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Child Item

Memories of corporal punishment

realitykeeper

Recently I was thinking of my school days when corporal punishment was practiced. Even when I was not the recipient of this form of punishment but just a witness, it was very frightening - especially when the children were punished for things like poor homework or classwork (as opposed to behaving badly).

Paradoxically, I retain tremendous respect for one teacher who beat and terrified kids but got the job done. His frustration always came through when he was shouting at us and this made me aware of the need to study hard and focus.

I also remember the smell of freshly baked bread from the bakery of the way to school and to this day, I feel a sense of dread when I smell freshly baked bread.

Instances of corporal punishment were still common in the early eighties but not so much after that. Anyone else have, memories of corporal punishment, be they witnessed or experienced? If so, you might find it cathartic to share them (or not).

I do remember the various impliments used. A duster, a strong angular stick, a leather, a short rounded stick, a hand, a pencil. Scary stuff for a seven year old.

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Pintman Paddy Losty

There was one of my teachers in the late 70s that had a ferocious temper. He was gaeilgor and supporter of the cause.

One day I put a few tacks on his seat. He got an awful sting when he sat on the seat that day. Hahaha.

He was on the warpath to find out who did it. I told him after class that the slow lad delaney did it. He beat seven shades of blue out of him with a metre stick. I never heard howling like it. Went on for about 20 mins. Hahaha.

Some great stories from school.

Hector Savage

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

There was one of my teachers in the late 70s that had a ferocious temper. He was gaeilgor and supporter of the cause.

One day I put a few tacks on his seat. He got an awful sting when he sat on the seat that day. Hahaha.

He was on the warpath to find out who did it. I told him after class that the slow lad delaney did it. He beat seven shades of blue out of him with a metre stick. I never heard howling like it. Went on for about 20 mins. Hahaha.

Some great stories from school.

Jaysus Paddy!

Tell us more stories from school , seriously , start a thread in AH, I miss your posts.

Also hows the ladies been treating ye lately ?

EdgeCase

What I see when I look at Ireland of that era is a nation of very downtrodden underachievers, who often lacked confidence and we're very unsure of themselves.

You see a lot of older Irish people in the UK who were clearly brutalised by the system. They arrived with few skills, usually with a notion of getting away from the system - those I spoke to were ex-Magdaline laundries and industrial schools. You see it in the USA too where you'd have had older generations who arrived with relatively poor education compared to their US contemporaries. From the 50s on, it was unusual not to complete highschool. Whereas in Ireland it was very common not to until well into the 80s. You'll also see the US uber confident personality Vs the older Irish generations who were very deferential to authority or if they weren't they tended to engage with it oddly.

That's also why in the UK I think you see a massive culture gap between recent (since the 90s) arrivals and previous generations. They've often nothing in common other than a passport.

What went on here in schools and institutions in the 20th century wasn't education. I don't know what it was tbh.

It can't have done the country any good to have beaten every grain of creativity out of students. It seems to have been an old system that was maybe tracing is origins back to an era where it was preparing canon fodder for the British army and obedient worker drones to selflessly go down mines an so on. It was entirely about brutalising and disciplining people, not educating them.

It's no wonder Ireland's seen such rapid social and economic change over a compressed few decades - the tools of oppression were quietly decommissioned. It's a very different place really.

empacher

My brothers knuckles were broken my the narrow length of the metre stick. I stood up clocked him and knocked him to the floor. That ended our education, it was also a few years before our parents spook to us because of the 'embarassment'of hitting a priest. We got jobs on trawlers the next day.

GrumpyMe

I am still conflicted about the schadenfreude I felt upon hearing about a "Christian Brother" contact(sic) from 57 years ago who was suffering from thanatophobia as he lived out his final years in a nursing home.

Bigbagofcans

One of my earliest memories of school was getting wacked on the hand with a ruler by my teacher. I was only 4 at the time and this was in the mid-nineties!

