nail in Catholic Ireland's coffin?

I for one am delighted.

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Plumbthedepths

One eyed Jack wrote:

I gave you the reason why youâ€™re being silly - it was perfectly clear from Edgewareâ€™s post, and from the fact that you had made reference to Christianity, and from the title of the thread, that the person being referred to was Jesus of Nazareth.

No it's perfectly clear if your share the same beliefs and everyone those.

One eyed Jack wrote:

You can pretend to be as dense as you like, but frankly I donâ€™t believe anyone could possibly be so dense. It has nothing to do with whether or not you share my beliefs.

Not pretending to be dense but genuinely curious as to the arrogance.

Bobblehats

It is not dead a new generation of Irish shall breathe new life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DafADWNvP6c

RicketyCricket

If all that came before this didn't kill the catholic church, then todays vote won't. This poison will live on sadly.

DesperateDan

It's going to take 2 more generations before Ireland is not considered Catholic I reckon. To think we're only just now living with / as a bunch of 30 somethings with children that are Christening their kids because it's the 'done' thing to do to keep grandparents happy.

The kids being christened now will be a lot more likely to tell their kids they don't care about churches. But the grandkids of the kids being christened now - all but the most fervent God-fearers will manage to pass it down that far.

DEFTLEFTHAND

I'm 30 and still consider myself a member of the Church.

My young son has taken Communion and will be Confirmed into the Church.

They were there for me and my family through very dark times.

I'm very proud to be an Irish Catholic.

eagle eye

I think I dislike the outspoken haters of religion more than those that get in your face pushing their beliefs.
Why can't we all just live and let live and not have hate in our lives?
The Catholic Church will survive as will all other religions.

Junkyard Tom

It's with MaCavity in the grave.

Timberrrrrrrr

Sonny noggs wrote: »

Good news:

“Islam is now listed by the CSO as being one of the fastest growing religions in Ireland.”

Something to look forward to in the future. In 20 or 30 years we will look back on these days as the calm before the storm.

What storm are you shìting about?

Love how you lads jump in with the "what about islam" crap.

[Deleted User]

Yay Godlessness!!

People fail to understand how much of their ethical framework is down to Christianity..
The Neu-materialism that will fill the void might not be better..

Zubeneschamali

As for first communion etc, people still go to Holy Wells and tie bits and bobs to bushes and leave medals there.

Those practices (and the holy wells themselves) date back before Christianity even arrived in Ireland. White dresses, bouncy castles and afternoon pints will still be around when nobody can remember who that Jesus guy was supposed to be exactly.

B0jangles

^^ Exactly ^^

People marked the major points in life - birth, puberty, marriage, death long before Christianity was ever thought of, and will mark those same points long after it's gone. Marriage wasn't even a recognised as a sarcrament in the catholic church until the 12th century. Pointing at the fact that people celebrate these events as evidence of the persistence of Christianity is getting the whole thing backwards.

LuasSimon

Plenty Catholics voted yes as well , for many Catholics a lot of the instructions go over their heads and these days many choose what suits them .
Been part of a community and saying a few prayers brings peace of mind to many however misguided it may be . I’d be a lot more concerned about local drug dealers and burgulars than those who say a few prayers together every Saturday or Sunday.

wakka12

Honestly its disturbing that more than one in ten adults think two people shouldnt be allowed to get divorced

SPDUB

wakka12 wrote: »

Honestly its disturbing that more than one in ten adults think two people shouldnt be allowed to get divorced

Where are you getting that from ?

There was no vote about banning divorce .

[Deleted User]

TCM wrote: »

There is no association between 'catholic Ireland' and this vote. Get a grip. Didn't you know we've had divorce in Ireland for some considerable time now.

This is bizarre and clutching at straws.

An estimated 87% of the voting public actively endorsed making divorce more liberal.

Can you imagine anyone that disagreed with divorce would vote to make it easier?

A church representative made a lame attempt to get out a no vote, but the RC church knew this was a lost cause.

One eyed Jack wrote: »

As determined by whom, you?

Just because this is AH doesn't mean logic breaks down. If you don't believe in core RC beliefs you're not Catholic.

If you're relying on a pedantic definition because as children you were baptised into the RC church then you are Catholic forevermore then that's pathetic.

whisky_galore

The religious orders protecting themselves and their interests from claims are far from dead.

One eyed Jack

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Just because this is AH doesn't mean logic breaks down. If you don't believe in core RC beliefs you're not Catholic.

If you're relying on a pedantic definition because as children you were baptised into the RC church then you are Catholic forevermore then that's pathetic.

