ittakestwo wrote: » But this whole thread is basically that. Nobody knows if a accusation is true or not unless a person actually witnesses it. But the OP is asking people who they would believe... probably asking them what their intuition is from thier experience. I agree tho. On such a serious matter it does not seem right to speculate
Defunkd wrote: » I was not replying to the OP and neither were you.
ittakestwo wrote: » The point is that this thread is a speculative thread, do you agree or not? Earlier I said I had no idea of the statistics of false accusations convictions to the amount of actual rape convictions but speculated it was very low. Then you said well then your opinion is not worth much.... but nobody's opinion is therefore worth anything on this thread as nobody has an idea of those statistics .... unless you do?? This thread is a speculative thread... you can tell that by its title.
Defunkd wrote: » The two cases i posted about aren't speculation, they are factual and this is the only thread relating to false rape accusations. You introduce the ratio aspect; admit you don't know it (if only there were some way to search for such information *wink) and then say that speculation is okay. I can't argue against that line of thinking!
ittakestwo wrote: » The thread title is ''False rape accusation...who would you believe?'' That is a speculative question. The number of convictions for rape compared to the number of convictions of a false allegation of rape would give an indication of the percentage of rape accusations that are made up. I would guess its low and nobody here has statistics on it. You have trawled the internet and have found two cases of a false rape accusation in a different jurisdiction which again suggest a false rape accusations as being uncommon as presumably you would be referencing false rape convictions in Ireland to push your agenda.
The man was never arrested but was interviewed by gardaí during an extensive investigation. He had not been in the city that night and recovery of large amount of CCTV disproved the allegation.
Now, we can be quite certain if a woman had been so gravely wronged by the State in some matter relating to sexual crime, that the feminist sirens, media and quangos alike, would have been howling in anger, and demanding enquiries and heads. But in the aftermath of this case, nothing: the sirens remained as quiet as a mountain lake. For the victim is a man, so really, the injustice done to him really doesn't count. Not in 1997, not today, and no doubt, not in 2019 either.
A survey tracing the trajectory from complaint to conviction in rape cases turned up an unexpectedly timely statistic last week. Just a day after Michael Feichin Hannon had a 10-year-old conviction for sexual assault quashed, after his supposed victim admitted she'd made the whole thing up, the study of attrition in rape cases found we had the highest rate of false allegations of all the European countries studied. Some 100 reported rapes in each of 11 different countries were examined. As well as having the highest rate of false complaints, at 9%, we also had one of the lowest rates of convictions for reported rapes, at just 8%, compared with 34% in Hungary. Paul O'Mahony, a criminologist in Trinity College Dublin, said attrition in sexual violence cases is a serious problem across Europe and suggested that the main obstacle to more successful convictions in this country may be "under-prosecution". There is, of course, another possible reason why just eight of the 100 men accused in these Irish cases were convicted. Hard though it is to believe, there has to be the chance that some of the other 92 were innocent. Since the survey seems to take separate account of cases that failed for lack of evidence, or because the main witness withdrew her testimony, these are not counted as "false allegations". There's an implied presumption, in other words, that the men implicated were guilty and would have been bang to rights if only the victim had held her nerve or the forensics were a bit stronger. With some more robust "over-prosecution", then, the weaknesses of the forensic case could have been overcome and a conviction achieved solely on the word of the victim. Which is exactly what happened to Michael Feichin Hannon.