John DoeReMi

I'm 54 and went to a Christian Brothers school in Dublin. No shortage of corporal punishment there. I was reasonably good in school so avoided the worst excesses but I did get the odd whack of a ruler across the tips of my fingers.

The worst was one particular Brother who was an absolute scumb*g, he used to batter some of the slower kids from one side of the room to the other. I have absolutely no doubt that some of those unfortunates are now probably abusers of their own kids or partners or have alcohol/drug problems. There were rumours at the time of him molesting kids and it came as no surprise to me years later to discover that he went down for ten years for molesting kids in another school.

An earlier poster was talking about getting hammered for being left handed which I'd heard about. I'm left handed as well although thankfully nobody gave a toss about that in my school.

ohnonotgmail

I still remember the sting that Archie left on my fingertips. Archie being the name of the piece of broom handle the teacher used to hit us with.

Hector Savage

I went to primary school from 1984-1991, we used to be hit a bit in the 1st few years ...but died out after that.

Tacitus Kilgore

It's no wonder so many people are 'fcuked up', (for want of a better phrase). Reading this thread is brutal, some of you were essentially straight-up tortured

Even in the 90s we were on the receiving end of the slap & battered with endless catholic dogma.

But by gum is it brilliantly different now - Nothing but positivity in schools, kids are treated as equal human beings and not being beaten and bullied senseless by those who are supposed to nurture them.

The current generation of primary school kids will be the ones who save the world I reckon.

pawdee

I was beaten at all four primary schools I attended starting in 1973. I've been punched, slapped, caned (regularly with a bamboo stick and a few times with what appeared to be a piece of a chair). In secondary school I was punched square in the jaw by a crazy science teacher and almost knocked out cold. I was about 4ft tall at the time and it was post 1982 (so therefore illegal). The verbal abuse was another story. Probably more damaging in the long run. What a bunch of animals.

fryup

Hector Savage wrote: »

I went to primary school from 1984-1991, we used to be hit a bit in the 1st few years ...but died out after that.

wasn't it out-lawed by that stage?

ohnonotgmail

fryup wrote: »

wasn't it out-lawed by that stage?

It ended in 82 i think. Or maybe it was 81. I definitely remember it ending and having to do lines instead of getting a slap. I infinitely prefered the slap.

[Deleted User]

We had 'The Biffer'. A leather strap which came in two sizes, the big one and small one! Applied to the hand at least twice, depending on the severity of the punishment. Of course, that was the official method. Other teachers had flying wooden dusters, slaps to the face etc. A teacher threw me up against the wall once, because I had left my homework in another classroom. He was an unstable individual, I now see he is the principle of a collage in the UK!

.......

We were regularly beaten with the metre stick, dusters, open handed slaps.

But the worst single occasion I remember still haunts me now. I genuinely cannot remember my transgression, perhaps I was talking in class - I dont think it was to do with schoolwork.

But whatever it was, I was sent to the office. The head nun took me by the arm and began to beat me on the backside with her hand. The sudden viciousness and violence frightened the life out of me and I simultaneously began to bawl screaming and crying and wet myself - I was about 5 or 6 years old at the time. The nuns hand (and the floor) got splashed with my urine and she became truly incandescent with rage. She beat me all the harder, roared at me for being a filthy child.

When the beating was over I was sent to sit on a wooden chair and await my mother to collect me. I dont know how they sent home for my mother, I dont think we had a telephone in those days, perhaps they phoned a neighbour.

Anyway, she arrived, and this was the worst part - she apologised to the demon in a habit that had just violently assaulted her child. And the nun suggested I get further punished when I went home. We left, with my mother behaving in a servile manner with that woman - when she should have punched her goddam lights out.

Vicious evil bitches those nuns were.

