jm08 wrote: » Democracy is screwed in NI anyway. The largest party should govern and if there wasn't a majority in parliament, like-minded parties would agree a governing plan (look at how democracy works in most countries in Europe) - not anything like what happens in the Stormont Assembly. As I've pointed out, everything else has been tried, the only thing left is joint authority. As for Sinn Fein pulling the plug on the Assembly - that had to do with Arlene refusing to step aside while an investigation was going on. Thats what happens in democracies (eg, Francis Fitzgerald down here while investigations were conducted in which she was exoranated). Do you think the DUP could function in a normal democracy bearing in mind they have used the Petition of Concern to block legislation something like 80 times (in comparision to Sinn Fein who have used it about 4 or 5 times)?
Junkyard Tom wrote: » Reproductive Rights Scotland ✓ Wales ✓ England ✓ Norn Iron ✗ -- Blocked by Unionists.Minority Language Legislation Scotland ✓ Wales ✓ Norn Iron ✗ -- Blocked by Unionists.Marriage Equality Legislation Scotland ✓ Wales ✓ England ✓ Norn Iron ✗ -- Blocked by Unionists. Unionists: 'It's SF's fault'.
downcow wrote: » I am all for any of the European models. None have been tried so far. And review the petition of concern which would let the equal marriage through immediately
downcow wrote: » They need to grow up, get back in, and fight democratically for changes.
downcow wrote: » Every other party in NI will return to assembly except sf Sf are slow learners when it comes to democracy. They supported a system that allows a minority of religious zealots control the equal marriage issue and then they blame everyone but themselves. They need to grow up, get back in, and fight democratically for changes. The dup have scored a huge own goal with equal marriage. Polls show that a majority of their supporters support equal marriage. But you should not mix that issue of rights up with hobbies like learning minority languages
jm08 wrote: » Are the other parties just blaming Sinn Fein for getting the Assembly up and running or do they think that the DUP should stop blocking an Irish Language Act, Marriage equality, abortion etc. From what I understand, people are not entirely blaming Sinn Fein for not giving in! From what I gather, an agreement was reached between the DUP and Sinn Fein but the Orange Order pulled the plug on it.
jm08 wrote: » Yes they have. Stormont Government up to 1973 when Direct Rule had to be introduced. Up to Arlene taking over, it looked like some effort was being made (but that was with the Petition of Concern). Do you honestly think that anyone would trust the DUP running the show in NI (as the largest party)? Who would work with them to provide stable Government? Their management of the RHI scheme etc. shows they are incompetent if not corrupt and you think they should be running NI?
downcow wrote: » That’s not what I said. Dup don’t have the numbers so a voluntary coalition would be necessary. And I believe would work.
You do know that Michealle O’Neil toured the country encouraging as many people as possible to sign up to thi in the weeks before it closed
jm08 wrote: » And?
downcow wrote: » Just that sf can’t wash their hands of RHI. They were partners in government. They were heavily promoting it with there people. To suggest Stormont fell because sf were trying to clean the place up is a joke. But one that many believe
BonnieSituation wrote: » SAme way you can't wash your hand of the inbuilt OO sectarianism no matter how hard you try. --- Any chance you can enlighten us with details proof of Michell O'Neill's RHI roadtrip?
Day 108 of the inquiry started with a bang, and provided a raft of incredible information for the panel to get to grips with. One of which was the admission that a DUP adviser anonymously sent civil servants' "explosive" emails to the media and to his department's top civil servant, in order to take pressure off the party at the height of the RHI scandal in 2017. Simon Hamilton, a former Stormont economy minister, said his adviser John Robinson had taken the action with his knowledge. He conceded it hadn't been his "proudest moment" and claimed it was done because the DUP had been under a sustained attack by political rivals and the media over the affair. The emails showed contact between civil servants in Stormont's enterprise department and industry officials in summer 2015 about impending changes to the scheme to reduce its lucrative subsidies.Inquiry chair Sir Patrick Coghlin said what Mr Hamilton and his party had done was use the "cloak of anonymity" to shift the blame from the DUP to civil servants, for whom he had responsibility as minister.
downcow wrote: » Bonnie I think you will find a few posts ago I categorically stated that the OO were sectarian. I know it may be hard for you to understand that some of us try to be objective and honest. I’m not the one in denial here As for your request. Here you go. One of many. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/rhi-scandal/sinn-feins-michelle-oneill-in-firing-line-over-rhi-as-role-of-her-department-in-hyping-faulty-scheme-revealed-35404342.html
downcow wrote: » But you should not mix that issue of rights up with hobbies like learning minority languages
downcow wrote: » Just that sf can’t wash their hands of RHI. They were partners in government. They were heavily promoting it with there people.