For some reason, an unusually high number of Irish women are prepared to report rapes that never happened. To find that reason we might have to look at another statistic thrown up by the EU Daphne II project, some 88% of Irish men and 84% of women in rape cases had alcohol in their system. In Portugal, just 15% of victims been drinking. A few years ago, the sexual-assault clinic in the Rotunda Hospital reported a worrying number of young women were presenting themselves on a Monday morning with no recollection of what they'd done the previous night. They couldn't remember having sex, let alone the trauma of a rape, but they couldn't be sure. In fact, many were found not to have engaged in any sexual activity the night before. Yet the fact that they attended a "sexual assault" clinic suggests they were perfectly prepared to make a criminal allegation, if it turned out they had indeed had sex. They were not prepared to let a little thing like the fact that they had no recollection of any crime, no attendant distress and no physical injury deter their pursuit of the belief that they had been assaulted. If the clinic hadn't been able to clear up their drunken suspicions, there's every chance they would have made an allegation against an innocent, if equally drunken, man that put him at risk of a life sentence and, at best, a tainted reputation.
Hannon was found guilty, even though he had no previous convictions and there was no forensic evidence against him. His job, his good name, his family's standing in the Galway community where they'd lived for generations were all sacrificed to a lack of scepticism about the curiously precocious evidence of a 10-year-old girl. Nobody doubts that "under prosecution" of rape, fear and intimidation of victims and forensic shortcomings have all left rapists on the loose. But "over-prosecution" flies in the face of one of the central tenets of our legal system, which is that it is better that 100 guilty men go free than one innocent man be prosecuted in zealous error. Unless, of course, political correctness decrees that this protection doesn't extend to men accused of rape.
Defunkd wrote: » More tragic case...https://metro.co.uk/2016/07/29/mother-of-teen-who-hanged-himself-over-false-rape-allegations-commits-suicide-6037994/amp/ Teenage boy (17) falsely accused of rape* never got over the trauma of it and committed suicide. His mother, went into a downward spiral, and killed herself around his first anniversary. Even used the same rope.
ittakestwo wrote: » Men are more likely to be raped than be falsely accused of rape.https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-men-are-more-likely-to-be-raped-than-be-falsely-accused-of-rape
py2006 wrote: » In prison, yes. I don't have evidence to back this up but I firmly believe there is a HELL of a lot more false rape accusations out there and a hell of lot of innocent men in jail today and most definitely in the past.
Defunkd wrote: » Feel free to start another thread and post the incidences of men raping men all you want but this thread is about false rape accusations. I cheerfully withdraw that comment if it is considered backseat-modding by a mod.
ittakestwo wrote: » No the thead is about who you would believe. The piont that you are more likely to know a man that has been raped than been falsely accused of rape gives a great indication of just how rare a false accusation is..... And I know you are trying to claim otherwise by linking every case of false rape throughout the world. A person reading this thread might actually think to be falsely accused of rape is a common occurence which it isn't. Extreamly rare in fact.
Defunkd wrote: » Judge Kavanaugh, Jackson/Olding, those 2 Kerry women convicted last year and all the other recent cases that are being posted...rare indeed.
ittakestwo wrote: » Yeah extreamly rare. You could find 2 convictions of a false rape accusation in this jurisdiction ... is that all??? You know Ireland has 4.8 million people.
Defunkd wrote: » Well, i've only started posting in the last few days and there is a person distracting me... and i have a life beyond this site. But have patience, there is more to come. Would you like to share any thoughts on the cases presented so far? If not, our interaction on this thread is finished.
py2006 wrote: » The number of people brought to trial and convicted may be low but that does not mean the amount of false accusers out there is the same.
The Dún Laoghaire TD said there is “good work” happening in some third-level institutions in relation sexual harassment and violence and that “minimum standards” will be put in place. An expert group, established last October, is due to make recommendations on the issue in the coming weeks. “We certainly need to do something, it is a reality that there is sexual harassment and violence on our campuses and we have the numbers,” she said. “For example when I did visit the sexual assault trauma unit here in Dublin, what was reported to me that just under 40 per cent of people presenting at that sexual assault trauma unit were students.”
LIVING IN FANTASY Fantasist, 27, jailed for 10 years for falsely accusing 15 men of rape and sexual assault loses appeal against conviction Jemma Beale's string of bogus claims resulted in one of the accused spending seven years behind bars