Shortly afterwards corporal punishment was abolished in schools, but by then we had moved house and I was in a non religious orders school where no one was getting beaten (in my class anyway), but I remained in terrible dread of school for years, Sunday evening mass would fill me with dread.

valoren

Would be great to read stories where after getting clattered by a teacher, said teacher runs into one of their ex-pupils, and get's a hiding. There is something very pleasing in the schadenfreude of a cnut getting their just deserts.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Late 70's/early 80's - The headmaster in my primary school was a vicious old bastard. He used every opportunity to beat children and done so on a regular basis. I remember once being called into his classroom after lunch, I was about 9 or 10 and he told me that he had called me earlier and I didn't answer (I genuinely didn't hear or know that he called me) I told him I never heard him and he told me I was a liar. He then took out his piece of 2x4 and made me put out both hands and whacked me as hard as he could 4 or 5 times on each hand. My right hand started bleeding as he had hit me so hard. Later than evening my hand was aching and I wasn't able to write so I was beaten a further 3 more times on my left hand only for that. When I heard he died in the late 90's from heart failure, I was genuinely glad. He was a vicious bad tempered tyrant and I hope his death was painful.

I remember other teachers using a wooden ruler to slap children on the palms of the hands, it was more stinging than sore but was a regular occurrence however if you were very bold (or not and the teacher just believed you were) you were sent to the headmaster and he battered you with his 2x4 (which was originally a sword that a boy who happened to the son of one of the other teachers and it was confiscated and became the punishment tool)

That was over 40 years ago yet I still get angry when I think of that old bastard beating children like it was fun.

pawdee wrote: »

I was beaten at all four primary schools I attended starting in 1973. I've been punched, slapped, caned (regularly with a bamboo stick and a few times with what appeared to be a piece of a chair). In secondary school I was punched square in the jaw by a crazy science teacher and almost knocked out cold. I was about 4ft tall at the time and it was post 1982 (so therefore illegal). The verbal abuse was another story. Probably more damaging in the long run. What a bunch of animals.

Was your science teachers initials JF?? We had a crazed science teacher too,he'd absolutely loose it and drag boys over desks, punching and beating them for mispronouncing a word or answering back when asked a question. He'd then revert to calm and quiet almost instantaneously and act like nothing had happened. He was suspended a few times for it, once for breaking a boys arm. Thankfully I was never on the receiving end of his abuse.

.......

valoren wrote: »

Would be great to read stories where after getting clattered by a teacher, said teacher runs into one of their ex-pupils, and get's a hiding. There is something very pleasing in the schadenfreude of a cnut getting their just deserts.

Id like to have sued the bitch that beat me that day but they were protected when corporal punishment was made illegal by being made exempt from civil cases or prosecution for their crimes.

Borderfox

Metre sticks, drum sticks, leathers, canes, umbrellas, fists, feet and generally anything that came to hand was used. I got the leather everyday in 4th class because I had an accident and broke my left wrist so couldn't write. Everyday until the cast came off, another teacher hit me with his fist in the side for talking in class that I had a huge bruise on my side for weeks. We were children at that stage, all in primary

retro:electro

It was illegal by the time I attended school, but it didn’t stop the cruelty and brutality, it just manifested in more psychological terms. I was taught by the same nuns who once had free reign to slap and abuse, so no doubt they struggled with the lack of control and thus were sadistic in other means. Not letting you go to the toilet (many of us had accidents) making you stand up and read aloud over and over and over until you read a passage without stumbling, if any of us scratched our heads we’d be made fun of for having nits, and god help you if you were from a broken home, you were the target of ridicule and abuse and derogatory comments about your home life. If you didn’t know the weekend sermon from mass on a Monday morning, you were the chosen target for the day. I’ve memories of walking to school with girls who had been to mass and desperately trying to gather what the sermon was about, for fear I would be asked.
Although it was outlawed, there was still the odd slap, but they usually were saved for the more deprived children whose parents probably didn’t give a fcuk and wouldn’t have issue with it. One girl in my class was hard of hearing and didn’t put her pencil down when told to and she got a slap right across her face. The red mark was still there hours later walking home from school.
Although they gave me a good primary education, being taught solely by nuns was suffocating and it was only when I went to secondary school I felt I could breathe and relax, and I didn’t have this fear of needing to know something or else be ridiculed.