That appears to be exactly what it means to people who imagine they have any authority to determine who is or isn’t Catholic. I don’t have to rely on any pedantic definitions in order to recognise that nobody has the authority to determine for someone else whether they are or aren’t Catholic.

I wouldn’t even regard their proclamations as pathetic though, just irrelevant.

s7ryf3925pivug

They still have excessive influence at an institutional level.
People who don't practice, don't believe in their teachings still have holy communion for their kids, send them to religious schools, have catholic weddings and funerals, don't object to these things, call themselves catholic etc etc. That enables them to retain control of most schools and influence other institutions including the Dail. It's apathy and passivity not belief or zeal.

lawred2

lbc2019 wrote: »

With that resounding 87% Yes in the exit poll for the divorce referendum surely that signifies the final nail in Catholic Ireland's coffin?

I for one am delighted.

Delighted with the resounding result but the divorce referendum was over twenty years ago.. this proposal was nothing more than removing technicalities that should never have been in the Constitution

lawred2

As for Catholic Ireland dead? Not while they control almost all national schools they are not. And I don't see much in the way of overwhelming resolve from people when divestment comes to the crunch..

As recent events in North county Dublin demonstrated.

pnecilcaser

I thought that the school no longer had to do the communion thing? The presence of the church in schools is the root of what remains of the church here in Ireland I think. It's that level of indoctrination.

Dexter2019

lbc2019 wrote: »

With that resounding 87% Yes in the exit poll for the divorce referendum surely that signifies the final nail in Catholic Ireland's coffin?

I for one am delighted.

Thank the lord.

lawred2

pnecilcaser wrote: »

I thought that the school no longer had to do the communion thing? The presence of the church in schools is the root of what remains of the church here in Ireland I think. It's that level of indoctrination.

Change ultimately has to be forced on the boards of management. And they are overwhelmingly in the pockets of the Catholic Church.

OldMrBrennan83

Dead with some, not with others. Though the others probably don't wash with the new brigade who want to see Ireland dead, let along Catholic Ireland.

Timberrrrrrrr

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

Dead with some, not with others. Though the others probably don't wash with the new brigade who want to see Ireland dead, let along Catholic Ireland.

Who wants this ?

Mrsmum

Francis Deep Rag wrote: »

They still have excessive influence at an institutional level.
People who don't practice, don't believe in their teachings still have holy communion for their kids, send them to religious schools, have catholic weddings and funerals, don't object to these things, call themselves catholic etc etc. That enables them to retain control of most schools and influence other institutions including the Dail. It's apathy and passivity not belief or zeal.

I don't think it's either. Imo people are just doing what they enjoy. They enjoy the Sacraments so they do them. They enjoy the Church at Christmas so they do that. They feel good getting a mass said for someone so they do that. They are absolutely fine, better than fine, happy out actually, having their children taught the Catholic background at school. They admire and involve themselves or support charity stuff the church does locally or globally. They don't agree with other stuff like Catholic teaching on abortion, divorce, sex before marriage so they ignore that. That's private stuff they'll decide for themselves. But overall they'll do what they enjoy.

OldMrBrennan83

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Who wants this ?

The Twitter/Boards generation that hate anything that has ever been connected to Ireland.

One eyed Jack

lawred2 wrote: »

Change ultimately has to be forced on the boards of management. And they are overwhelmingly in the pockets of the Catholic Church.

They’re not in anyone’s pockets seeing as Boards of Management in Catholic schools are entirely voluntary?

Mad_maxx

yasmina wrote: »

Agree.

I'm 'home' nearly a year after being away for 20.
We're in rural Ireland and my kids have gone into a small local primary. They are the only kids in the school of 100 who don't "do religion", or in other words, the only non-catholics. The whole communion/confirmation thing is HUGE. I totally underestimated it. Now I don't think that these families are going to mass regularly outside of this, but I don't really know because I don't be going

On a side note, I have found that in rural Ireland if you don't go to mass or play GAA then you are not really part of the community. Everything revolves around this.

If your grandfather didn't hurl for the parish, your not part of the community in rural Ireland, you might think you are but not really

10fathoms

Mrsmum wrote: »

I don't think it's either. Imo people are just doing what they enjoy. They enjoy the Sacraments so they do them. They enjoy the Church at Christmas so they do that. They feel good getting a mass said for someone so they do that. They are absolutely fine, better than fine, happy out actually, having their children taught the Catholic background at school. They admire and involve themselves or support charity stuff the church does locally or globally. They don't agree with other stuff like Catholic teaching on abortion, divorce, sex before marriage so they ignore that. That's private stuff they'll decide for themselves. But overall they'll do what they enjoy.

Ah yes, the "a la carte" approach to Catholicism...