To suggest Stormont fell because sf were trying to clean the place up is a joke. But one that many believe
BonnieSituation wrote: » You recognised OO sectarianism did ya? Without any qualifications? --- Did you just link me to a google search with no commentary? I think we both know that that's a no-no. As is your jibe at my inability to understand? That's attacking the poster not the post isn't it? In a short few passages you managed to run foul of several rules I would wager. You should be careful.
Annd9 wrote: » Do you think marching around flying flags and playing instruments is a right or a hobby ?
jm08 wrote: » What they asked was that Arlene to step aside while the enquiry was going on. I suppose we will hear of Sinn Fein's involvement in the scheme once the report is published. Stormont fell because of intrangience from the DUP and their spiteful attitude to the Irish language by withdrawing the Liofa grant to their blocking the enaction of an Irish Language Act and then their overuse of the Petition of Concern that locks NI back in the 1600s.
downcow wrote: » Wow that is a really good question. I guess those that do it see it as a right, but a right with significant responsibilities and not to be put upon those that don’t want it. I guess those not directly involved probably see it as a hobby. Both reasonable positions, maybe the truth lies somewhere in the middle
downcow wrote: » Total nonsense. Did Martin Magennis step aside during the Bloody Sunday inquiring. Did Gerry Adams step aside during the Marie Cahill affair. Stormont fell because Sinn Fein were not getting it all their own way. Should the dup have pulled it down because the orangemen at twadell could not return home. How would it be looked upon if a party pulled out of a parliament anywhere in the world because they weren’t getting their way.
Fionn1952 wrote: » In all honesty, can you REALLY not see ANY difference in any of these scenarios you're highlighting? As a slight aside, is the misspelling of Martin McGuinness intentional? I've noticed this exact misspelling repeatedly from some of the more...entrenched members of the Unionist community, and I've never really understood it. I'm just perplexed as to how you can manage to not know the name of one of the most significant political actors in NI history, whatever your opinion of him.
downcow wrote: » When I read a post like this I despair at where some heads are on hear. I am absolutely not aware of any misspelling and don’t have a clue what the correct spelling is. Well of course the scenarios are all different otherwise I would have just gave one
Fionn1952 wrote: » You're not aware of any misspelling and have no clue what the correct spelling is?! I'll give you a clue.....read the post you're replying to! Ok, so we've established the scenarios are different, good start. Can you think of a significant material difference between the scenarios you highlighted and the RHI inquiry? One which may have made it appropriate for Arleen Foster to step down, which didnt apply to your other scenarios? Anything at all?!
downcow wrote: » I see no reason why she should step down in response to an sf request. I am afraid the request holds no credibility as sf dropped that as a precondition to returning to government. Is there many examples of first ministers or priministers standing down for enquiries?
Fionn1952 wrote: » Any chance of answering the question, instead of substituting in your own and answering with a question?
downcow wrote: » Total nonsense. Did Martin Magennis step aside during the Bloody Sunday inquiring. Did Gerry Adams step aside during the Marie Cahill affair.
Stormont fell because Sinn Fein were not getting it all their own way. Should the dup have pulled it down because the orangemen at twadell could not return home.
How would it be looked upon if a party pulled out of a parliament anywhere in the world because they weren’t getting their way.
In a statement, Fitzgerald said that she would be stepping down with an immediate effect. She said she believed the decision was necessary “to avoid an unwelcome and potentially destabilising general election at this historically critical time”. “Throughout my career I have always sought to act with integrity and responsibility, and that is why I have decided on this occasion to put the national interest ahead of my own personal reputation,” she said. “I have always believed in fairness and equality and these principles have guided my work as Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, as Minister for Justice and Equality, and now as Minister for Business, Enterprise and Innovation.