Schools today aren’t perfect but it’s nice to see kids running into school happy and laughing, a far cry from thirty, forty years ago when my mother used to walk to school with the fear of god inside her. It’s just mad to think what they got away with, I’m not sure you’d ever get over it. I feel sorry for those who had this as a pattern in their schooling on the regular, especially those who struggled with learning; as they got the worst of it.

gozunda

retro:electro wrote: »

It was illegal by the time I attended school, but it didn’t stop the cruelty and brutality, it just manifested in more psychological terms....

If for some reasons you believe that corporal punishment only happened in the absence of psyological cruelty and brutality then you couldn't be more wrong. Both existed side by side and were never challenged as they were part and parcel of the status quo. Not surprising that the same individuals in schools carried over an acceptance and continuation of this behaviour into later years.

storker

Tow wrote: »

We had 'The Biffer'. A leather strap which came in two sizes, the big one and small one! Applied to the hand at least twice, depending on the severity of the punishment.

We had that in my school, but we called it "the blackjack". Actually several layers of leather stitched together. I saw the toughest guys in the class reduced to tears after having that applied to an open palm at high speed.

In secondary school the head brother used to go around with a big bunch of the school keys on a key ring, and thought nothing of applying them to someone's knuckles.

Then was the everyday stuff that didn't even qualify as "punishment" e.g. being encouraged to be faster at opening the right page by means of repeated punches to the upper arm.

Funny thing though, school discipline. Some teachers had it without ever resorting to violence. And I remember one who I'm sure never shouted or gave detention or hit anyone or even sent them to the principals office. And yet nobody messed in his class. (He had a funny habit of of repeatedly pacing a few steps forward...then back...then forward, etc while addressing the class jingling the keys and change in his pockets at the same time, the effect of which was to make it look as if he was always bursting for a pee.)

retro:electro

gozunda wrote: »

If for some reasons you believe that corporal punishment only happened in the absence of psyological cruelty and brutality then you couldn't be more wrong. Both existed side by side and were never challenged as they were part and parcel of the status quo. Not surprising that the same individuals in schools carried over an acceptance and continuation of this behaviour into later years.

Yeah I never said that.

Mint Sauce

Corporal Punishment had been done away with a few years before I started school. However looking back, you could see that some of the older teachers were frustrated that it was no longer an option, and found it difficult to control students, and the students knew it too.

Some incidents included board rubbers being fired across rooms, desk lids being closed down on hands/fingers, one student being chased around the room lifted up by the scruff of his neck, and one actually hitting a Nun, and telling her you cant hit me back!

SlowBlowin

gozunda wrote: »

If for some reasons you believe that corporal punishment only happened in the absence of psyological cruelty and brutality then you couldn't be more wrong. Both existed side by side and were never challenged as they were part and parcel of the status quo. Not surprising that the same individuals in schools carried over an acceptance and continuation of this behaviour into later years.

Offended again, how does more = only, pretty much the opposite meaning ?

[Deleted User]

Raps on the knuckles with Rulers, boxes in the head from certain teacher's, put kneeling in a corner of a room for 110 mins with my nose in the corner, teachers calling around to friends mothers who were separated with bottles of vodka after school hours, all sorts of stuff I could go on...

Pinches twisted into my skin, choked, slaps across the face, and of course actual fist fights!

I remember a school trip to Connemara where some lads were battered by drunken teachers which was way worse to the point of having to apologize to parents

Christian brothers schools were the antithesis of craic for the most part, and most of this was after the ban!

road_high

Corporal punishment was well gone before my time in primary school but that didn’t stop one cow subtly using it regularly, especially on weaker kids. 25 years ago and it’s still clear as day in head and can still hear her screeching voice and facial expressions. She never hit me but used use psychological methods instead- can distinctly remember her exclaiming “you’d think butter wouldn’t melt in his mouth...”I think in reference to some mistake I may have done or said! A fairly cutting remark to say to a ten year old!
Her physical methods onto other kids were flicking their knuckles with a pen or light smack across the back of the head- she’d be arrested if it was now. That was only 92-94 years so not ancient history.

In fairness nothing compared to what went on in my das time. You’d actually feel a little emotional hearing the abuse kids suffered for nothing back then. Thank god teachers are so much better trained now and we do live in a time where’s there’s compassion and some understanding for children.

ollkiller

Never had any corporal punishment in primary but then entered a Christian Brothers secondary school in the 90's in Mayo. A vicious den of punishment. Canes, branches, fists, kicks, dusters, the lot was used basically.

One teacher was a champion boxer in his day. Regularly clocked children in class. Knocked one lad unconscious and left him there till the end of class. Wasn't a day in his class without someone getting hit. Music teacher had a branch to beat people up with. Got a new branch every year.
Science teacher broke a lads front tooth in half by hitting him across the back of the head and his tooth banged off the marble science table. Same teacher broke two ribs of another guy by kicking him into the radiator for a few minutes.

About half the teachers would give out physical punishment of some kind. I fortunately was lucky that i only got beat up once. On my second day in secondary school the christian brother science teacher beat up 28 lads out of 31 lads at half nine in the morning because we were talking and he had a massive hangover. Went round the class one by one and 5 or 6 roundhouse slaps across the back of the head. The three he didn't beat up were sons of Gardai. I got the required 5 slaps but he cut me across my eye. Went home that evening and the ould lady asked where did i get the cut. Regaled the story, next morning the ould lad went into the science teachers class, put him up against the wall and he got the message i was not to be touched. The ould lad then went to the principals office and plainly said if i was ever hit he would take out retribution on the principal. For the next 6 years not one teacher touched me and i am eternally grateful to the ould lad for that.

Suffice to say the day i finished secondary school was one of the best days of my life. A horrible experience.

road_high

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

It's no wonder so many people are 'fcuked up', (for want of a better phrase). Reading this thread is brutal, some of you were essentially straight-up tortured

Even in the 90s we were on the receiving end of the slap & battered with endless catholic dogma.

But by gum is it brilliantly different now - Nothing but positivity in schools, kids are treated as equal human beings and not being beaten and bullied senseless by those who are supposed to nurture them.

The current generation of primary school kids will be the ones who save the world I reckon.

There’s many of us well under 40 that can vividly remember elements of corporal punishment still going on, well into the 90s.
I was good in school, but I hated it in many ways. The atmosphere was always on edge with one teacher in particular and I had her for 3 years.
Even up to that time, parents wouldn’t come in and question teachers though my own mother, fair play to her, did a few times when my brother was wronged completely. Now there’d be uproar and having gone through it, rightly so. Kids need discipline for sure but not smacks across the back of the head because they can’t do long division.

.......

My father was brutalised at the hands of the christian brothers himself.

He had the unfortunate luck to be left handed, so he was beaten daily until he wrote with his right hand. Then in a particularly bad beating a brother broke his right wrist, so when it healed he had to relearn to write with that hand again.

He remained a right handed writer but left handed for all else his whole life. He also had an abhorrance of physical punishment.

Strangely himself and my mother chose to send us kids to religious orders schools where we were also subjected to violence. I could never understand why my parents sent us there. My mother said later that it was considered the best education so they thought they were doing the best for us.

In my brothers school one particular brother used to get the kids to stand on a stool to reach the blackboard and do out the homework sums from the previous night on the blackboard. If the kid got anything wrong yer man would whack the stool out from under him with a hurley and let the poor kid hit the wooden floor. Just vicious bastards - should never have been allowed near children.